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Soviets go back to pre-war boundries at end of WWII

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  • Soviets go back to pre-war boundries at end of WWII

    I got this idea after reading a post on another thread. What if at the end of the war the Soviets did not occupy the eastern nations or even part of Germany. Maybe they still do Estonia, Lithuania and Latvia. Would we still have partioned Germany without the Soviets? And would there have even been a Nato. If Poland the Cheks and others had been able to rebuild without Soviet occupation what would have things looked like there? How would it have affected things today?

  • #2
    Originally posted by Psyhcoward View Post
    I got this idea after reading a post on another thread. What if at the end of the war the Soviets did not occupy the eastern nations or even part of Germany. Maybe they still do Estonia, Lithuania and Latvia. Would we still have partioned Germany without the Soviets? And would there have even been a Nato. If Poland the Cheks and others had been able to rebuild without Soviet occupation what would have things looked like there? How would it have affected things today?
    The original Allied plan was a joint occupation of all of Germany. My European history prof (Kline-Albrandt) expalined that inter Allied bickering resulted in the USSR shifting to support a French proposal for seperate national occupation zones. So, a non partitioned Germany is not impossible. With no East/West tension establishing the Bundeswehr would have little traction. No more than a nationalself defense militia might exist in present day Germany.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Carl Schwamberg View Post
      The original Allied plan was a joint occupation of all of Germany. My European history prof (Kline-Albrandt) expalined that inter Allied bickering resulted in the USSR shifting to support a French proposal for seperate national occupation zones. So, a non partitioned Germany is not impossible. With no East/West tension establishing the Bundeswehr would have little traction. No more than a nationalself defense militia might exist in present day Germany.
      National selfdefense militia. You mean like a National Guard? If the Poles had been able to re-estblish a goverment not influenced by Soviet occupation would the Poles have wanted a slice of controlling German politics and Goverment? At first thought to me I would want to say yes, but would they have been able to?

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Psyhcoward View Post
        .... would the Poles have wanted a slice of controlling German politics and Goverment? At first thought to me I would want to say yes, but would they have been able to?
        They'd have wanted a slice of 'Polish' territory. Trying to incorporate East Prussia or parts of Silesia sounds logical. While the Polish demands would have some sympathy my guess is some Allied government would have been reluctant to see territorys with a majority population of Germans become Polish and several million displaced Germans complicating post war recovery.

        One of the problems facing leaders after both WWI & WWII was the economic role Germany had played and still had in Europe. Without German industry restored the Swiss had no market for the supluss hydroelectric power they had created in the 1920s-30s. Without laden barges comming down the Rhine from the Ruhr the dockworker of Rotterdam and the bankers of the the Hague would suffer. A fast recovery of Europe economy necessitated German industry and banking be restored as quickly as possible. After several years of dithering post 1945 this was finally recognized and the recover plan of 1948 included a economically strong Germany.

        If the Poles and others go to far, as with the Versailles Treaty in 1919, then a crippled Germany acts as a drag on the rest of Europe. While looting a dismembered conquest has some short term attractions it complicates long term recovery and growth.

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        • #5
          well, originally. most of the "eastern" european countries did vote for socialist governements and thos that did nto exactly vote (poland) had a sizeable part of socialist/communist parties - like france and Italy.

          so had the USSR (well, Stalin) finally said "I trust the capitalists pigs not to be the fascists they are and I dont' need a buffer area to prevent another invasion...) , well, it could well be that under no threat of a communist europe, France, Italy and many other countrtries socialists would be in power (i.e. the US and pro-US groups would hae rigged elections in the west- so Ironically you may have pro-capitalist, but mildly capitalit govs in the east and communist states in the wst. ha ha.

          alsol, the USSR would have fared better. it would not have had to have deficit of trade and sponsoring of the eastern uerope through the 50's and 60's and 70's and 80's (it increased significantly over time)

          and of course eastern european countries would have been booming under a capitalist system.
          "Freedom cannot exist without discipline, self-discipline, and rights cannot exist without duties. Those who do not observe their duties do not deserve their rights."--Oriana Fallaci

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