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China & North Korea Vs. South Korea, Taiwan, Japan and Philippines 2014

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  • frisco17
    replied
    It looks retro because it is retro. Many of those buildings were designed in the 1920s-1940s. Just because structures look old on the outside doesn't mean that they're not modern on the inside. Dubai looks pretty modern too, are they a technological powerhouse? All Shanghai proves is that you can buy or copy any technology you need.

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  • johns624
    replied
    Originally posted by Draco View Post
    The supposedly modern NYC looks quite retro compared to Shang Hai.
    When the smog doesn't get in the way...

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  • Draco
    replied
    Do those supposedly domestic airlines operate in the US?
    How long do you think it will be before Boeing does most of its production abroad?

    The point is that while most Americans associate China with low quality and low tech, it has higher tech Maglev and high speed conventional trains, is building better machine tools, roads, bridges and dams and has thousands of times more engineers and scientists in the making than the US and the rate of patent filing is growing much faster in China.
    The US is wasting billions of dollars in stadiums every years, but infrastructure is deteriorating rather than improving. The supposedly modern NYC looks quite retro compared to Shang Hai.

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  • johns624
    replied
    Originally posted by Draco View Post
    The crap Wallyworld products include some of the most famous American, European and Japanese brands (hybrid cars, Airbuses, BMWs, etc,). The US exports grain, lumber, etc, back to China. In economic terms that makes the US a colony of China (raw materials for finished products).
    You're full of it. All Airbuses produced in China are for domestic airlines only. Same with many of the other products mentioned. China has a growing domestic market.

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  • Draco
    replied
    Originally posted by johns624 View Post
    China buys a vast quantity of scrap steel from the US. All those containers that bring in crap Wallyworld products don't go back empty.

    The crap Wallyworld products include some of the most famous American, European and Japanese brands (hybrid cars, Airbuses, BMWs, etc,). The US exports grain, lumber, etc, back to China. In economic terms that makes the US a colony of China (raw materials for finished products).

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  • johns624
    replied
    China buys a vast quantity of scrap steel from the US. All those containers that bring in crap Wallyworld products don't go back empty.

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  • Draco
    replied
    Originally posted by johns624 View Post
    You forget that the US, Canada and Brazil are also major steel producers.
    Which together produce a small fraction of what China alone produces (see above). The US produces less even than Japan and mostly from scrap not from ore.
    I think Brazil can barely supply its needs (it's a huge country with a large population and growing economy and it produces a little more steel than tiny Taiwan, less tha Germany and half as much as Russia).
    Last edited by Draco; 07 Apr 14, 22:12.

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  • johns624
    replied
    You forget that the US, Canada and Brazil are also major steel producers.

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  • Draco
    replied
    Originally posted by johns624 View Post
    Still taking those mind altering drugs, huh?
    China, Japan and Korea may be major steel producers, but where do you think they get their iron ore from? I'll give you a hint--it isn't domestically.
    Russia and Khazakhstan have plenty of iron ore, chromite (iron and chromium ore), etc, so they would greatly benefit from suppling China, instead of that money going to Australia.
    India is a major supplier and may continue supplying China, since it needs the income.
    So western economies suffer as eastern economies benefit.
    Last edited by Draco; 07 Apr 14, 22:03.

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  • johns624
    replied
    Originally posted by Draco View Post
    I consider it extremely likely that when Russia occupies Transnistria and Kharkiv North Korea and China will attack South Korea, Taiwan, the Philippines and Japan (perhaps with Russian help). Further frustrating and confusing the US and NATO.
    Since Russia, China, Japan and South Korea are important steel producers, steel and steel product availability would be limited in the rest of the world in case of world war, the same goes for tungsten and many other vital materials.
    Still taking those mind altering drugs, huh?
    China, Japan and Korea may be major steel producers, but where do you think they get their iron ore from? I'll give you a hint--it isn't domestically.

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  • Draco
    replied
    I consider it extremely likely that when Russia occupies Transnistria and Kharkiv North Korea and China will attack South Korea, Taiwan, the Philippines and Japan (perhaps with Russian help). Further frustrating and confusing the US and NATO.
    Since Russia, China, Japan and South Korea are important steel producers, steel and steel product availability would be limited in the rest of the world in case of world war, the same goes for tungsten and many other vital materials.

    If Russia and China supply each other and N. Korea with their best weapons and technology, they become a formidable adversary.

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  • Draco
    replied
    By the way, some interesting figures about steel production in January 2014 (thousand tonnes)
    Australia 339, UK 1,083, Mexico 1,550, Taiwan, 1,840, Brazil 2,738, Germany 3,660, Russia 5,935, South Korea 6,040, India 6,954, US 7,328, Japan 9,401 and China 61,570.

    Whereas in all of 1939 China produced 0.5, India 1, Australia 1.2, Japan 5.8, Britain 13.2, USSR 18.8, Germany 23.3 and US 51.4 million tons (not tonnes as above).

    There are similar figures for several metals, grains, farm fish, machine tools, etc, with China leading world production and the difference growing. DEspite this unprecedented production, China is a major importer of many of these products!
    Last edited by Draco; 08 Mar 14, 00:25.

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  • T. A. Gardner
    replied
    I think this is (with apologies) apropos here:

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  • tigersqn
    replied
    Originally posted by Doveton Sturdee View Post
    ...... the lunatic.

    I think you hit the nail on the head there.

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  • Draco
    replied
    Russia and China can support each other for a while. It is the rest of the world, which cannot live without them for a month in its depressed economy. China controls huge interests even so far as South America and Africa.

    Without China buying wheat, soy, steel, lumber, cotton, wool, meat, etc, the depressed economies collapse.

    Russia could easily double its agricutural production in a couple of years with Chinese investment and laborers.

    The US economy is based on a delusional dollar. The Chinese dictate its real value.

    China can concentrate on building large ships, large airliners, etc, for a few years, which would ruin the western shipping companies, airliner manufacturers, etc,
    For starters, China can probably buy the Russian small airliner production for a few years.

    Australia has about 25 million people and if china stops buying agricultural products, the prices of wool and meat collapse. China need not worry too much about the Australian military. If the latter declares war on China, it is more likely that China takes Australia than all the way around. I figure that within 80 km of Shanghai's center you have about the same population as Australia.

    If most of the world stops dealing with China, the price of zinc, tungsten, clothing, shoes,etc skyrockets, while the price of the products that China imports collapses. Quite an unprecented situation.

    In 1941 US industry was the greatest in the world and German industry was quite small and Japan's even more so, yet the war lasted years and cost the US over 100 billion dollars of that time. China had the greatest population but almost no industry.
    Today China is the greatest industrial power and has the largest population and despite producing huge amounts of grain, it is the main importer.
    Russia has enormous agricultural and industrial potential. Who can afford to oppose China? Together China, unified Korea, Vietnam and Russia can benefit enormously from each other, while the west wanes. If Vietnam gets rid of cheap coffee varieties and grows good quality coffeei in large quantities, it won't satisfy the growing demand in the countries mentioned. The same goes for tropical nuts and fruits, avocadoes, etc,

    If Brazil, Argentina, etc, decide to continue trading with China and Russia, the situation is even worse for the US and Europe.
    Last edited by Draco; 04 Mar 14, 12:23.

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