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  • You may buy some Soviet WWII-time weapon

    I took the following phrase from there
    http://telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jht...1/ixworld.html

    Red Army's war-winning weapons are up for sale
    (Filed: 21/01/2005)

    Russia is to sell thousands of Second World War tanks, machineguns and cannons in an attempt to raise funds and remind the world of its pivotal role in defeating Hitler.



    The Kremlin hopes that they will be bought by museums and enthusiasts as interest in vintage weaponry peaks during the 60th anniversary of the end of the war, a landmark that will be celebrated with great fanfare in Russia.

    The Russian state arms dealer, Rosoboronexport, has sold a few vintage weapons piecemeal since the late 1990s but now it has launched a serious sales campaign.

    The hardware has been stored in warehouses even though most of it was decommissioned decades ago.

    The company is tempting collectors with a selection of weapons that includes Maksim machineguns, 76mm ZiS-3 field guns, PPSH sub-machineguns and T-34 tanks, the backbone of the armoured columns that drove the German army out the Soviet Union in 1944.

    For the more ambitious there are T-54 tanks, built in the immediate post-war period and used to defeat the Hungarian uprising in 1956, and even Soviet-era submarines.

    Rosoboronexport said it took the decision to market the weapons because of growing interest abroad.

    "In many battles during the Second World War, home weapons won a victory many times over those of the fascist Wehrmacht, surpassing them in quality and reliability, combat effectiveness and simplicity in use," the company boasts.

    "After 60 years, demand for them is still growing among foreign museums, military-technical associations, state and private collections."

    While it has not yet published a price list, it is likely to sell rifles and pistols for a few hundred pounds each. Tanks in good working order are expected to cost upwards of 10,000. Alexander Ouzhanov, a Rosoboronexport spokesman, said: "There are two main aspects to this trade. One has to do with the country's image. The second is commercial."

    Marat Kenzhetayev, a researcher with the Centre for Arms Control, Energy and Environmental Studies, said: "The move is probably more to do with PR than making serious money. Russia's arms exports in 2004 came to $5.6 billion (2.98 billion). Sales of the vintage arms sales might make, at best, a few million dollars. No collector will buy tanks by the hundreds or thousands.

    "As regards prices, they will be much cheaper than their modern equivalents.

    "Unfortunately, it's not like the market in antique furniture."

    The company is also selling German and Allied equipment captured during the war or received as part of the Lend Lease programme.

  • #2
    I wonder if my neighbours would mind me parking a T-34 in front of my apartment building. Actually I wonder are these weapons, I mean the PPSH sub-machineguns and Mosin-Nagant rifles are in working condition.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by joea
      I wonder if my neighbours would mind me parking a T-34 in front of my apartment building. Actually I wonder are these weapons, I mean the PPSH sub-machineguns and Mosin-Nagant rifles are in working condition.
      Nagant - a famous type of Revolver, it is not related to rifle.

      Mosin is a famous Russian/Soviet rifle of WWI - Civil War - WWII.

      And I suppose that all is working...

      Comment


      • #4
        Oops thanks for the correction. I wonder if ammunition os available in the west?

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by joea
          Oops thanks for the correction.
          To the point, the most famous hand gun of the Red Army of WWII time is considered a TT-pistol and not a Nagant.

          I wonder if ammunition os available in the west?
          Why to sell an operational weapon if it is not possible to buy ammo fot this? -

          Comment


          • #6
            Soviet-era Arms

            FYI, Czarist-era and Soviet-era small arms (Mosin Nagant 91; Mosin Nagant 91/30, Mosin 1938 and 1944 model carbines, Nagant pistols, Tokarev pistols, SKS, etc,) have been available for purchase here in the US since at least the early 1990's and continue to be offered at public Gun Shows and through commercial dealers holding Federal Firearms Licenses. I've been collecting them since the mid-1990's and have a dozen or so Russian/Soviet rifles and pistols in my collection.

            After an initial 'flood' of such weapons in the early 1990's, the Clinton Administration banned further import of such weapons from Russia due to its dissatisfaction with the Russian government (over various political issues); however, many of these weapons continued to be imported from Finnish arms dealers (both those modified by the Finns as well as "pure" Russian/Soviet weapons they had accumulated). Today, I believe, import restrictions from Russia are no longer in effect.

            It has also been possible to purchase here in the US Russian and Soviet-era automatic weapons BUT they must be modified in accordance with US Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms (BATF) standards to be incapable of being fired in the full automatic mode. These include: PPSH 41 and 43 submachine guns, and Degtyarev and Maxim machine guns (both of these latter weapons are usually only available in the complete non-firing mode (i.e. the actions have been 'demilled'--cut with an acetylene torch--to prevent them being made to fire at all).

            When I was the Director of the Winston Churchill Memorial here in the US, back in 2001, we received a FAX solicitation from a Russian government group offering for sale to museums WWII and Cold War era tanks, cannon, anti-tank guns, anti-aircraft guns and other large pieces of military equipment. I believe our solicitation was part of an effort to interest US museums in purchasing such items. The solicitation didn't say so, but I assume any such large weapons sold in the US would have to be 'demilled' to make them incapable of being fired (although in the case of tanks, certainly they could be driven--in fact, some entrepreneurs here in the US offer "rides" in T34's for a fee).

            Bottom line: Russian/Soviet-era small arms are readily available here in the US and have been for a number of years. US citizens are permitted (guaranteed by the US Constitution) to own such weapons, as long as none are capable of firing in the 'full automatic' mode. Some idea of price range (in US dollars) here: Mosin Nagant 91 (WWI) approx. $100-$125; Mosin Nagant 91/30 (WWII) approx $75-$85; Mosin carbines (1938 & 1944) approx $40-$80; Nagant pistol (Soviet era) approx $80-$100; Tokarev pistol (WWII & 1950's-era) approx $150-$200; Mosin Nagant 91/30 Sniper rifle with a PU scope (WWII) approx $450-$650 (high price because of popularity of 'Enemy at the Gates' movie). Earlier we could also purchase Tokarev Model SVT-1940 semi-automatic rifle (WWII) for approx $280-$400, but I've not seen any available for about 5 years (except collectors re-selling their own). A PPSH 41 (semi-automatic fire only) can be purchased for approx $300-$400 and a PPSH 41 that has been 'demilled' (cannot fire at all, display only) runs approx $195. Russian SKS of the 1950's-era are approx $250-$350 (were much cheaper before the Clinton Ban) but Warsaw Pact versions (Romanian, Polish, Hungarian and most recently Bulgarian) are a lot cheaper, approx $125-$200. AK47 and AK74 (semi-automatic only) are available here (plus the Warsaw Pact versions) for approx $300-$450, depending upon type and country. The so-called 'Dragunov' sniper rifle is also available, although not the Russian model (Romanian model is usually available) approx $650-$800.

            Collector's Note: The range of prices are for the 'run of the mill' models. Some specific types are considered 'collector's items' due to rarity, factory they were manufactured at, etc, and run much higher prices. For example, Mosins's from the Tula factory are considered more 'collectible' than those from, say, Izhevtsk or other factories. Also, collectors like weapons in which all the serial numbers are matching (barrel, breech, bolt, etc,), and such 'matching number weapons' command a higher price.

            Virtually all ammunition is readily available and relatively inexpensive for all of these weapons, including 7.62X39 (SKS, AK, etc); 7.62X54 (Mosins); 7.62X25 (Tokarev pistol); 7.62 Nagant (special round for the Nagant pistol), etc. Ammunition can be purchased through the mail in most places in the US, provided the recipient is 21 years old or older. For those of us who enjoy collecting or the shooting sports, the Russian/Soviet small arms are a great way to 'experience' history by owning actual 'historic' weapons--plus they are just a lot of fun to shoot!
            J.D. Morelock
            Editor in Chief
            Armchair General Magazine

            Comment


            • #7
              Darn I am Canadian living in Switzerland so out of luck. Still would love that tank though.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by JD Morelock
                FYI, Czarist-era and Soviet-era small arms (Mosin Nagant 91; Mosin Nagant 91/30, Mosin 1938 and 1944 model carbines, Nagant pistols, Tokarev pistols, SKS, etc,)...
                Why do you use term "Mosin Nagant 91/30"?

                In Russia there is "a rifle of the system of Mosin, the model of 1891/1930". There are no word "Nagant" in this term.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Mosin Nagant Model 91, 91/30, 38, 44 Rifles and Carbines

                  Andrey,

                  Outside of Russia, the "Mosin" rifles and carbines are always known as "Mosin Nagant"; hence 'Mosin Nagant Model 1891' or 'Mosin Nagant Model 1891/1930 (usually shortened to '91/30'). The history behind the Czarist government's adoption of the rifle in 1891 is normally given as the reason that in the West, the rifle is always called the 'Mosin Nagant'. You probably know that both Sergei Mosin and Leon Nagant (Belgian) submitted rifle designs to the Russian government to be tested for possible adoption during 1889-1891. In March 1891, the test committee voted 14-10 to recommend the Nagant design, but higher authority overruled the recommendation. As a compromise, a recommendation was submitted to Alexander III to adopt Mosin's basic rifle design but with Nagant's feed system. In reality, Nagant's contribution may have been only the design of the magazine follower (and possibly the bolt and the charger clip).

                  The Czar approved this final design and it was formally adopted as "7.62mm magazinnaya vintovka sistemi Mosina obrazets 1891-ogo goda" (note: "Nagant" does not appear anywhere in the official designation). However, in the West, it has been always called the 'Mosin Nagant' and I suspect it likely always will.
                  J.D. Morelock
                  Editor in Chief
                  Armchair General Magazine

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by JD Morelock
                    Andrey,

                    Outside of Russia, the "Mosin" rifles and carbines are always known as "Mosin Nagant"; hence 'Mosin Nagant Model 1891' or 'Mosin Nagant Model 1891/1930 (usually shortened to '91/30'). The history behind the Czarist government's adoption of the rifle in 1891 is normally given as the reason that in the West, the rifle is always called the 'Mosin Nagant'. You probably know that both Sergei Mosin and Leon Nagant (Belgian) submitted rifle designs to the Russian government to be tested for possible adoption during 1889-1891. In March 1891, the test committee voted 14-10 to recommend the Nagant design, but higher authority overruled the recommendation. As a compromise, a recommendation was submitted to Alexander III to adopt Mosin's basic rifle design but with Nagant's feed system. In reality, Nagant's contribution may have been only the design of the magazine follower (and possibly the bolt and the charger clip).

                    The Czar approved this final design and it was formally adopted as "7.62mm magazinnaya vintovka sistemi Mosina obrazets 1891-ogo goda" (note: "Nagant" does not appear anywhere in the official designation). However, in the West, it has been always called the 'Mosin Nagant' and I suspect it likely always will.
                    Thanks for the explanation, I didn't know it before (and I suppose that the most part of Russiand never heard that "a rifle of Mosin" is called "a Mosin Nagant rifle" in the west).

                    To the point, here is more correct version in Russian (as I know Russian - :-))
                    "7.62mm magazinnaia vintovka sistemy Mosina obraztsa 1891-ogo ((odna) tysiacha vosem'sot devianosto pervogo) goda"

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Andrey,

                      Thanks very much for the more correct version of the official designation. I appreciate having it and thanks for passing it along.

                      There are several books for "Mosin" collectors that have been published here in English language, but they are all written by Americans or Brits who don't speak Russian, so their Russian translations, etc. are often not completely correct. Appreciate having the correct version.

                      Thanks very much.
                      J.D. Morelock
                      Editor in Chief
                      Armchair General Magazine

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by JD Morelock
                        Andrey,

                        Thanks very much for the more correct version of the official designation. I appreciate having it and thanks for passing it along.

                        There are several books for "Mosin" collectors that have been published here in English language, but they are all written by Americans or Brits who don't speak Russian, so their Russian translations, etc. are often not completely correct. Appreciate having the correct version.

                        Thanks very much.
                        To the point.

                        There are some versions of the using of Latin letters for the replacing of Cyryllic letters.

                        For example,
                        Russian letter "я" can be replaced by "ya", "ja" or "ia".

                        I used the "ia" version.

                        And I saw very many Russian books about weapon in Russian book shops.

                        I remember one author, his name is Zhuk.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Where can i purchase a Maximka(spelling?) ??
                          I want to buy one of each on that list but my government thinks that if i have a t-34 i will rob a bank or try to blow up the president, so theyre going to either charge me 1,000,000.00$ or let me buy it then throw me in jail, confiscate the tank and use it for target practice for their m1 abrahams tanks.
                          So instead i got this just recently
                          Here are pictures.




                          Last edited by Slava45; 08 Feb 05, 20:55.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Andrey
                            I took the following phrase from there
                            http://telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jht...1/ixworld.html

                            Red Army's war-winning weapons are up for sale
                            (Filed: 21/01/2005)

                            Russia is to sell thousands of Second World War tanks, machineguns and cannons in an attempt to raise funds and remind the world of its pivotal role in defeating Hitler.



                            The Kremlin hopes that they will be bought by museums and enthusiasts as interest in vintage weaponry peaks during the 60th anniversary of the end of the war, a landmark that will be celebrated with great fanfare in Russia.

                            The Russian state arms dealer, Rosoboronexport, has sold a few vintage weapons piecemeal since the late 1990s but now it has launched a serious sales campaign.

                            The hardware has been stored in warehouses even though most of it was decommissioned decades ago.

                            The company is tempting collectors with a selection of weapons that includes Maksim machineguns, 76mm ZiS-3 field guns, PPSH sub-machineguns and T-34 tanks, the backbone of the armoured columns that drove the German army out the Soviet Union in 1944.

                            For the more ambitious there are T-54 tanks, built in the immediate post-war period and used to defeat the Hungarian uprising in 1956, and even Soviet-era submarines.

                            Rosoboronexport said it took the decision to market the weapons because of growing interest abroad.

                            "In many battles during the Second World War, home weapons won a victory many times over those of the fascist Wehrmacht, surpassing them in quality and reliability, combat effectiveness and simplicity in use," the company boasts.

                            "After 60 years, demand for them is still growing among foreign museums, military-technical associations, state and private collections."

                            While it has not yet published a price list, it is likely to sell rifles and pistols for a few hundred pounds each. Tanks in good working order are expected to cost upwards of 10,000. Alexander Ouzhanov, a Rosoboronexport spokesman, said: "There are two main aspects to this trade. One has to do with the country's image. The second is commercial."

                            Marat Kenzhetayev, a researcher with the Centre for Arms Control, Energy and Environmental Studies, said: "The move is probably more to do with PR than making serious money. Russia's arms exports in 2004 came to $5.6 billion (2.98 billion). Sales of the vintage arms sales might make, at best, a few million dollars. No collector will buy tanks by the hundreds or thousands.

                            "As regards prices, they will be much cheaper than their modern equivalents.

                            "Unfortunately, it's not like the market in antique furniture."

                            The company is also selling German and Allied equipment captured during the war or received as part of the Lend Lease programme.

                            I want to get in on this!! I have a few ideas of what I'd like to buy.
                            Mens Est Clavis Victoriae
                            (The Mind Is The Key To Victory)

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              We have a Russian WWII cannon for sale and also a Russian WWWII Sea Mine, and three Russian Cruise Missiles and Three Russian Air to Air Missiles. Can be seen at http://cannonsuperstore.com/wwtwo.htm

                              Comment

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