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Range Day ~~~ Double Tap, or Not

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  • Range Day ~~~ Double Tap, or Not

    So in less than three weeks it will be annual "Range Day". These is an annual mid-late Summer ritual involving the males on my side of the family as well as the wife's side of the family. It's earliest incarnation saw us unload in a rural "gravel pit area" which (in hindsight) frankly might have been borderline on safety to local residents. We've since moved many years ago to an organized gun club range that is NRA, CMP, etc. connected. Hence a bit stricter "range rules" in play.

    In years past, my older son being most recent "combat" experienced and also fairly knowledgeable in small arms has been our group range-master. The last few years he's had school/work schedule conflicts and this role has follow more upon my shoulders. I already have borne a share based upon the group attending as guests of my membership at the club/range.

    A typical day starts about mid too late morn. in the pistol bays getting used to the differences between revolvers and semi-autos as well as the various calibers and types of ammo. Everyone brings some to most of their weapons and the mix gives the opportunity to try out various firearms to see which you like and/or do "good" with. After a few hours on the pistol (and shotgun) bays/ranges, we usually move to the "long gun" half of the shooting range to fire assorted rifles. With a mix of former military/combat plus hunters, plus sport shooters this is another great learning experience for the afternoon.

    Should go without saying that between the club rules and our own, there is also a lot of 'firearm safety instruction and refresher' in play, as well as occasional 'special use notes'. FWIW, there is a "back area" to the club/range where local LEO and competition shooters can engage in more varied conditions and shooting enviros.

    So one range rule is that one can not engage in "rapid fire", shots must be "paused" about two seconds between each. HOWEVER, they do bend on "double tap". And here lies one of the questions I want to pose to this thread;

    Any ideas or suggestions on how best to be effective at double tapping?

    I realize that some makes of firearms, and some design styles, combined with operator skill can enhance the ability to keep/retain target in sights after firing first round, ... such that recovered re-acquisition can occur within fraction of second ~~~ Or mannerisms of the weapon in use can support an "automatic" post-fire adjustment to bring the second tap close to the original.

    Hopefully I haven't mangled what I'm trying to say.

    Working from a "self-defense" scenario, using a firearm in defense of "hostile shooters", should one use double-tap firing technique versus single shoot, assuming you have mag capacity and mag reloads to make this an option in initial engagement?

    Or further than the first 2-3 shooting responses .., ?

    Footnote, if you want to discuss this as a "combat situation" option, please fore disclose; I'm more interested here in civilian self-defense tactics and training.

    Over ...

  • #2
    I can really only speak from my training and experience and I'm sure that there are many "right" answers. My training is to fire until the attacking individual is no longer a threat. That nebulous answer can mean many things - I could fire just one round and assess or I could empty the magazine.

    That being said I do a double tap drill at three yards, two to the body, one to the head, using five round magazines. This forces me to reload at pseudo-random times. I also do an empty the magazine drill at seven yards. For this type of shooting, I don't really try to reaquire the front sight like I will for bullseye shooting. I'm more just looking down the top of the slide. having confidence in muscle memory to put my muzzle in the right place. This is more about recoil management and trigger control for me.

    I have a Glock 22, which has a really sloppy trigger for this kind of thing. I also have a Sig P228 with a shortened length of pull for my smaller hands, which I find phenomenal for close in shooting.

    Anyhow, that's my experience.
    TTFN

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    • #3
      Hey thanks!

      I also have a Glock22, but find it a bit large for conceal carry, this time of year especially. For that I usually use the Kahr K9, the smaller size allows for inside waistband holster. The smaller frame and short barrel make for more recoil and challenge to return to target, so I'm in constant need of practice.

      Comment


      • #4
        A few years ago I was going to the range three times a week, but now it's once a week, maybe every other week. I love it when the guys drag me along as I get to shoot a variety of different things. I've gotten to fire the MP-5SD quite often in the last few months.

        Shooting the Glock 26 and 27 was quite a challenge on the recoil and the shorter sight radius. On the other end, the Springfield M1911 and Para Ordnance P14 had little recoil, but the weapons (esp the Para) were very heavy for me.

        I hear you on practice!
        TTFN

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        • #5


          Here is a target from one of my drills. I'll shoot five round strings from the ready gun into the boxes at 7 yards. The body and head shots are at 3 yards, double tap and then head shot from the holster.
          TTFN

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Kendoka Girl View Post


            Here is a target from one of my drills. I'll shoot five round strings from the ready gun into the boxes at 7 yards. The body and head shots are at 3 yards, double tap and then head shot from the holster.
            Nice shooting, remind me to not make you mad

            “Unthinking respect for authority is the greatest enemy of truth.” -- Albert Einstein

            The US Constitution doesn't need to be rewritten it needs to be reread

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            • #7
              Slight divergence from the topic, but a range day could only work if you have range stew to eat at the end of http://www.arrse.co.uk/community/thr...stew.203680/it

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              • #8
                Originally posted by queensman View Post
                Slight divergence from the topic, but a range day could only work if you have range stew to eat at the end of http://www.arrse.co.uk/community/threads/own-up-who-misses-range-stew.203680/
                Dropped the "it" from your link to get it to work. Wasn't cold or wet enough to go for "range stew". Warm and pleasant actually. Did BBQ later, beef, chicken, salmon, tuna, etc.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Was thinking of a separate thread for this, but here for now;
                  Watch Liberal Gun Control Advocates Shoot Guns For The First Time In Their Lives

                  EXCERPT:
                  “It’s a rush – it’s an adrenaline rush, and even though it’s f*cked up and I feel confused and conflicted about it all…I would probably come back and do it again,” said one smiling woman after her day at the range.
                  ...
                  http://personalliberty.com/watch-lib...st-time-lives/

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by G David Bock View Post
                    Dropped the "it" from your link to get it to work. Wasn't cold or wet enough to go for "range stew". Warm and pleasant actually. Did BBQ later, beef, chicken, salmon, tuna, etc.

                    You had the ingredients right with you, throw them all into the pot with dome vegetables and you could of had your own range stew, and because it was a warm day you could of added a bottle of BBQ sauce to the pot.



                    However I do like BBQ salmon, it seems like you had a good time of it


                    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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                    • #11
                      As always- it depends.

                      What ammo are you carrying? What is the environment? Who is the target?

                      On the one hand you want to effectively neutralize the assailant, on the other hand- you need to factor distance, over-penetration, target obstruction, 'friendlies', etc.

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                      • #12
                        Another firearm related item;
                        Conservative Guest Asks CNN Anchor to Define ‘Automatic Weapon’ — His Response Is Leaving Viewers Stunned

                        http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014...rs-speechless/


                        Video at end of article demonstrating difference between automatic and semi-automatic.

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                        • #13
                          I have had very few opportunities to train with Handguns under professionals so I bought this DVD https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...73373277,d.cWc


                          I have just started viewing it but it appears very comprehensive.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Slim View Post
                            I have had very few opportunities to train with Handguns under professionals so I bought this DVD https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...73373277,d.cWc


                            I have just started viewing it but it appears very comprehensive.
                            Thanks!

                            It looks good, I'll check it out.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              RANGE DAY: Aug. 15,2014, Friday

                              We were a few people shy this year compared to years past. Younger generation becoming parents in recent years some "Mr. Moms" and babysitting issues reduced the usual attendance.

                              That aside, the handful of those of use whom did make it had a great time!

                              Some noteworthy comments follow, broken into handgun and long-gun range experiences ...

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