Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

USA-Quebec one nation

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • USA-Quebec one nation

    For the sake of discussion, let's say that afater France threw in with the USA in our war for independence, that the Francophone Quebeckers went in with the US and joined the revolution.

    How much of a difference would it have made? What would the impact have been -- good and bad -- for both sides?
    Barcsi János ispán vezérőrnagy
    Time Magazine's Person of the Year for 2003 & 2006


    "Never pet a burning dog."

    RECOMMENDED WEBSITES:
    http://www.mormon.org
    http://www.sca.org
    http://www.scv.org/
    http://www.scouting.org/

  • #2
    Oh, WOW!!! This should get interesting.

    HP
    "Ask not what your country can do for you"

    Left wing, Right Wing same bird that they are killing.

    you’re entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts.

    Comment


    • #3
      plausible what if. with Quebec a 14th state, there are good chances that Canada would never come to be (as settlers would have to go through Montreal... and thus through the USA).

      so a larger USA. manifest destiny galore!
      "Freedom cannot exist without discipline, self-discipline, and rights cannot exist without duties. Those who do not observe their duties do not deserve their rights."--Oriana Fallaci

      Comment


      • #4
        Yup,...Canada would never exist.

        However, the likelihood of the Quebecois joining the revolution were low to non-existant. The French distrust of the American colonists was extremely high and they felt their interests lay more with the British crown than with the rebels.
        Last edited by The Purist; 14 Nov 07, 20:02.
        The Purist

        Words ought to be a little wild, for they are the assault of thoughts on the unthinking - John Maynard Keynes.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by The Purist View Post
          Yup,...Canada would never exist.
          Do you think it would have led to the dissolution of Canada and it's absorbtion into the US, or (forgive my ignorance here) there was not enough left of Canada outside Quebec to be a viable state?
          Originally posted by The Purist View Post
          However, the likelihood of the Quebecois join the revolution were low to non-existant. The French distrust of the American colonists was extremely high and they felt their interests lay more with the British crown than with the rebels.
          Apparently so, but that's real life
          Barcsi János ispán vezérőrnagy
          Time Magazine's Person of the Year for 2003 & 2006


          "Never pet a burning dog."

          RECOMMENDED WEBSITES:
          http://www.mormon.org
          http://www.sca.org
          http://www.scv.org/
          http://www.scouting.org/

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by The Purist View Post
            Yup,...Canada would never exist.

            However, the likelihood of the Quebecois join the revolution were low to non-existant. The French distrust of the American colonists was extremely high and they felt their interests lay more with the British crown than with the rebels.
            Another problem was religion.
            The Catholic Quebecois had been leniently treated by the British since the defeat of France in North America, much to the disgust of the protestant British/American colonists, who complained loudly about the way the British government had 'favoured' the Quebecois. The upshot of this was when the same British/American colonists rebelled against the British government, the Quebecois decided that the British government was a safer option than the American rebels

            Comment


            • #7
              Post deleted due to insulting language proscribed by established forum rules.

              Please think twice before posting such pointless inflammatory language - it will not be allowed in the future.

              ACG Staff


              Oops, edit after the edit. Sorry for the post. I didn't think it was so bad, but then opinions vary.
              Last edited by LRB; 14 Nov 07, 20:45. Reason: This user should consider this a warning.
              Life is change. Built models for decades.
              Not sure anyone here actually knows the real me.
              I didn't for a long time either.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Paul Maud'dib
                ...Might not be so bad, I am sure the US wouldn't indulge (Proscribed language deleted) endlessly for special status demands from Quebec. I suspect they'd get told to shut up real early on.
                Considering those problems didn't really exist until the 1970s and after, the US would now be faced with similar difficulties. I suspect the US would have had to make its own accomodations with Quebec early on if they did not want a series of rebellions and the constant closing of the St Lawrence. The French in America were never pushovers and convincing the Catholic French to join the revolution would have meant re-writing the constitution long before the ink had even dried.
                Last edited by Admiral; 14 Nov 07, 20:33. Reason: Deletion of insulting language proscribed by forum rules. No infraction by this user.
                The Purist

                Words ought to be a little wild, for they are the assault of thoughts on the unthinking - John Maynard Keynes.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by The Purist View Post
                  Considering those problems didn't really exist until the 1970s and after, the US would now be faced with similar difficulties. I suspect the US would have had to make its own accomodations with Quebec early on if they did not want a series of rebellions and the constant closing of the St Lawrence. The French in America were never pushovers and convincing the Catholic French to join the revolution would have meant re-writing the constitution long before the ink had even dried.
                  The US Constitution was written several years after the revolt ended, and was written to resolve the same sort of problems raised amoung the new states.

                  Catholics in the rebeling colonys had their reasons to join the rebels, as did the Quakers and the Germans. For the Scots-Irish decended it was a given

                  So the King & ministers played their hand correctly with the Quebecois.. But, it could have gone otherwise, revolting mistakes were made elsewhere.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Carl Schwamberg View Post
                    The US Constitution was written several years after the revolt ended, and was written to resolve the same sort of problems raised amoung the new states.

                    Catholics in the rebeling colonys had their reasons to join the rebels, as did the Quakers and the Germans. For the Scots-Irish decended it was a given
                    Absolutely -- Maryland (established as the Catholic colony) certainly had no problem with religion vis-a-vis serving the colonial forces -- Maryland is still known as The Old Line State for the quality of its regiments in the Revolution.
                    Barcsi János ispán vezérőrnagy
                    Time Magazine's Person of the Year for 2003 & 2006


                    "Never pet a burning dog."

                    RECOMMENDED WEBSITES:
                    http://www.mormon.org
                    http://www.sca.org
                    http://www.scv.org/
                    http://www.scouting.org/

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Fumbling political, tax, and military policy caused the rift between the 13 colonys & the Tory government. This was aggravated by economic fundamentals that were rapidly changing. I wonder what exact differences there were in the far northern colonies that kept them from joining the revolt?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Janos View Post
                        For the sake of discussion, let's say that afater France threw in with the USA in our war for independence, that the Francophone Quebeckers went in with the US and joined the revolution.

                        How much of a difference would it have made? What would the impact have been -- good and bad -- for both sides?
                        Too late....

                        Quebec has been a part of the US since NAFTA was signed long ago....

                        We just forgot to tell the "Torries" about it......
                        Kevin Kenneally
                        Masters from a school of "hard knocks"
                        Member of a Ph.D. Society (Post hole. Digger)

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Carl Schwamberg
                          ...Catholics in the rebeling colonys had their reasons to join the rebels, as did the Quakers and the Germans. For the Scots-Irish decended it was a given
                          Originally posted by Janos
                          Absolutely -- Maryland (established as the Catholic colony) certainly had no problem with religion vis-a-vis serving the colonial forces -- Maryland is still known as The Old Line State for the quality of its regiments in
                          the Revolution
                          Uh,...no, guys, you are missing the depth of the cultural differences between the English and French in the late 18th century in North America (even today, though for different reasons).

                          The Quebecois are conservative monarchists with deep roots in traditional Catholism. There could be no question of a division of Church and State as the French Catholics linked both together as one. In the mind of the average peasant, the Parish priest held only a little less power than the king and he certainly had more power and influence than any local government official. The protection of their language (no melting pots allowed), culture, religion, system of land ownership (the seigneurial system), laws (no commonlaw allowed) an so on, were guaranteed by the British crown in order to hold the colonies loyalty.

                          Unless the newly independant United States were to turn its revolutionary ideals on their head to entice the Quebecois, they were not going to join in on the fun.
                          Last edited by The Purist; 16 Nov 07, 22:15.
                          The Purist

                          Words ought to be a little wild, for they are the assault of thoughts on the unthinking - John Maynard Keynes.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            My guess, is the Quebecois though part of the British Empire by the time the French Revolution came on, would not have been thrilled with the revolution and their sentiments would be much like the residents of the Vendee'.
                            I often think how much easier the world would have been to manage if Herr Hitler and Signor Mussolini had been at Oxford. Lord Halifax

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by The Purist View Post
                              Unless the newly independant United States were to turn its revolutionary ideals on their head to entice the Quebecois, they were not going to join in on the fun.
                              Good info, Purist, I am now convinced.
                              Barcsi János ispán vezérőrnagy
                              Time Magazine's Person of the Year for 2003 & 2006


                              "Never pet a burning dog."

                              RECOMMENDED WEBSITES:
                              http://www.mormon.org
                              http://www.sca.org
                              http://www.scv.org/
                              http://www.scouting.org/

                              Comment

                              Latest Topics

                              Collapse

                              Working...
                              X