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  • #76
    some visual aids
    Attached Files

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    • #77
      Originally posted by Käki
      Any movies from the finnish front? The Unknown Soldier(1955) was banned in Russia until couple of years ago.
      "Coo-Coo" movie of 2003 but it is more comedy that military movie.


      In 1941-44 Finnish front was quiet part of front and I do not remember any movie about actions here.

      Comment


      • #78
        Originally posted by Andrey
        You speak for Western public that subtitles are bad, you are scaring them.

        You have to understand consequances of your words.

        And I do not understand why don't Western movie producers replave foreign voice by English voice.



        When did you leave Russia? Russia of 1997 is different country thn Russia of 2004.

        "Night watch" is national hit in Russia, cinemas got millions of dollars for it. It is common opinion in Russia that it is best movie of last time with technical quality not less than "Master of Ring".

        My brother's friend came to us together with his wife for watching this movie in my PC. His wife (25 years) was in small town for some last months and she said that ALL girls of that town dreamed of to look this movie because that town has no modern cinema and this movie was not played in that town.
        Give some credit to western public will you. It is not that easily scared. Even more so people who watch foreign movies are well aware of the problem and there are some purists who even prefer to be this way. Das Boot for instance was selling in two versions – German with subtitles and English-dubbed. German version as far as I recall was selling better, and considerably so. I believe it was the same story with “No man’s land”. As for me I has not left Russia and have no plans to do so. My job requires me to stay abroad –often for several months at the time. Nothing is wrong with that. I saw “Night watch” - the book is better or and btw it is “Lord of the rings”. I am sure that many people like it, but still I would be hesitant to speak on behalf of 180 million people.

        Comment


        • #79
          Originally posted by Oleg Grigoryev
          I believe it was the same story with “No man’s land”.
          “No man’s land” - I do not understand what you mean here, I do not know this movie.

          I am sure that many people like it, but still I would be hesitant to speak on behalf of 180 million people.
          OK, let it will be not 180 millions but "only" 179 millions.

          Is it OK for you? I personally do not see large difference.

          And it was not question to compare movie and original book, it was question only about movie. But you again could say ("umudrit'sya" in Russian, fershtein?) bad words about movie ("book was better") when you didn't want to do it.

          I also can say that in case of "Lord of the ring" book was much better but movie got many "Oscars".

          And I again repeat that it looks like that version of "72 meters"
          which you saw could be made in conditions of haste. May be, movie director knew that his movie will be shown in US only for one week before this event and all his team didn't sleep one week for making of any English text.

          I do not believe that director could persuade Ennio Morricone to make music for his movie bu he couldn't organize quality translation of his movie in English.

          Comment


          • #80
            First thing first – “No man’s land” - http://movies.yahoo.com/shop?id=1807485009&d=hv&cf=info –watched it in Serbian with English subtitles. Did not really need the later since it was for me understand 80% of the dialog as it was.

            OK, let it will be not 180 millions but "only" 179 millions.

            Is it OK for you? I personally do not see large difference.
            I see because it was not 179 million it probably was not even 150 or 100 million. It’ might have been 50 million majority of whom might have liked it. That said what is with that defensive posture of yours?

            And it was not question to compare movie and original book, it was question only about movie. But you again could say ("umudrit'sya" in Russian, fershtein?) bad words about movie ("book was better") when you didn't want to do it.

            I also can say that in case of "Lord of the ring" book was much better but movie got many "Oscars".
            Why is what I said was bad? I said the book was better – meaning the movie was good but book was better. I am entitled to my opinion aren’t I? The book was very philosophical, the move turned out to be Sci-Fi horror-action – a good one nonetheless. And yes I now many , shall we say purists, who were not too fond of “Lord of the Rings” because it did not show many crucial elements of the (as far as they are concerned anyway – I never read the trilogy) story, thus transforming into separate entity. My personal observation is that 99% of the movies that based on the books are not as good as the books themselves –the only one I can think of that was practically as good was “Sobachie serdce”. That does not mean that they are bad movies.

            May be, movie director knew that his movie will be shown in US only for one week before this event and all his team didn't sleep one week for making of any English text.
            I have serious doubts that his team was responsible for subtitles –usually this is done by the 3rd party. That said why do I get a feeling that you believe that I blame film crew for anything? I said it twice already - in itself it is a good movie.

            I do not believe that director could persuade Ennio Morricone to make music for his movie bu he couldn't organize quality translation of his movie in English.
            You should be really more trustful towards fellow board members - as a bilingual person I solemnly swear that subtitles I saw were sub par. For instance the cow story over which Russian part of the audience was practically crying from laughter, left English-speaking audience flabbergasted. I had to explain after the movie all the intricacies –then they found it hysterical too. So to sum it up, the movie in itself is good, the subtitles I saw were so-so, I hope that DVD has better version, I recommend this movie.

            Comment


            • #81
              Russian war movies

              I have only seen two Russian war movies, and both were excellent!!

              Both directed by Sergei Eisenstein:

              Ivan the Terrible
              Battleship Potemkin
              Mens Est Clavis Victoriae
              (The Mind Is The Key To Victory)

              Comment


              • #82
                Originally posted by hogdriver
                I have only seen two Russian war movies, and both were excellent!!

                Both directed by Sergei Eisenstein:

                Ivan the Terrible
                Battleship Potemkin
                It is not military movies.

                And these movies were made in Stalin's time.

                And I wonder for you, Westerners.

                I gave you links on BEST Soviet military movies about WWII. (Amvas confirmed it).

                Price of most of them is 10-30$. Most part of these movies are translated in English. You can pay this money and will get this movie after 24 Hours.

                I do not believe that their ptrice is too high for you. I am Russian, I got 200$ per month and I can to buy movie for 10$ if I very want to see it.

                I do not know but I suppose that price of ticket in US cinema is not too less.

                It is so easy - pay some money and look BEST Soviet military movies!!!

                Do it and discuss what you saw!!!

                Hogdriver, you try to know Russians and YOU DIDN'T SEE ANY RUSSIAN MOVIE!!!

                Those two movies which you mentioned are VERY old. It looks like all my expression about ALL US movies will be based only on one movie of Charlie Chaplin and one "Gone by the Wind".

                You were important person in US Air Forces during Cold War so I do not believe that you have no money.

                Buy Russian movies and see it, it is so easy!!!

                I guarantee for you that Russian military movies not worse than Western military movies, I saw and Soviet, and US movies.

                Comment


                • #83
                  For Oleg Grigoriev

                  Read this (attention - it is in Russian):

                  http://historiae.fastbb.ru/re.pl?2-0...-001-0-0-0-0-0

                  Very funny, I like it.

                  It is about two first parts of "Shtrafbat" and about "Diversant".

                  Comment


                  • #84
                    Originally posted by Andrey
                    For Oleg Grigoriev

                    Read this (attention - it is in Russian):

                    http://historiae.fastbb.ru/re.pl?2-0...-001-0-0-0-0-0

                    Very funny, I like it.

                    It is about two first parts of "Shtrafbat" and about "Diversant".
                    And what is so good about this review exactly? Yes “shtrafabat” has hardly anything to do with reality but his (the author of the review) problem is not so much with factual errors as with that some “proavoslavni” is shown as a traitor – it did not even occur to me that his beliefs are an issue here, and with last names of the film producer – the guy is a judofob - frankly this is getting very tiresome.

                    P.S here is good link for actual shtrafbat: http://www.rkka.ru/memory/pylcyn/main.htm

                    Comment


                    • #85
                      Originally posted by joea
                      Well, some of these films would be useful for some university Russian language vidoetechs I suppose. I shall look into ordering some for my university. Are there now or were there any Soviet TV series on the lines of "Band of Brothers?"
                      Yes, I recalled.

                      There is such movie.

                      It is not Soviet, it is Polish mini TV-series which was VERY popular in USSR. Practically every man who was Soviet boy in 70th-80th remember it, it was favourite movie of all Soviet boys of that time.

                      Name of this movie was "Chetyre tankista i sobaka" ("Four tankmen and dog").

                      This movie (app. 25 parts) was about Polish T-34 crew in Polish troops which fought against Germans together with Red Army.

                      Comment


                      • #86
                        Originally posted by Oleg Grigoryev
                        Give some credit to western public will you. It is not that easily scared. Even more so people who watch foreign movies are well aware of the problem and there are some purists who even prefer to be this way. Das Boot for instance was selling in two versions – German with subtitles and English-dubbed. German version as far as I recall was selling better, and considerably so. I believe it was the same story with “No man’s land”. As for me I has not left Russia and have no plans to do so. My job requires me to stay abroad –often for several months at the time. Nothing is wrong with that. I saw “Night watch” - the book is better or and btw it is “Lord of the rings”. I am sure that many people like it, but still I would be hesitant to speak on behalf of 180 million people.
                        I quite agree that original language with foreign subtitles is better. I saw "Das Boot" in both versions, and the English-dubbed version was pathetic. I want to see movies, both entertainment and documentary, that are made in Russia. I have been studying Russia and USSR since the age of 8, and try to be as current as I am able regarding what is happening. I have a pen-pal in Russia, we write and e-mail each other regularly.
                        Mens Est Clavis Victoriae
                        (The Mind Is The Key To Victory)

                        Comment


                        • #87
                          Simply being made in Stalin's time does not automatically make them bad. True, Ivan the Terrible was a propaganda film for Stalin, but Potemkin was made in the 1920s, before Stalin came to power. Also, Eisenstein was given considerable latitude even while making "Ivan", although Stalin did keep the final authority. If one were to condemn everything that came out of the Soviet period, or only out of the Stalinist period, many products of worth would be discarded.
                          Mens Est Clavis Victoriae
                          (The Mind Is The Key To Victory)

                          Comment


                          • #88
                            Originally posted by Andrey
                            It is not military movies.

                            And these movies were made in Stalin's time.

                            And I wonder for you, Westerners.

                            I gave you links on BEST Soviet military movies about WWII. (Amvas confirmed it).

                            Price of most of them is 10-30$. Most part of these movies are translated in English. You can pay this money and will get this movie after 24 Hours.

                            I do not believe that their ptrice is too high for you. I am Russian, I got 200$ per month and I can to buy movie for 10$ if I very want to see it.

                            I do not know but I suppose that price of ticket in US cinema is not too less.

                            It is so easy - pay some money and look BEST Soviet military movies!!!

                            Do it and discuss what you saw!!!

                            Hogdriver, you try to know Russians and YOU DIDN'T SEE ANY RUSSIAN MOVIE!!!

                            Those two movies which you mentioned are VERY old. It looks like all my expression about ALL US movies will be based only on one movie of Charlie Chaplin and one "Gone by the Wind".

                            You were important person in US Air Forces during Cold War so I do not believe that you have no money.

                            Buy Russian movies and see it, it is so easy!!!

                            I guarantee for you that Russian military movies not worse than Western military movies, I saw and Soviet, and US movies.
                            Until quite recently, how available were Russian movies, books, etc. to Westerners.

                            It seems to me that you feel that my views are invalid until I see what YOU want ME to see. Rather a narrow view on your part.
                            Mens Est Clavis Victoriae
                            (The Mind Is The Key To Victory)

                            Comment


                            • #89
                              Originally posted by hogdriver
                              Simply being made in Stalin's time does not automatically make them bad. True, Ivan the Terrible was a propaganda film for Stalin, but Potemkin was made in the 1920s, before Stalin came to power. Also, Eisenstein was given considerable latitude even while making "Ivan", although Stalin did keep the final authority. If one were to condemn everything that came out of the Soviet period, or only out of the Stalinist period, many products of worth would be discarded.
                              I didn't speak that they are bad movies. Charlie Chaplin alaso made Great movies but only they are not good for making impression about ALL US movies.

                              Comment


                              • #90
                                Originally posted by hogdriver
                                Until quite recently, how available were Russian movies, books, etc. to Westerners.

                                It seems to me that you feel that my views are invalid until I see what YOU want ME to see. Rather a narrow view on your part.
                                Your views are invalid because you don't know Soviet movies about WWII.

                                You do not believe me but Amvas said that movies which I read are "gold fund of Soviet/Russian cinema making".

                                If you are so hardly believing person you can send my list to your friends in Russia who are "good guys".
                                Last edited by Andrey; 19 Nov 04, 18:13.

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