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Your Favorite Russian Heavy Tank (WWII)

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  • Your Favorite Russian Heavy Tank (WWII)

    Well, as promised here is the follow up to my Russian light tank poll. Here you can vote for your favorite Russian heavy tank of WWII and say why!
    25
    T-35
    4.00%
    1
    KV-1
    48.00%
    12
    KV-2
    12.00%
    3
    KV-85
    4.00%
    1
    IS 1 & 2
    32.00%
    8

    The poll is expired.


  • #2
    The T-35 not because it was an excellent tank or anything, just because it looked deadly like a warmachine out of a HG Wells or Jules Verne. Or maybe even a basic design for the BOLO evolution of self aware tanks or something from Hammer's Slammers.

    Eternal War(gaming) Armoured Struggle Car Bob

    History does not record anywhere at any time a religion that has any rational basis.
    Lazarus Long

    Draw the blinds on yesterday and it's all so much scarier....
    David Bowie

    Comment


    • #3
      I'll go with the KV1. A nasty surprise for the Wermacht. The only other reasons I can give are it's sound bas design which spawned other good vehicles and that it looks the part - a real warhorse.

      Comment


      • #4
        The Stalin II with the added front armour.

        I like my heavy Russian tanks big and mean, they were a breakthrough tank, then a cat killer was a plus to for me.
        That two part shell and slower rate of fire does detract a bit from it, but I like the looks of it in its own way, at least to me!!

        Cheers Emil

        Tom

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        • #5
          Geez, another poll?

          The T-35 should not be considered. It was a very early design, on a par with the Neubaufahrzeuge, and only relics lasted until 1941.

          The KV-2 was not a "heavy tank" in the normal sense, any more than a Sturmmorser was. It was intended strictly for infantry support and against fortifications, never for use in tank vs tank combat.

          The KV-85 was a stillborn concept, obsolescent before it even left the drawing board. Only a very few were built.

          That leaves the KV-1, the KV-1S, and the IS series.

          The KV-1 was the best heavy tank in the world before 1943. The IS-2 was the best heavy tank of 1944-45. I vote for the KV simply because it was so much better than anything anyone else had before the Tigers arrived.
          Ignorance is not the lack of knowledge. It is the refusal to learn.

          A contentedly cantankerous old fart

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          • #6
            Even if Scott is correct about the KV-2, I still voted for it just cause it looks so cool with that huge square turret. Plus the incident during the early part of the war when one stood at a crossroads and the Nazis just could not destroy it.

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            • #7
              KV-2s did

              see some tank on tank combat though, right? Just a thought, I also may have others on the KV-85, but not for tonight......

              Cheers, this poll, as well as Emils other ones have a time limit on them, unlike mine, so I would'nt fret about it to much.

              Tom

              Comment


              • #8
                Thank you, Emil. We've been waiting for this. Call me sentimental, but I like the old KV-1. There is just something amusing about the KV-1 crew sitting there trying to figure out where the fire is coming from as 37mm round after 37mm round bounces off the turret. "Someone's knocking at the door...someone's ringing a bell..."
                "Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room!"

                Comment


                • #9
                  Is 2

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I voted 'IS 1 & 2' because that is the closest to my favourite, the IS-2.

                    According to 'The IS Tanks - IS-1, IS-2, IS-3' (Mikhail Baryatinskiy, Ian Allen Publishing, 2006), only 107 IS-1 were manufactured before production switched to the IS-2. 100 of them were used in action. Compare this with 4,392 IS-2 (over 3,000 of which were built before May 1945) and the relative insignificance of IS-1 can be appreciated.

                    IMHO, not only is IS-2 easily the best Soviet heavy tank to see combat in WW2 (notwithstanding the slow rate of fire and low ammunition loadout), it is also far the best looking. For the later model in particular, 'Majestic' would not be overdoing it, as far as I'm concerned. The biggest balls and good looks to boot. It romps away with the prize.
                    Last edited by panther3485; 23 Jan 08, 07:28.
                    "Chatfield, there seems to be something wrong with our bloody ships today!"
                    Vice Admiral Beatty to Flag Captain Chatfield; Battle of Jutland, 31 May - 1 June, 1916.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Scott Fraser View Post
                      "The KV-1 was the best heavy tank in the world before 1943."
                      Make that September 1942, when the Tiger I saw its first combat action on the Eastern Front. Tigers were also operational in N. Africa on or before December 1 1942. Despite the Tiger's early teething troubles the KV-1 (which was very unreliable for much of its career anyway) was decidedly inferior by comparison.

                      This makes Tiger I the supreme heavy tank from September 1942 until at least March 1944, when the first IS-2 were encountered. After that, I reckon it's debateable which is better for tank vs tank engagements, at least with the early models of IS-2 that had the 'stepped' glacis plate. (Zaloga seems to rate them about even overall). IS-2 had a vastly better HE capability, though. The later IS-2 with improved armour configuration would compare a bit better vis-a-vis Tiger I, IMHO.


                      Originally posted by Scott Fraser View Post
                      "I vote for the KV simply because it was so much better than anything anyone else had before the Tigers arrived."
                      I might have been swayed that way if the KV-1 hadn't been so mechanically unreliable. From my readings, anyone who wants to call the T-34 unreliable should look at the problems experienced with the KV. T-34 looks quite good by comparison.
                      Last edited by panther3485; 23 Jan 08, 07:30.
                      "Chatfield, there seems to be something wrong with our bloody ships today!"
                      Vice Admiral Beatty to Flag Captain Chatfield; Battle of Jutland, 31 May - 1 June, 1916.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I think, KV was Tiger for its time, but it could not match it later, as you know. Why? Read the article below it might clear many things.

                        I came across the interview of Nikolai F. Shashmurin (Николай Федорович Шашмурин) in this article "Shot-hole in the armour": http://armor.kiev.ua/Tanks/WWII/shashmurin/

                        Mr.Shashmurin spent 50 years designing soviet tanks, from 3 turets SMK to T80.


                        Here are some extracts from his interview:

                        As strange as it might seem, the eventual problems with KV were directly connected to its name.
                        (my comment: KV stands for Klim Voroshilov, one of the Sovied Marshal and Revolutionary.) ... Matter that, special construction beuro of the Kirov plant (SKV-2), where KV was designed, was lead by Gozef J. Kotin since 1937. He was married on the Voroshilovs step daughter. Kotin was very good at feeling the political atmosfeer in the country and could guess who want what. Living in full harmony witht cult of Stalin, for vivid demonstration of "love and affection" to the bosses, he started assign the names of "fighter for right cause" to the projects. And who could contradict the relative of Klim Voroshilov? ... Unfortunatly, we have to admit that KV was from the start designed not so much for war, but for show off.

                        KV is normaly praised for the strong armour and excellent gun. But this is not due to tank designers, but the metalurgist for armour and artilerists for the gun. The goal of the tank designers is in 1 thing: to take existing units and assemble them in the most optimal way, designing the motor and transmission and suspension. This often more difficult than design of each unit separatly.
                        The result can render best units in to worsless when they are assembled in one machine. Tank KV having good components was not a real fighting machine - due to unrelyable transmission. And formidable by the looks tank wbecame a burden of the Red Army...

                        The Tank was very impressive. The directors of the Kirov plant were very quick to realise that Stalin would be glad, becasue he loved everything that could visibly show the strenght of the proletarian state. And they had to be quick to show the tank. Because in Harkov plant T-34 under development, the tank that could become the main battle tank (and that is what happened at the end).

                        The Kirov plant was working too rapidly in the state of crasy chase. And not so much against the potential enemy, but against constructor of the t-34 in Harkov plant...

                        At the end of 1939 the first prototypes were made and sent immidiatly to the Soviet-Finninsh front, luckely for the plant the front line was very close to Leningrad. On 17 of December the first engagement of KV happened...

                        and immidiately the telegramms about the victorious performance was sent to Moscow. And practicaly the next day, 19 Dec 1939, the state commity of Ministry of Defence issued the order that KV are taken for production of the tank, that practicaly did not even exist yet.

                        T-34 had to drive self all the way from Harkov to Moscow to show the quality, where is KV was accepted with ZERO test driving...

                        The raw tank kept comming to RKKA, but press kept writing brilliant articles about outstanding victory of the soviet constructors. KV got halo of being invincible. The foreigh oservers agrred, becasue could only see the tank from outside. But reclamations kept comming from the active army units, but they were normally dismissed as the result of low crue skills... There was even a special govenment comission for investigation, that founf serious design faults...

                        Instead of concentrating on fixing KV-1, the Kirov plant started works on the newarmoured dinosaurs: KV-3 weighing 65t, KV-4 - 80t, KV-5 - 100t. As sad as it was, but the sign of technical insanity apeared in our work much earlier than in Germany with their "Mouse" weighing 180t.

                        The first days of the war showed that KV-1, as it was prodused, could not be used with really, because was absolutely unreliable as veicle.

                        In the winter 1941 - 1942 in Cheliabinsk, where the plant was evacuated, was "invented" KV-7 with 3 (three) coaxial cannons! A lot of materials and talent was wasted on this surreal ideas.
                        Last edited by Egorka; 23 Jan 08, 08:09.
                        Kind regards
                        Igor

                        * My grandfathers WW2 memoirs - Romania, Bulgaria, Yugoslavia, Hungary, 1944-1945.
                        * On the question of "2 mil. rapes" by RKKA
                        * Verdicts of RKKA Military Tribunals for crimes against civilians in 1945

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                        • #13
                          Very interesting post, Egorka. Thanks.
                          "Chatfield, there seems to be something wrong with our bloody ships today!"
                          Vice Admiral Beatty to Flag Captain Chatfield; Battle of Jutland, 31 May - 1 June, 1916.

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                          • #14
                            Wow, I can see heavy tanks are way more popular than light tanks!

                            Scott - quit being a wet blanket

                            I almost voted for the T-35 (yeah! I mean LOOKATIT!!!) but went with the good old KV-1 instead, for the same reason everyone else who voted for it did.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Emil_G View Post
                              "I almost voted for the T-35 (yeah! I mean LOOKATIT!!!) but went with the good old KV-1 instead, for the same reason everyone else who voted for it did."
                              I have a 1/35 model kit of the T-35 and it's bloody huge (somewhere around 28 cm long). It'll make a very impressive looking model when it's finished, I think.
                              Last edited by panther3485; 23 Jan 08, 08:45.
                              "Chatfield, there seems to be something wrong with our bloody ships today!"
                              Vice Admiral Beatty to Flag Captain Chatfield; Battle of Jutland, 31 May - 1 June, 1916.

                              Comment

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