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  • Conspiracy Myths Debunked

    For a starter, one of the "popular" ones of 9/11, jet fuel burning versus structural steel;
    http://www.ijreview.com/2015/12/4950...063.1445449311

    BTW, considered this thread in a few places, but since the intent is mostly for those with a science or tech component, here seems the place.
    TANSTAAFL = There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch
    “War is merely the continuation of politics by other means” - von Clausewitz
    Present Current Events are the Future's History

  • #2
    You're actually going to debunk the whole Climatology scam? I can't wait...

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
      You're actually going to debunk the whole Climatology scam? I can't wait...
      I think The Doctor/Dave M. has already done that, for those whom bother to view and understand the data,charts, graphs, etc. he's presented. My efforts are a bit below the bar he has set.

      On a note related to the OP, there were lots of other things burning in those towers. A large portion of the aircraft are composites; woven fabric of carbon, fiberglass, and Kevlar impregnated with resins/plastics (hydro-carbon compounds) which will also burn quite hot once ignited. Then there were the synthetics (also mostly hydro-carbons) and other substances in the furnishings of the offices, etc. As the video above shows, one only needs to get the steel soft enough to bend and as the outer frame bowed outward, support of the slab floors was lost and they pancaked downward.
      TANSTAAFL = There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch
      “War is merely the continuation of politics by other means” - von Clausewitz
      Present Current Events are the Future's History

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by G David Bock View Post
        For a starter, one of the "popular" ones of 9/11, jet fuel burning versus structural steel;
        http://www.ijreview.com/2015/12/4950...063.1445449311

        BTW, considered this thread in a few places, but since the intent is mostly for those with a science or tech component, here seems the place.
        The biggest conspiracy concerning 9/11 is the fact no one in the US government or security services was found guilty of failing the US people. There should have been a public enquiry and those guilty of incompetence at least sacked.

        We know why the Saudi's were not attacked by the US after the event, even though almost all the terrorists came from that country, but Iraq? Simply money down the drain, as is the rest of the campaign in the Middle East.

        Only one westerner has really conquered the Middle East, and he lived nearly 2500 years ago. The British failed and the Soviets failed. I am doubtful the US will fare better, because the reason the US is there is due to corporate greed, rather than doing what Alexander did and adopt local customs as his own. Rome also succeeded up to a point by considering foreign deities being equal to their own. Considering Christians and Muslims worship exactly the same God of Love, perhaps there appears to be a means of reconciliation without bloodshed.
        How to Talk to a Climate Skeptic: http://grist.org/series/skeptics/
        Global Warming & Climate Change Myths: https://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Nick the Noodle View Post
          The ...
          >snip<
          ... Considering Christians and Muslims worship exactly the same God of Love, perhaps there appears to be a means of reconciliation without bloodshed.
          Your delusions seem boundless. Considering the above ...

          The Muslims performing the so-called "terrorist" actions refer to what they do as Jihad, and anyone being honest about Islam would acknowledge that there are different forms of Jihad. These Islamists/Jihadists view themselves as fundamentalists of Islam and true followers of Muhammad's example and command;

          "I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify that there is no god but Allah, that Muhammad is the messenger of Allah, and they establish prayer, and pay Zakat and if they do it, their blood and property are guaranteed protection on my behalf except when justified by law, and their affairs rest with Allah."

          From;
          Book 001, Number 0033:
          It has been narrated on the authority of Abdullah b. 'Umar that the Messenger of Allah said: I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify that there is no god but Allah, that Muhammad is the messenger of Allah, and they establish prayer, and pay Zakat and if they do it, their blood and property are guaranteed protection on my behalf except when justified by law, and their affairs rest with Allah.
          http://www.usc.edu/org/cmje/religiou...t.php#001.0033

          One may find Numbers 0030, 0031, 0032 of related interest as well.

          Fortunately, not all Muslims practice their faith and Muhammad's words and actions 100%. Perhaps human nature isn't so violent in most humans? To contest and fight against Islam is to focus on an ideology, but that doesn't automatically apply to all those whom are followers(Muslims) especially when many live in parts of the world where they have/had no choice in the matter.

          A nuance or splitting of hairs perhaps, but the ideology~religion provides the sanction/motivation for the Jihadists and it is this ideology/religion that is the foundation issue that needs "correction". Contrary to belief of most secularists, not all religions are the same. I'd hardly place the religion of the ancient Aztecs in the same league as current Buddhists.
          TANSTAAFL = There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch
          “War is merely the continuation of politics by other means” - von Clausewitz
          Present Current Events are the Future's History

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by G David Bock View Post
            I think The Doctor/Dave M. has already done that, for those whom bother to view and understand the data,charts, graphs, etc. he's presented.
            Are you implying somebody actually reads those Lovecraftian eye charts?
            Hyperwar: World War II on the World Wide Web
            Hyperwar, Whats New
            World War II Resources
            The best place in the world to "work".

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by G David Bock View Post
              Your delusions seem boundless. Considering the above ...
              This is a science forum so I am talking facts, not politics.

              Alexander was the only Westerner to conquer the whole of the Middle East. That was around 2300 years ago.
              Britain failed to do the same in the 19th century. The Soviets failed in the 20th Century. The US has yet to succeed in the 21st.

              Further, Christians and Muslims worship the same exact God, the same God of Love. Although God might not be real, the fact remains that Christians, Jews and Muslims worship the exact same God.
              How to Talk to a Climate Skeptic: http://grist.org/series/skeptics/
              Global Warming & Climate Change Myths: https://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Nick the Noodle View Post
                This is a science forum so I am talking facts, not politics.

                Alexander was the only Westerner to conquer the whole of the Middle East. That was around 2300 years ago.
                Britain failed to do the same in the 19th century. The Soviets failed in the 20th Century. The US has yet to succeed in the 21st.

                Further, Christians and Muslims worship the same exact God, the same God of Love. Although God might not be real, the fact remains that Christians, Jews and Muslims worship the exact same God.
                In this thread, as in many others your are presenting your opinions, mostly political/ideological. You did not present any data/facts to back up your loose allegations regarding 9/11. You appear to not register that Islam is only about 1400 years old and wasn't a factor in the cultures that Alexander conquered nearly a thousand years earlier.

                If Jews, Christians, and Muslims worship the same "Gawd" why does he/she/it present to each of those faiths different messages and living standards. Have you ever looked at the details of Sharia Law which is what Muslims are "surrendering" to in following Islam? Can you explain (in another thread on the subject, not here, it's out of topic) how Sharia is compatible with the messages of Christ? BTW, can you explain why Muhammad lead armies in conquest and conversion for "his Gawd" while Christ did not (and how that is the same "god of love" )?

                Do you have even a half a clue regarding what you are talking about?

                Thanks again for derailing another "science thread" with your marxist~socialist political claptrap.

                BTW, if the above quote from the Hadith doesn't illustrate to you the difference in gawds and theological/dogma concepts, I can provide about a dozen more from the Koran that contradict the New Testament.
                TANSTAAFL = There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch
                “War is merely the continuation of politics by other means” - von Clausewitz
                Present Current Events are the Future's History

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by G David Bock View Post
                  In this thread, as in many others your are presenting your opinions, mostly political/ideological. You did not present any data/facts to back up your loose allegations regarding 9/11. You appear to not register that Islam is only about 1400 years old and wasn't a factor in the cultures that Alexander conquered nearly a thousand years earlier.

                  If Jews, Christians, and Muslims worship the same "Gawd" why does he/she/it present to each of those faiths different messages and living standards. Have you ever looked at the details of Sharia Law which is what Muslims are "surrendering" to in following Islam? Can you explain (in another thread on the subject, not here, it's out of topic) how Sharia is compatible with the messages of Christ? BTW, can you explain why Muhammad lead armies in conquest and conversion for "his Gawd" while Christ did not (and how that is the same "god of love" )?

                  Do you have even a half a clue regarding what you are talking about?

                  Thanks again for derailing another "science thread" with your marxist~socialist political claptrap.

                  BTW, if the above quote from the Hadith doesn't illustrate to you the difference in gawds and theological/dogma concepts, I can provide about a dozen more from the Koran that contradict the New Testament.
                  If you are telling me that Christians, Jews and Muslims do not worship exactly the same God then I will disagree with you.
                  How to Talk to a Climate Skeptic: http://grist.org/series/skeptics/
                  Global Warming & Climate Change Myths: https://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Nick the Noodle View Post
                    If you are telling me that Christians, Jews and Muslims do not worship exactly the same God then I will disagree with you.
                    Then you are absolutely wrong until you bring all the Muslims to the admit that the Jews are their forebears.

                    It is not what YOU believe, it is what they want to believe.
                    Flag: USA / Location: West Coast

                    Prayers.

                    BoRG

                    http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/8757/snap1ws8.jpg

                    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PtsX_Z3CMU

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                    • #11
                      Excellent video,thanks for sharing it.
                      I love how the guy talks to the cam.

                      The 3000 victims say thank you to this man
                      That rug really tied the room together

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by G David Bock View Post
                        For a starter, one of the "popular" ones of 9/11, jet fuel burning versus structural steel;
                        http://www.ijreview.com/2015/12/4950...063.1445449311
                        And it is guys like that who can conclusively prove crucial points of conjecture where conspiracy theorist lay their keystone arguments. Take this guy below, specialises in film and tears apart the notion of high speed photography(and other points) used in the hoax moon landing theory.

                        "In modern war... you will die like a dog for no good reason."
                        Ernest Hemingway.

                        "The more I learn about people, The more I love my dog".
                        Mark Twain.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Salinator View Post
                          Then you are absolutely wrong until you bring all the Muslims to the admit that the Jews are their forebears.

                          It is not what YOU believe, it is what they want to believe.
                          It is the same God. That people can worship the same God differently is also true.
                          Originally posted by Achtung Baby View Post
                          And it is guys like that who can conclusively prove crucial points of conjecture where conspiracy theorist lay their keystone arguments. Take this guy below, specialises in film and tears apart the notion of high speed photography(and other points) used in the hoax moon landing theory.

                          There is an easier reason to believe the moon landings were real. The Soviets were also monitoring the progress of Apollo, and if it had been a fake, they would have broadcasted that fact very pubically.



                          I still think that the biggest conspiracy is why no one was rebuked after the 911 terrorist attack. Surely those in charge of the defense of the US should have been sacked at least.

                          The Conspiracy Theory Detector: http://www.scientificamerican.com/ar...eory-director/
                          Last edited by Nick the Noodle; 18 Dec 15, 07:13.
                          How to Talk to a Climate Skeptic: http://grist.org/series/skeptics/
                          Global Warming & Climate Change Myths: https://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Nick the Noodle View Post

                            I still think that the biggest conspiracy is why no one was rebuked after the 911 terrorist attack. Surely those in charge of the defense of the US should have been sacked at least.
                            Maybe they just didn't see any point in employing hindsight to blast people?
                            Hyperwar: World War II on the World Wide Web
                            Hyperwar, Whats New
                            World War II Resources
                            The best place in the world to "work".

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by OpanaPointer View Post
                              Maybe they just didn't see any point in employing hindsight to blast people?
                              It should have been foreseen. They failed and 1000's died as a result.
                              How to Talk to a Climate Skeptic: http://grist.org/series/skeptics/
                              Global Warming & Climate Change Myths: https://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php

                              Comment

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