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What if the Allies won the war in 1939?

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  • #31
    Sorry, I forgot about the Cornish.

    The Queen is a Hanoverian, true, but she sits on the throne as a descendant of James VI (James I of England) this is where the, 'United,' came from, the Tudor line died out with Elizabeth I and her only heir was the son of her cousin Mary, Queen of Scots.

    It's fair to say that he was as eager to leave Scotland as we were to see the back of him, but I digress, as King of Scots and King of England, this was the first step on the road to the modern UK, supposedly a union of equal partners but shown otherwise every time someone uses the, 'E,' word to describe us.

    And I would've apologised for the insult and made sure I never repeated it, everyone makes mistakes, the trick is not to make the same one twice.

    I wasn't aware of, 'Ripping into,' anyone, this wasn't my intention, I simply related a few facts. Scotland has been a nation since Kenneth mac Alpin united the Picts and Scots in 743 and, while Lothian and Strathclyde weren't added until much later, being Scottish is not a matter of opinion, but of geography, history and national identity.

    We are older than many countries in the world, our soldiers have fought all over the world with courage and distinction (not always for the best of reasons but you can't have everything) we gave the world metalled roads, pneumatic tyres, self-adhesive stamps, the breech-loading rifle, anaesthetics and everybody knows about whisky.

    Our entrepreneurs founded institutions like the Bank of England and the US Navy and our explorers reached the most remote corners of the world, usually adding them to the empire afterwards.

    England has been our enemy since time immemorial and our uneasy friend for a handful of centuries, so it's understandable we wouldn't want to be lumped with them.
    Last edited by the ace; 27 Mar 09, 18:57.
    Indyref2 - still, "Yes."

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    • #32
      Originally posted by Arthwys View Post
      WHich is what he said,


      Incorrect The United Kingdom Is made up of England, Wales, Scotland, Cornwall and Ireland...( Yes Cornwall was it's own nation with a unique language and it's own tongue, AND you forgot Ireland so if you're going to Nitpick make sure you're getting it right)
      Northern Ireland, plus Cornwall isn't officially recognised as a home nation and thus does not count.

      Getting a bit off-topic here though.
      Last edited by Mackie; 27 Mar 09, 19:20.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by AdrianE View Post
        The League of Nations would be resurrected and/or reinforced by the victors instead. It would be pretty much the same thing. The old colonial powers (France and England) would have a dominant role and the rising powers (USA, USSR) would have a more limited role.

        If Nazi Germany had been beaten in 1939 the world would have been different. Poland would be recognised a middle power. England and France would remain colonial powers and world leaders. Italy and Japan would re-think their plans. Italy would likely settle for the status quo. Japan still might try war with the USA. Too many of their leaders thought too little of the Americans. In any case the war in China drags on. However without the fall of France, the Indochina takeover does not occur and thus the oil emargo doesn't. That removes the primary motivator for the Japanese attack.

        A lot depends on Stalin's actions in this scenario. If he still goes to war with Finland in the fall of 1940 then it is likely that France and Britian help the Finns and a general war errupts. However with Nazi Germany defeated so quickly he would likely do nothing. That would be good news for the Baltic states as they would retain their independence.
        That's what i wanted in the first place,England still being world power.Engalnd would have been much better world power than having America as world power. America does not care one really apart from themselfs.
        I rather be under british rule than America rule,so ww2 would have been great if it finshed alot sooner.
        Nothing against Americans and America it selfs.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by joea View Post
          What the???
          why you hane to be so mean too me,I am young and i am only a Rookie.

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          • #35
            Originally posted by the ace View Post
            Sorry, 'England ?'

            There are four countries in the UK, all of which played a part in the construction of the British Empire.

            It wasn't English troops who were captured in 1940 after the Dunkirk evacuation, it wasn't an Englishman who founded the SAS and it wasn't an Englishman who was the first civilian casualty of German bombing of the UK during WW2, nor did those particular bombs fall on England.
            Was the SAS founder Welsh? didnt know that , no one thinks anyhing less of a scot, just because they are a permanent colony of Her majesty, you should calm down and act British.
            I dunno I was drunk at the time...a sinner before God.

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            • #36
              Originally posted by Arthwys View Post
              it's the kind of thing I'd expect from an American... or an Englishman)


              Hey!!
              Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it whether it exists or not, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedy. -- Ernest Benn

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              • #37
                Originally posted by Heidi View Post
                That's what i wanted in the first place,England still being world power.Engalnd would have been much better world power than having America as world power. America does not care one really apart from themselfs.
                I rather be under british rule than America rule,so ww2 would have been great if it finshed alot sooner.
                Nothing against Americans and America it selfs.
                I don’t know about that, (we did amongst other things)
                1) Set up the Berlin airlift to supply Berlin after Stalin closed access to it (thanks for the help Britain and France).
                2) Set up NATO to prevent Soviet occupation of Europe after WWII (where or not that was their intention).
                3) Jump started Europe’s rebuilding with the Marshal plan.
                4) Rebuilt Japan after WWII and granted them generous trade concessions for years afterwards.
                5) Lead the intervention in South Korea following the invasion by the North (only South Korea suffered more losses then us)
                6) Established SEATO to help protect (amongst others) your country from aggression.
                7) Put the majority of the world’s communications satellites in orbit.
                8) Created and made accessible to civilian’s GPS.
                9) Made the Internet.

                So I would say that we have done some good things in the last 60 –70 years. Sure sometimes we can be heavy handed but trust me so could Britain when it was in charge.
                Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it whether it exists or not, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedy. -- Ernest Benn

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                • #38
                  Originally posted by 1984 Brother View Post
                  ...... you should calm down and act British.

                  Kill me now, please.
                  Indyref2 - still, "Yes."

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by the ace View Post
                    Sorry, I forgot about the Cornish.

                    The Queen is a Hanoverian, true, but she sits on the throne as a descendant of James VI (James I of England) this is where the, 'United,' came from, the Tudor line died out with Elizabeth I and her only heir was the son of her cousin Mary, Queen of Scots.

                    It's fair to say that he was as eager to leave Scotland as we were to see the back of him, but I digress, as King of Scots and King of England, this was the first step on the road to the modern UK, supposedly a union of equal partners but shown otherwise every time someone uses the, 'E,' word to describe us.

                    And I would've apologised for the insult and made sure I never repeated it, everyone makes mistakes, the trick is not to make the same one twice.

                    I wasn't aware of, 'Ripping into,' anyone, this wasn't my intention, I simply related a few facts. Scotland has been a nation since Kenneth mac Alpin united the Picts and Scots in 743 and, while Lothian and Strathclyde weren't added until much later, being Scottish is not a matter of opinion, but of geography, history and national identity.

                    We are older than many countries in the world, our soldiers have fought all over the world with courage and distinction (not always for the best of reasons but you can't have everything) we gave the world metalled roads, pneumatic tyres, self-adhesive stamps, the breech-loading rifle, anaesthetics and everybody knows about whisky.

                    Our entrepreneurs founded institutions like the Bank of England and the US Navy and our explorers reached the most remote corners of the world, usually adding them to the empire afterwards.

                    England has been our enemy since time immemorial and our uneasy friend for a handful of centuries, so it's understandable we wouldn't want to be lumped with them.
                    I couldn't agree with you more I trace back through Logan and Burns myself, so I understand
                    When the English northern army got routed at Stirling in Braveheart, and the English forces under Munro get ambushed and destroyed by the Mohawks in Last of the Mohicans I stood and cheered...(though I didn't cheer the death of a good Gael like Munro)

                    BUT! I'm English as well... so now I'm stuck!
                    Because they did stuff for which I'm not proud, but they're part of me too... Aw crap! Then I find out that I've Welsh and Swedish in me too!

                    So My Scottish and Welsh ancestry hate My English ancestry, cause they've all raped and Pillaged each other in the past. and all my United Kingdom ancestry hates my Swedish ancestry because it once raped and pillaged all of them way back when!

                    I guess you could say I was conflicted
                    I apologize though for being harsher than I had intended, I meant no ill will.
                    Last edited by Arthwys; 28 Mar 09, 01:38.
                    BoRG
                    "... and that was the last time they called me Freakboy Moses"

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                    • #40
                      Thread moved to 'Alternate Timelines', as it is the appropriate forum for a discussion of this type.
                      Last edited by panther3485; 27 Mar 09, 23:47.
                      "England expects that every man will do his duty!" (English crew members had better get ready for a tough fight against the combined French and Spanish fleets because that's what England expects! However, Scotland, Wales and Ireland appear to expect nothing so the Scottish, Welsh and Irish crew members can relax below decks if they like!)

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                      • #41
                        Given French doctrine of the period I can't imagine it. The French would have stopped advancing the second they hit any kind of real opposition. That would pretty much end their offensive. Historically, the one time they did try an offensive that is exactly what happened.

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by the ace View Post
                          Sorry, I forgot about the Cornish.

                          The Queen is a Hanoverian, true, but she sits on the throne as a descendant of James VI (James I of England) this is where the, 'United,' came from, the Tudor line died out with Elizabeth I and her only heir was the son of her cousin Mary, Queen of Scots.

                          It's fair to say that he was as eager to leave Scotland as we were to see the back of him, but I digress, as King of Scots and King of England, this was the first step on the road to the modern UK, supposedly a union of equal partners but shown otherwise every time someone uses the, 'E,' word to describe us.

                          And I would've apologised for the insult and made sure I never repeated it, everyone makes mistakes, the trick is not to make the same one twice.

                          I wasn't aware of, 'Ripping into,' anyone, this wasn't my intention, I simply related a few facts. Scotland has been a nation since Kenneth mac Alpin united the Picts and Scots in 743 and, while Lothian and Strathclyde weren't added until much later, being Scottish is not a matter of opinion, but of geography, history and national identity.

                          We are older than many countries in the world, our soldiers have fought all over the world with courage and distinction (not always for the best of reasons but you can't have everything) we gave the world metalled roads, pneumatic tyres, self-adhesive stamps, the breech-loading rifle, anaesthetics and everybody knows about whisky.

                          Our entrepreneurs founded institutions like the Bank of England and the US Navy and our explorers reached the most remote corners of the world, usually adding them to the empire afterwards.

                          England has been our enemy since time immemorial and our uneasy friend for a handful of centuries, so it's understandable we wouldn't want to be lumped with them.

                          For the French people, the Scottish people are the very former allies of the kingdom of France. Marie Stuart was a queen of France by marrying king François II and the last one Stuart lived in France. The English people were at first our enemies since the Middle Ages before becoming our allies at the beginning of the XXth century but uneasy allies.
                          Long live the kingdom of Scotland.

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                          • #43
                            We'd rather be a republic. I think your support of James VII and Charles Edward Stuart was more political than anything else but it's why the Royal house were called Stuart rather than the traditional spelling of Stewart, there being no, 'W,' in the French alphabet at the time.

                            Long live the Auld Alliance.
                            Indyref2 - still, "Yes."

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by tsar View Post
                              I don’t know about that, (we did amongst other things)
                              1) Set up the Berlin airlift to supply Berlin after Stalin closed access to it (thanks for the help Britain and France).
                              2) Set up NATO to prevent Soviet occupation of Europe after WWII (where or not that was their intention).
                              3) Jump started Europe’s rebuilding with the Marshal plan.
                              4) Rebuilt Japan after WWII and granted them generous trade concessions for years afterwards.
                              5) Lead the intervention in South Korea following the invasion by the North (only South Korea suffered more losses then us)
                              6) Established SEATO to help protect (amongst others) your country from aggression.
                              7) Put the majority of the world’s communications satellites in orbit.
                              8) Created and made accessible to civilian’s GPS.
                              9) Made the Internet.

                              So I would say that we have done some good things in the last 60 –70 years. Sure sometimes we can be heavy handed but trust me so could Britain when it was in charge.
                              ok.i understand,i was not downgrading America,i see usa can be a good help.my country did good things too.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by 1984 Brother View Post
                                Was the SAS founder Welsh? didnt know that , no one thinks anyhing less of a scot, just because they are a permanent colony of Her majesty, you should calm down and act British.
                                http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Stirling

                                Colonel Sir Archibald David Stirling DSO OBE (15 November 1915 - 4 November 1990) was a Scottish laird, mountaineer, World War II British Army officer, and the founder of the Special Air Service.

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