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Did the Soviets win WWII 65 years before WWII?

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  • #16
    Germans did send two corps from the West to Prussia. Whether their plan would fail even with those two corps is another question.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post

      True, although give the poor handling of two, could their early war C3 system handle three any better? German staff work and internal rail lines, plus excellent leadership, won Tannenburg.
      More Russian divisions makes it harder, less room for the Germans to manoeuvre and probably better co-ordination between the Russian armies because closer together, and, of course, there'd be a lot more of them.

      But their industrial base and internal cohesion were much better. Imperial Russia had to import crucial supplies, had critical shortages in rail capacity, and was internally unstable before the war started.

      The Russian people were far less likely to grasp the idea that a failed or minimally successful offensive was essential to aid the French, when most considered the next province to be foreigners.

      Without a middle-class-based NCO system, the Russians suffered far worse effect from the decimation of their pre-war military as well.
      Well that's all their own fault isn't it? There was no need to threaten war over Serbia.

      If Imperial Russia had fought according to a timetable of their own, dictated by their industrial and import capabilities, I think they would have put off the revolution for a year.
      Maybe. Also depends if the Central Powers would have left them alone whilst concentrating in the West.


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      • #18
        Originally posted by Gooner View Post
        More Russian divisions makes it harder, less room for the Germans to manoeuvre and probably better co-ordination between the Russian armies because closer together, and, of course, there'd be a lot more of them.
        The Germans generally were outnumbered in the east. In 1914 the Imperial High Command still thought in terms of the massed bayonet charge. The problem with Russian communications was not that they were not communicating, but that they were sending uncoded traffic via radio.

        Masses of bodies would not have made the Russian commanders of 1914 able to face Hindenburg, or match German ability to control their tactical formations.


        Originally posted by Gooner View Post
        Well that's all their own fault isn't it? There was no need to threaten war over Serbia.
        True, although when it comes to the outbreak of war in WW1, there isn't any major power free of blame. Millions of lives could have been saved by letting AH take Serbia. And the fact is that after millions of lives were lost, the Balkans were worse off.

        Originally posted by Gooner View Post
        Maybe. Also depends if the Central Powers would have left them alone whilst concentrating in the West.
        Well, the Russian war plan set in 1912 planned to rely of border fortresses and their depth of state, mobilizing units well inside the borders so the entire Army could be brought into being before they began major operations. Either the CP would leave them be, or have lost time invading. In 1914 Poland have little or no strategic rail service. German offensives as late as 1916 could not advance past Lvov before their logistics reach hit the end of it's rope.

        Any man can hold his place when the bands play and women throw flowers; it is when the enemy presses close and metal shears through the ranks that one can acertain which are soldiers, and which are not.

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        • #19
          Historians have also made comments concerning Russian practice of "In clear" radio transmissions as not being a handicap at all for an Army that relied upon landlines for it's important communications. The Russian Army was not using Coded transmissions anyhow, so a lack of code in their wireless communications most certainly does not add up to an Achillles heel of any sort.
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