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  • Russian tank camoflage painting

    Hello:

    Anybody know of any good photos or drawings that show example of how russian tanks, trucks, etc. were painted for camoflage.

    I know the base colour was green but they are references to tanks also being painted as:

    -green with white camo covering 80% of tank.
    and
    -green with dark brown camo covering 50% of vehicle.

    thanks, Dan

  • #2
    Originally posted by dsenebrecht View Post
    Hello:

    Anybody know of any good photos or drawings that show example of how russian tanks, trucks, etc. were painted for camoflage.

    I know the base colour was green but they are references to tanks also being painted as:

    -green with white camo covering 80% of tank.
    and
    -green with dark brown camo covering 50% of vehicle.

    thanks, Dan
    Check my
    http://rkkaww2.armchairgeneral.com/galleries.htm
    section.
    You;ll find plenty of different color schemes of paintings..
    What else can I say...

    Regards
    Alex
    If you fire a rifle at the past, the future will fire a cannon at you.....

    Comment


    • #3
      There was a book published in Russia some years ago on Camouflage of Red Army Tanks. It was available in both Russian and English, as I remember, but may not be available any more in either language. My copy is packed away in storage, so if anyone has a citation for it, please post it.
      I remember from long-ago reading that there was a pre-war camouflage pattern of green and black or darker green and brown, and that during the war (in late 1943-1944) the 4th Tank Army was the largest unit/command that had a 'standard' camouflage pattern it applied to all of its armored vehicles, using a three-color pattern of tan, green, and brown. I was very surprised when I first saw it, because it looked very similar to the three-color camouflage we were using on US Army vehicles in Germany in the 1970s and 1980s!

      Comment


      • #4
        Well I have a good book on Soviet armor that shows different types of Camouflage.

        The new book, Soviet Tank Units by David Porter. Pub by Amber books ISBN: 978-1-906626-31-0 This is a very good reference, at $17.05 via Amazon.com.

        Comment


        • #5
          Dann Falk:

          can you post some of the pics from your book or describe them?

          thanks

          Comment


          • #6
            The book Charles refers to is titled:

            Камуфляж танков Красной армии 1930-1945
            М.Коломиец, И.Мощанский
            Армада-вертикаль №5 (1997)

            Kamuflazh tankov Krasnoi armii 1930-1945
            Maksim Kolomiets and Ilya Moshchanskii
            Armada-vertical #5

            It has since appeared in editions from Eksprint (2003 and 2005) and Tseigaus (2007) and is still available from booksellers in Moscow. It is reported that an English translation by Cookie Sewell circulated after the book first appeared, but I have never seen it.

            Another book appeared in 2004, titled similarly: Kamuflazh tankov RKKA 1920-1941, a special edition by Voennaya letopis'. It was written by a consortium which included Ilya Moshchanskii, Aleksei Aksenov, Dmitrii Shitkin, and others I am not familiar with. It covers the much same material in greater depth, but does not extend into wartime camouflage.

            In 2006 a lengthy article appeared in Tankomaster magazine, written by L.Rybkin and covering the period from Barbarossa to the end of 1941. It is also well worth obtaining, and has many photos of vehicles from the first days of the war.

            Cheers
            Scott Fraser
            Last edited by amvas; 14 Jan 11, 01:31.
            Ignorance is not the lack of knowledge. It is the refusal to learn.

            A contentedly cantankerous old fart

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by amvas View Post
              Check my
              http://rkkaww2.armchairgeneral.com/galleries.htm
              section.
              You;ll find plenty of different color schemes of paintings..
              What else can I say...

              Regards
              Alex
              There is also the Engines of the Red Army: http://www.o5m6.de/ Oliver has some very nice drawings, and works from photographs.

              Cheers
              Scott Fraser
              Ignorance is not the lack of knowledge. It is the refusal to learn.

              A contentedly cantankerous old fart

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Scott Fraser View Post
                The book Charles refers to is titled:

                Камуфляж танков Красной армии 1930-1945
                М.Колоимец, И.Мощанский
                Армада-вертикал №5 (1997)

                Kamuflazh tankov Krasnoi armii 1930-1945
                Maksim Kolomiets and Ilya Moshchanskii
                Armada-vertical #5

                It has since appeared in editions from Eksprint (2003 and 2005) and Tseigaus (2007) and is still available from booksellers in Moscow. It is reported that an English translation by Cookie Sewell circulated after the book first appeared, but I have never seen it.

                Another book appeared in 2004, titled similarly: Kamuflazh tankov RKKA 1920-1941, a special edition by Voennaya letopis'. It was written by a consortium which included Ilya Moshchanskii, Aleksei Aksenov, Dmitrii Shitkin, and others I am not familiar with. It covers the much same material in greater depth, but does not extend into wartime camouflage.

                In 2006 a lengthy article appeared in Tankomaster magazine, written by L.Rybkin and covering the period from Barbarossa to the end of 1941. It is also well worth obtaining, and has many photos of vehicles from the first days of the war.

                Cheers
                Scott Fraser
                Seems one of rare attempts to investigate this topic.
                But for me those books are far from ideal.
                I think I have both books and also some Tankomaster issues.

                Regards
                Alex
                If you fire a rifle at the past, the future will fire a cannon at you.....

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by amvas View Post
                  Seems one of rare attempts to investigate this topic. But for me those books are far from ideal...
                  They are probably as good as we will get. Between them, there is what is needed, complete to chemical makeup and formulation of the paints. There are also enough photos to get a feel for how it appeared, although of course one can never have enough photos.

                  The main problem, I think, is that there isn't that much to write about, at least in regards to camouflage. Tanks and other vehicles were delivered in 4BO Protective Green throughout the war, and painted with temporary white paint for the winter. There were exceptions, where local commanders implemented camouflage. That's starting backwards, but that's really all there is to say except to point out variations.

                  I say backwards because there was a formal camouflage scheme in place at the time of Barbarossa. After the Germans invaded Poland and France, and following on the experience in Spain, a plan was introduced early in 1940 where tanks, armoured cars, tractors and draisines were to be camouflaged in different combinations of colours depending on which region they were in. This plan existed largely on paper, because only two of the additional colours were manufactured, and these were sent only to certain Military Districts, particularly in the west and around Kiev.

                  The two colours were 6K Dark Brown and 7K Yellow-earth. The green was to be the base, and remain to cover 45% to 55% of the tank. The other two colours were to be applied in random vertically-oriented bands, each to cover between 25% and 30% of the tank. This camouflage can be seen in numerous photos, and the interpretation of the order seems to be at the discretion of the painter. Tanks and other vehicles were not as commonly camouflaged as the trains. The scheme was abandoned with the German invasion in 1941, although a series of several hundred T-34s was delivered from STZ in March 1942 in green and brown camouflage.

                  Winter camouflage was also described in the order. Various temporary paints were used, either applied randomly to break up the outline of the vehicle, or as an overall whitewash. Tanks and BAs of the 1st Guards Tank Brigade, around Moscow, had green bands left that were painted in a cross-hatched pattern of fine white lines, allegedly to mimic cobblestones from the air. This camouflage was not seen after the first winter.

                  More photos are good. The vehicles are almost always green, but once in a while there is an interesting one.

                  Cheers
                  Scott Fraser
                  Ignorance is not the lack of knowledge. It is the refusal to learn.

                  A contentedly cantankerous old fart

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    A common view seems to be that he Russian did not bother to camouflage their tanks as it was too time consuming and needed unnecessary resources. Besides one of the myths IIRC is that it was too hard to control the crews from consuming the color dilution used to mix new paint with during field conditions, it was fully turned over to the factories.The Russian war industry was very economic and efficient so they avoided lot of costs producing unnecessary paint as the vehicles already was based green, a chalk white wash during the winter or an autumn/spring mud application was all that was needed to make them blend in. During summer months the tracked vehicles generally produced so much dust they almost turned sand colored which produced a natural cammo.
                    Late in war apparently some units started to use captured paint from occupied areas but again this was seldom, the most famous is the triple colored used on the ISU152 and IS-2's at the Lvov battle. I think that in total only about 3% of the vehicles received some sort of Cammo paint more then green.
                    However I have recently noticed that several AA and lend/lease reconnaissance vehicles in 1944/45 seemed to get some dark shapes probably in black or very dark green sprayed over their base green.

                    What paint was spent on however was turret aerial identification symbols. These painted on the top of the tanks roof probably around mid war (yellow, red, green, white was popular). Sadly very few of these can be seen on pictures as most photos are shot from the side.
                    Later it seems that colored blankets is more frequent covering the engine deck to ease up the crews ability to select when to be seen from air and when not want to be seen.
                    /Pappy
                    Last edited by Pappy; 31 Jan 11, 10:08.
                    "Charley Dont´t Surf."

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Thank you Pappy. I'll probably stay with the green for most of my tanks except for the lead lease tanks which I'll paint in US army olive drab or British bronze green.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Russians didn't neglected camouflage,but used more natural sources to hide equipment.



                        http://www.lonesentry.com/articles/t...amouflage.html

                        It is maybe bit out of topic,but I have no time now to write a longer post
                        It is always more difficult to fight against faith than against knowledge.

                        Косово је Србија!
                        Never go to war with a country whose national holiday celebrates a defeat in 1389.

                        Armored Brigade

                        Armored Brigade Facebook page

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by nikolas93TS View Post
                          Russians didn't neglected camouflage,but used more natural sources to hide equipment.



                          http://www.lonesentry.com/articles/t...amouflage.html

                          It is maybe bit out of topic,but I have no time now to write a longer post

                          Then there was this


                          Last edited by Erkki; 31 Jan 11, 13:24.
                          “For there is nothing more serious than a lunatic when he comes to the central point of his lunacy.”

                          Max Sterner

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Exactly. They were very adept at camouflage, but didn't rely on paint, except in winter.

                            Cheers
                            Scott Fraser
                            Ignorance is not the lack of knowledge. It is the refusal to learn.

                            A contentedly cantankerous old fart

                            Comment

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