Open Forum - The Napoleonic Wars vers 2.0

[The Exorcist]

So I take most games ended by VP total and not by the Britain-wins-by-default rule ?

Seems strange - why on earth does Britain let anyone reach 100 ?

I know... by the absurd logic of this rule, the only way anyone can get to 100% and have a good win is if we have a global alliance dedicated to destroying the UK, occupy all it's territory, and then we can get back to warring among each other without that spoiler always hanging over our heads.

hmmmm....

[craven]

But it IS to your benefit. That's the point.

Snow trust me the only way England really wins is if people are dumb enough to fight her at sea. (unless I am commanding the fleets it appears) England only has enough corp markers to form 1 powerful army.

against Austria and Russia Turkey or Prussia it gets worn down by superior manpower even if it wins most of the battles. Ie pure land powers.

Manpower in the long run will always win in long run.

Otherwise its main path to victory is being the money guy for coalitions and fighting supplying troops for whoever is fighting France.

Notice I am still in first place and have lost over a 1/3 of my battles I think. If not for the sea victories I have had I would not be in first.

My current strategy is not a good one but it allows me to ensure you do not win or even get second and sooner or latter will force France to attack either Austria Prussia or Spain. Notice Frances current war with Turkey ensures you are going to be cut off from vps from Turkey in the long run while increase it overall resources.

There just not enough vps from England Russia and Turkey for France to actually win.

Btw another important strategy is you have to leave you enemies enough resources to rebuild to be either an ally or future source of easy vps. Unless your France then you just take over the world.

[craven]

I know... by the absurd logic of this rule, the only way anyone can get to 100% and have a good win is if we have a global alliance dedicated to destroying the UK, occupy all it's territory, and then we can get back to warring among each other without that spoiler always hanging over our heads.

hmmmm....

Wont work because Spain Austria and Prussia will lose badly to France now.

And you already have that alliance minus Russia.

and more importantly you hand the game to France by doing that. France currently has the Naval power to do whatever it wants without the counter balance of England.

they got a big enough army to do whatever they want to do on a number of Fronts. ie after you defeat England They attack Spain because their army in Spain now could succed in wiping out Spain. Then it only has to fight on the Eastern Front with the ability to strike behind Austria and Russia Front lines there for defeating them in a long drawn out war.

I cant hold everyone down only one country at a time and you still advance. It just in this case it Austria

and speaking of spoiler a non French partisan would of surrender back when they had most of their army still left. Instead you played the spoiler in your own way.

[craven]

True - you need to go with at least two factions side by side towards 100 to make Britain choose.

Either that or dismember her to the point the amount VPs she's able to collect each turn is inconsequential.

At any rate a victorious strategy in this game will have to include a "How to deal with Britain" component.

Allied, with Britain in first or second place seems to be the worst place to be though.

also all you have to do is be at at peace with England and I can not affect you. ie countries allied or neutral with England can not be suppressed.

It main purpose is to slow the French down since England typically will never be at peace with them.

[Ulrih]

Craven, you're really clever and I like it. Btw it's impossible to attack Spain or any other country if you have troops in this country. Rule to prevent possible backstabing by sudden attack on capital.

[craven]

Craven, you're really clever and I like it. Btw it's impossible to attack Spain or any other country if you have troops in this country. Rule to prevent possible backstabing by sudden attack on capital.

oh I was not talking about declaring war and then sneak attacking him just pointing out your little expeditionary force is enough to take Madrid.

My previous plan prior to the troops loaning screw up was surrender to you and then finish off spain. Even with unconditional surrender terms either England or Turkey could of defeated spain one on one.

With the troops loaning mechanic it really makes no sense to surrender to anyone member of a coalition.

[Ulrih]

oh I was not talking about declaring war and then sneak attacking him just pointing out your little expeditionary force is enough to take Madrid.

My previous plan prior to the troops loaning screw up was surrender to you and then finish off spain. Even with unconditional surrender terms either England or Turkey could of defeated spain one on one.

With the troops loaning mechanic it really makes no sense to surrender to anyone member of a coalition.

Maybe you`re right about loaning mechanism and that it`s wrong but take a look at game possibilities from other point of view. At situation if we wouldn`t have such loaning troops option. In that case let`s assume that we started game in 1805 and for example all countries declared war on France, there were some bloody battles during summer campaign and let`s assume that France started to won although casualties were high on both sides. Let`s pretend also that all major powers asked for peace after this summer campaign and by game mechanics France had to accept surrenders. What next then? France is out for more than 1,5 year and can`t fight anyone. How to get VP`s?

[craven]

Maybe you`re right about loaning mechanism and that it`s wrong but take a look at game possibilities from other point of view. At situation if we wouldn`t have such loaning troops option. In that case let`s assume that we started game in 1805 and for example all countries declared war on France, there were some bloody battles during summer campaign and let`s assume that France started to won although casualties were high on both sides. Let`s pretend also that all major powers asked for peace after this summer campaign and by game mechanics France had to accept surrenders. What next then? France is out for more than 1,5 year and can`t fight anyone. How to get VP`s?

The amount of vps from four countries would probally make up for the year and half that I believe 36 vps not including and 12 provinces gained by France would equal lots of manpower and cash for the next war.

The loaning of troops for countries at war makes sense but for countries not at war it makes the whole political side of the game mute for our current game.

What it would force france to do is be like it was histrorically always on the attack gaining ground as it forces one country to surrender and move on to the next to maintain the cycle and keep everyone from ganging up on her. Or france gets like it is now and just to big to fail unless your not aggressive enough.

England army leads coalitons and provides the morale boost for the cannon fodder armiers ie everyone not France and England

That 4 plus morale is battle winner.

btw just so you know there is a whole section in the rule book about breaking up coalitions by surrendering to one party and not the other.

as a side not lets assume I surrendered to Spain you could demand Spain breaks its alliance with you incurring a political point penalty on Spain. just a fyi

[The Purist]

The loan glitch hits

Ok, team,... As I noted in the post about the battle at San Sebastian (RN wins without the Russians), I have now discovered that the Russian fleet on loan to britain has disappeared from the map. I suspect it is in the Russian off map force pool of fleet and army headquarters (with the ships) but cannot confirm this fact until the Russian land phase.

The fleet may reappear on its own next turn when the computer does its own update, I have no idea.

In any case,... we have our first glitch since the big one that cut the first game short.

We'll work through it, everybody just stay loose.

[craven]

gonna have to send out some shore patrols and search those Spainish Brothels

Dam you Ex that was a good plan building those extra brothels

[The Purist]

...btw just so you know there is a whole section in the rule book about breaking up coalitions by surrendering to one party and not the other....

There are counter strategies to breaking coalitions as well.

The most common one is for no power to enter the home country of the coalition target until they all do. This way the target cannot selectively surrender.

IE: Russia, Prussia and Britain are at war with France and closing in for the kill. The Russian cross the French frontier and take Metz while the Prussians are in Holland the British are at home. France could sue Russia for peace leave only the Prussian and british armies in the fight. France could likely turn the tables on the weakened coalition.


Another example of coalition busting

Surrender terms can also hurt coalitions. In the above coalition (Pr, Ru and GB) if one power (say Prussia) doesn't want France hurt too bad in order thay she might get help against a now powerful Russia, she may offer conditional terms (GB and Ru offer only unconditional). France must accept a conditional offer but could reject the unconditional terms. Russia and England are now on their own versus France.

[Snowygerry]

Snow trust me the only way England really wins is if people are dumb enough to fight her at sea. (...)

It doesn't matter if we fight on the sea, in the hills or on the beach, she'll win if no one reaches 100%.

That's a very high probability.

also all you have to do is be at at peace with England and I can not affect you. ie countries allied or neutral with England can not be suppressed.

LOL - I am at peace with England, but England - apparently - is not at peace with me

[Snowygerry]

There are counter strategies to breaking coalitions as well.

The most common one is for no power to enter the home country of the coalition target until they all do. This way the target cannot selectively surrender.

IE: Russia, Prussia and Britain are at war with France and closing in for the kill. The Russian cross the French frontier and take Metz while the Prussians are in Holland the British are at home. France could sue Russia for peace leave only the Prussian and british armies in the fight. France could likely turn the tables on the weakened coalition.


Another example of coalition busting

Surrender terms can also hurt coalitions. In the above coalition (Pr, Ru and GB) if one power (say Prussia) doesn't want France hurt too bad in order thay she might get help against a now powerful Russia, she may offer conditional terms (GB and Ru offer only unconditional). France must accept a conditional offer but could reject the unconditional terms. Russia and England are now on their own versus France.

Why ?

[craven]

It doesn't matter if we fight on the sea, in the hills or on the beach, she'll win if no one reaches 100%.

That's a very high probability.



LOL - I am at peace with England, but England - apparently - is not at peace with me

Well it not my fault you and Spain and Prussia painted yourselves into a corner.

an alliance between Spain Austria and France and Prussia can not bode well.

btw France could have the game won in five years fairly easy. If he plays it correctly

[craven]

Why ?

because by accepting the one surrender it give them peace. and the ability to crush the other two countries.

basically my plan for Spain when you declared war against turkey.

surrender to you still crush Spain.


The other advantage for France is it opens windows for France to attack various parties without interference from other countries. Other countries can do the same but not as effectively.

For example if France has attacked you say six months ago and now made peace with you. You would likely take it and then France rolls Prussia in the three month window it has before Russia could intervene.