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Soviet versus Russian Victory in WWII

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  • Originally posted by joea View Post
    We really are P.C. in Canada, mind you we also have some big lobbies in Canada, for example a huge Ukrainian community, who in fact originate from Galacia (Western Ukraine) who came in 2 waves in the 19th C and also post 1945.
    it would be interesting to investigate on that wave that come after 1945.

    Many of these emigrant were former SS collaborationists that were freed by Allies thanks to Vatican intervention.

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    • Originally posted by Shamil View Post
      Let me guess You are a jew who moved to Germany from the former USSR?
      are you also against Jews, Shamil?

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      • Originally posted by .sergio. View Post
        it would be interesting to investigate on that wave that come after 1945.

        Many of these emigrant were former SS collaborationists that were freed by Allies thanks to Vatican intervention.

        Yep, the so-called "rat lines" from various countries in Europe, via the Vatican, to South America were extremely busy. One Croatian cardinal in Rome was very busy helping former Ustashi, another one focussed on Poles and Ukrainians.

        Although the German "rat line" was used by various Nazis as well, e.g. Eichmann, many more didn't have to bother travelling to the Vatican. The Americans were very busy shipping all kinds of Nazis to the US, from scientists to technical personnel - from medical personnel to intelligence experts.

        Without Wernher von Braun and his V2 the Americans would have never been able to send men into space that shortly after WW II, without Reinhard Gehlen the Americans would have had no intelligence data on the Soviet Union until the late 60s.

        E.g., until the late 60s the Americans only had arial photographs of the USSR (west of the Ural mountains) taken by the German Luftwaffe in the GPW.

        When the US deemed it necessary for (West) Germany to have an intelligence agency of its own (in 1946 already) they installed "Organisation Gehlen", which later became the vaunted German intelligence ageny "Bundes Nachrichtendienst (BND). The Americans didn't care about the fact, that Gehlen recruited loads of SS, SD, RSHA and Wehrmacht personnel to set up the service.

        Many of them perfectly matched the term "war criminal", but as the US go (go, went and always will go) by the motto "We don't mind whether he's a son of a bitch or not, as long as he's our son of a bitch" nobody gave a flying sh** what those guys had previously done. The US didn't only whitewash them, they literally bleeched them to make them look as white as freshly fallen snow.

        But if we take into consideration that Prescott Sheldon Bush, the father and grandfather of two US presidents, was an profound admirer of the Nazi movement, owned parts of the "Silesian-American Corporation" and the "Union Banking Cooperation" we shouldn't worry too much about Nazi collaborators from Estonia or Ukraine. Peanuts !

        The latter handled most of the Nazi's financial activities in the US prior to 1941, the former was engaged in the mining business in (then occupied) Poland since 1939. Many concentration camp inmates (partucularly from Auschwitz) and forced (slave) labourers were among those who had to do the mining.

        It's also proven that he even did a business with "IG Farben", the company (better: industry) develloping and producing "Zyklon B".

        In 2004 a project called "International Projectgroup Auschwitz" filed lawsuits against the Bush clan, demanding US $ 400 Million in compensations because the Bush clan made money from slave labour organized by the Nazis, particularly in iron (steel) works, mining and the chemical industry.

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        • Originally posted by Heribert Schind View Post
          Without Wernher von Braun and his V2 the Americans would have never been able to send men into space that shortly after WW II, without Reinhard Gehlen the Americans would have had no intelligence data on the Soviet Union until the late 60s.
          Yes, though the Soviets got their hands on some clever chaps too IIRC. Though for some strange reason, a lot of them made themselves scarcer to the Soviets than the Americans.

          And it's just amazing what liberal democracies will do to survive when faced with totalitarian threats- why even use one type of totalitarian in the struggle against another type. Seems quite rational and intelligent to me and I'm certainly glad they did it or we might not be having this conversation.
          Tactics are based on Weapons... Strategy on Movement... and Movement on Supply.
          (J. F. C. Fuller 1878-1966)

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          • I want to recommend this site -
            http://www.iremember.ru/index.php?lang=en
            "In case of war guys in dark blue berets will be thrown in a mouth to an aggressor on purpose to break off this mouth"
            Vasily Margelov the father-founder of the Soviet airborne troops

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            • Originally posted by SunCat View Post
              I want to recommend this site -
              http://www.iremember.ru/index.php?lang=en

              Vitaly, thanks for pointing this out. I know this project for quite some time already, one of the project members is a good friend of mine. They do an excellent job, I also recommend the read.

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              • Top notch site!!!

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                • Originally posted by SunCat View Post
                  I want to recommend this site -
                  http://www.iremember.ru/index.php?lang=en
                  Thanks so much for that link. To hear these courageous veterans talk about their experiences without ideological baggage is quite a treat. I don't think I read the word 'Fascist' once and I was particularly interested in IL-2 pilot memoirs.
                  Tactics are based on Weapons... Strategy on Movement... and Movement on Supply.
                  (J. F. C. Fuller 1878-1966)

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                  • Originally posted by SunCat View Post
                    to Shamil

                    Yes. Bastards and betrayers.
                    Bastards and betrayers for whom?



                    Quite correct. The flag was introduced by Peter I whose descendants from the Russian tsar family were massacred by the Soviets. The flag was used by
                    the White movement and later by Russian anti-communists who joined the Germans and fought against the Soviets. It was a crime to use this flag in the USSR cause it was viewed as Nazi. So you try to whiten the Soviets under the flag of the Russian anti-communists and Nazis.

                    Behold!
                    http://www.vexillographia.ru/ukraine/emigrat.htm
                    http://bka-roa.chat.ru/ss.htm

                    My country use the betrayers emblem, but your country use the SS's emblem.
                    Isn't that something right?
                    The Waffen-SS emblem looks like that

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                    • Bastards and betrayers for whom?
                      Humankind?
                      “For there is nothing more serious than a lunatic when he comes to the central point of his lunacy.”

                      Max Sterner

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                      • Originally posted by Erkki View Post
                        Humankind?
                        Very pathetic. Though it would be true only if Stalin had waged war against aliens.

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                        • I mean humanity, sorry.
                          “For there is nothing more serious than a lunatic when he comes to the central point of his lunacy.”

                          Max Sterner

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                          • Originally posted by Erkki View Post
                            Humanity?
                            right

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                            • Don't you really mean 'left'?
                              Tactics are based on Weapons... Strategy on Movement... and Movement on Supply.
                              (J. F. C. Fuller 1878-1966)

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