Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

GeneralPatton Keeps his mouth shut and hands to himself

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • GeneralPatton Keeps his mouth shut and hands to himself

    Simple question.

    General George Patton doesn't have his famous episodes where he slaps a souldier and others where he says what was regarded as some rather inappropriate statements.

    Would he instead of General Bradley commanded the 1st Army at Normandy and latter 12th Army Group?
    "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" Beatrice Evelyn Hall
    Updated for the 21st century... except if you are criticizing islam, that scares the $hii+e out of me!

  • #2
    "What about the next on the promotion list? This Patton?"

    "I dunno. He keeps his mouth shut and never says anything. Like he is afraid to interrupt or something. A officer needs to grab everyone attention when he speaks. We dont even know if Patton can speak. (chuckles) I'll not endorse him or recommend for promotion, put that down 'Not Recommended'. Now who is next?"

    Seriously. Yes he might closer to all that. He still had some other negative events but without the ultra stupid episodes he remains well ahead of the pack. After all he was selected for 7th Army command before Bradley was even considered as anything but a tryo at corps command.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by 17thfabn View Post
      Would he instead of General Bradley commanded the 1st Army at Normandy and latter 12th Army Group?
      I did once read that Bradley was in line for the job of commanding the US forces in Normandy even before Patton got into trouble over the slapping incident.
      I'll try and remember where

      Comment


      • #4
        The slapping thing dragged out over the late summer and autum of 1943. I'm remembering it was a done deal before Ike was selected for SHAEF. Any other US Army names for commands in the Overlord operations were pure speculation as no US Army leader other than Marshal had any authority, or direct interest. Until November Ike assumed he would remain in the Mediterranean, or return to the US. My memory is Ike lashed together a list of commanders from the Med to transfer to the UK in the weeks between his order to take command of SHAEF & departing on leave to the US. About three weeks.

        I'm working & cant do it til Sunday, but check Bradleys and Eisenhowers biographies. The former will have a reasonably accurate date for when Bradly was informed, at least one of Ikes bios delves into the selection. Pogues bio of Marshal is probably the best source for Marshals thinking/influence on this.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Carl Schwamberg View Post
          The slapping thing dragged out over the late summer and autum of 1943. I'm remembering it was a done deal before Ike was selected for SHAEF. Any other US Army names for commands in the Overlord operations were pure speculation as no US Army leader other than Marshal had any authority, or direct interest. Until November Ike assumed he would remain in the Mediterranean, or return to the US.
          Wasn't there some thought given to Eisenhower becoming Army Chief of Staff and General Marshall becoming the allied commander?
          "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" Beatrice Evelyn Hall
          Updated for the 21st century... except if you are criticizing islam, that scares the $hii+e out of me!

          Comment


          • #6
            Bradley was chosen by Marshall for the role in September 1943, and while Patton had hit the soldiers in early August, and Ike knew about it and had written to Marshall telling him of the incidents, the affair was sat on until November, when the story finally broke in the press after a nurse wrote about the incident to her boyfriend who was a journalist.

            Comment


            • #7
              Does he still slap the other one?

              Paul
              ‘Tis said his form is tiny, yet
              All human ills he can subdue,
              Or with a bauble or medal
              Can win mans heart for you;
              And many a blessing know to stew
              To make a megloamaniac bright;
              Give honour to the dainty Corse,
              The Pixie is a little shite.

              Comment


              • #8
                Bradley was Eisenhower's boy; both were non-showers for WW1, and colorless brown-nosers and bureaucrats, so Bradley was a natural front-runner for Eisenhower.

                Patton was a highly decorated combat soldier with a great deal of color, and the habit of pissing off the pedantic and the second-rate.

                So I don't really think it would have made much difference. Eisenhower used Patton because he needed his skills (and only when he desperately needed his skills), not because he valued him. Bradley was mediocre at best, but he was a colorless clerk whom Ike liked.

                Similar situations can be seen with Devers and Patch, 6th AG and 7th Army COs in France-neither were popular with Eisenhower even though they out-performed Bradley.
                Any man can hold his place when the bands play and women throw flowers; it is when the enemy presses close and metal shears through the ranks that one can acertain which are soldiers, and which are not.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Dibble201Bty View Post
                  Does he still slap the other one?

                  Paul
                  No, he keeps his hands to himself in all situations and his mouth shut when it needs to be shut!
                  "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" Beatrice Evelyn Hall
                  Updated for the 21st century... except if you are criticizing islam, that scares the $hii+e out of me!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by 17thfabn View Post
                    No, he keeps his hands to himself in all situations and his mouth shut when it needs to be shut!
                    The latter would mean he wasn't Patton.
                    Any man can hold his place when the bands play and women throw flowers; it is when the enemy presses close and metal shears through the ranks that one can acertain which are soldiers, and which are not.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post
                      Bradley was Eisenhower's boy; both were non-showers for WW1.
                      I think that is an unfair statement for both General Bradley and General Eisenhower.

                      Bradley's unit was scheduled to go over but the war ended before they were deployed.

                      Eisenhower requested to be assigned to a unit that was deploying but was refused.

                      It would hurt an officer's carrier to not have active service in the Great War. Any ambitious officer would have lobbied to be assigned to a unit going to Europe.
                      "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" Beatrice Evelyn Hall
                      Updated for the 21st century... except if you are criticizing islam, that scares the $hii+e out of me!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post
                        The latter would mean he wasn't Patton.
                        In the movie didn't he kiss a shell shocked soldier late in the War?

                        Yes its Hollywood, but George C. Scott played a much better Patton than Patton did himself. If you here Patton's true voice it is a great disappointment after hearing George C. Scott's gravely voice.

                        Maybe that's what Patton needed. A double with a great speaking voice to go out and shake hands, pin medals on and make nice with the press. He could be limited to his command post or going to the front and kept away from the press!
                        "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" Beatrice Evelyn Hall
                        Updated for the 21st century... except if you are criticizing islam, that scares the $hii+e out of me!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by 17thfabn View Post
                          In the movie didn't he kiss a shell shocked soldier late in the War?
                          One in a coma, but it wasn't out of character.

                          Originally posted by 17thfabn View Post
                          I think that is an unfair statement for both General Bradley and General Eisenhower.

                          Bradley's unit was scheduled to go over but the war ended before they were deployed.

                          Eisenhower requested to be assigned to a unit that was deploying but was refused.

                          It would hurt an officer's carrier to not have active service in the Great War. Any ambitious officer would have lobbied to be assigned to a unit going to Europe.
                          Possibly, but I stand by the brown-nosing bureaucrat part. Bradley was so colorless the PR people had to invent a reputation for him.
                          Any man can hold his place when the bands play and women throw flowers; it is when the enemy presses close and metal shears through the ranks that one can acertain which are soldiers, and which are not.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post

                            Bradley was so colorless the PR people had to invent a reputation for him.
                            The counter point to being "colorless" would be workman like. Maybe he needed a wife like the "beloved" General Clark who was his unofficial P.R. officer?

                            Probably the truth is that the greatest generals of the modern era had great staffs. Great tactical and logistics officers would go a long way to winning you a good rep.
                            "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" Beatrice Evelyn Hall
                            Updated for the 21st century... except if you are criticizing islam, that scares the $hii+e out of me!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by 17thfabn View Post
                              Wasn't there some thought given to Eisenhower becoming Army Chief of Staff and General Marshall becoming the allied commander?
                              Yes, more than some thought. At one point a lot of people assumed it was a done deal Marshal would take SHAEF. But, the decision was Roosevelts & he pondered the pros & cons until a decision was actually necessary.

                              Originally posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post
                              Bradley was Eisenhower's boy; both were non-showers for WW1, and colorless brown-nosers and bureaucrats, so Bradley was a natural front-runner for Eisenhower...
                              Mark Clark had combat time in WWI with the 11th Inf Regiment. Maybe he should have been 12th Army Group or SHAEF commander?

                              Originally posted by 17thfabn View Post
                              ... Probably the truth is that the greatest generals of the modern era had great staffs. Great tactical and logistics officers would go a long way to winning you a good rep.
                              One of the ugly little secrets about Patton, one his fans frantically deny... is he was very good at staff work and running a staff. His flashy style and long running cavalry commands obscure to some extent that he was well regarded by his superiors from lowly company grade time up through organizing the 2d Armored Div & II Armored Corps, as a superior officer in planning organizing and executing tasks. Like all his peers in senior command in WWII Patton had a strong if obscured track record in organizational ability. A very significant part of his sucesses in WWII, or in the peace time Army was his ability to bring out maximum performance in his staff officers.

                              Comment

                              Latest Topics

                              Collapse

                              • casanova
                                Adults Rashid Dostur
                                by casanova
                                The Warlord Abdul Rashid Dostur came back to Afghanistan and was promoted to military marshal by the Afghanian president Ashraf Ghani. ...
                                Today, 00:48
                              • casanova
                                Alouette III
                                by casanova
                                The military helicopter Alouette Iii will be staioned off duty in 1923 because of oldness by the Austrian airforce. The Austrian airfoce wants to buy...
                                Today, 00:22
                              • casanova
                                Israel Army
                                by casanova
                                The Israelian Army stationed all airdefencesystens, tanks and soldiers on the Liban and Syrian border. The Iran wants to attack Israel. Arabian terrorists...
                                Yesterday, 23:15
                              Working...
                              X