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  • Band of Brothers II?

    I posted this on the Stalingrad thread, but after some consideration I think this topic deserves a thread of it's own. Apparently, the creators of Band of Brothers has decided to tell the story of the First Marines in Pacific in World War II.

    Band of Brother II?
    Untitled World War II Pacific Theater Project" (2005) (mini)

    Plot Outline: A 10-part mini-series from the creators of "Band of Brothers" telling stories of America's battle with the Japanese in the Pacific during World War II.

    Production Notes/Status:
    Status: Announced
    Comments: In development
    Status Updated: 20 July 2003
    Note: Since this project is categorized as being in production, the data is subject to change or could be removed completely.

    I wonder how they will deal with Guadacanal. I can't wait to see how they handle the Peleliu campaign and Chesty Puller.

    I wonder how things went after they slipped past the Marine's propaganda campaign and started to learn what really happened. The 101st had a charmed existance in World War II. They fought the good fight. What happened to the First Marine Division on Peleliu and even Guadacanal was not 'The Good War'.

    The First Marine Division was really not ready for Guadacanal. The initial invasion rehearsal was a shambles. The troopers had to load the ships because the longshoremen went on strike. The principles of combat loading were not even known at the time.

    The First Marine Division was dumped on Guadacanal with very limited supply by the US Navy. If they had not captured equipment, food, and fuel from the Japanese, they would have been in bad shape. Guadacanal was a death trap. Not so much to enemy action as to sickness. There is no worse place to fight a war.

    The entire Peleliu campaign was probably a wasted effort. Oh, I don't mean that the Marines didn't fight hard and buy that ground with their blood. I just mean the strategic reasons for taking Peleliu disappeared before the Marines landed. The garrison on Peleliu could have been left isolated until the war was over.

    I'm glad they are making a Band of Brothers II. However, if I had to select a topic, I probably would have gone with the 5th US Airforce. Going with the 1st Marines would be an eye-opening experience for most Americans. I'm not sure they will like what they learn.

    I think the 1st Marine Division performed well and fought some of the hardest campaigns of World War II. However, the 1st Marine Division did not lead a charmed life.

    Do you think that Band of Brothers will work with the 1st Marines as the topic?

  • #2
    I think if you were to cover a few 'specialized' groups it could work as a designed series. They've covered the airborne already; I think covering the Marines in the Pacific, the 8th/9th Air Forces, maybe a carrier, and possibly an armor unit would cover the spectrum so to speak (although the armor is a bit iffy for reasons below). I realize that leaves lots of stuff out, but there's no way to cover it all and some 'units' just wouldn't work well for a series, like the silent service (or armor maybe).
    If voting could really change things, it would be illegal.

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    • #3
      War is not glory. War is not the media. War is not selective. To show the "Old Breed" go through the Pacific campaign, warts and all is worth doing. Even if it wasn't the Marine 1st Division, this kind of story should be told. It doesn't even need to be WWII, but that is what is popular now. A harkening to the old days, where black and white was clearer to the man in the street. We knew who the bad guys were.

      Beginning in Vietnam, and the advent of live reporting from the battlefield, war received a new face. From numbers to names. We went from casualty reports to knowing the name of the casualty's dog. The perceptions of many place no names or faces to war, especially pre-Vietnam. This is an opportunity for viewers to see those faces, and learn those names. Like Band of Brothers, we should be able to get involved and care about what happens to the grunts.
      Retreat hell, we just got here. Every Marine, a rifleman.

      Never let the facts get in the way of the truth.

      Comment


      • #4
        Perhaps

        I can remember watching Band of Brothers and thinking about the 2nd Division's experience of the War in Europe. The US 2nd Infantry Division spent 303 days in combat and suffered 26k casualties. The 101st spent 214 days in combat and suffered 11.5k casualties. In other words, there were other units in European campaign that spent more time in the line than the 101st Airborne.

        I thought Band of Brothers added to the legend and mythology of World War II. They showed some of the grim reality, but they picked an organization that was not right up on the bleeding edge every moment of the campaign in France.

        I would have thought the idea of Band of Brothers II would be to keep building on the mythology. The Marines were very clever in how they handled the press in World War II. The Marines controlled the story that came out of the South Pacific and to this day that influence is still with us. However, I have no doubt the producers would contact some of the Old Breed. At that point, I can imagine that you didn't get the carefully crafted story made by the Marine Corps. I can imagine that someone finally told the producers exactly what went on.

        Don't get me wrong. I love the Marine Corps. I think the 1st Marines was a hell of a fine division. However, looking at their war experience, they got screwed. They got screwed more than once. This would basically suck as television.

        I don't think showing people the whole truth of the Marines experience in World War II would be such a great idea. If I was going to pick a unit, I might pick someone like the Marine Raiders. That was a truly romantic story to come out of the South Pacific. I would spend a couple of episodes on training. A couple of shows on the raid on Makin. The rest of the series I would concentrate on Guadacanal. I would not try to tell the entire story of the South Pacific by following the 1st Marine Division.

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        • #5
          Re: Perhaps

          Originally posted by Gepard
          I can remember watching Band of Brothers and thinking about the 2nd Division's experience of the War in Europe. The US 2nd Infantry Division spent 303 days in combat and suffered 26k casualties. The 101st spent 214 days in combat and suffered 11.5k casualties. In other words, there were other units in European campaign that spent more time in the line than the 101st Airborne.

          I thought Band of Brothers added to the legend and mythology of World War II. They showed some of the grim reality, but they picked an organization that was not right up on the bleeding edge every moment of the campaign in France.

          I would have thought the idea of Band of Brothers II would be to keep building on the mythology. The Marines were very clever in how they handled the press in World War II. The Marines controlled the story that came out of the South Pacific and to this day that influence is still with us. However, I have no doubt the producers would contact some of the Old Breed. At that point, I can imagine that you didn't get the carefully crafted story made by the Marine Corps. I can imagine that someone finally told the producers exactly what went on.

          Don't get me wrong. I love the Marine Corps. I think the 1st Marines was a hell of a fine division. However, looking at their war experience, they got screwed. They got screwed more than once. This would basically suck as television.

          I don't think showing people the whole truth of the Marines experience in World War II would be such a great idea. If I was going to pick a unit, I might pick someone like the Marine Raiders. That was a truly romantic story to come out of the South Pacific. I would spend a couple of episodes on training. A couple of shows on the raid on Makin. The rest of the series I would concentrate on Guadacanal. I would not try to tell the entire story of the South Pacific by following the 1st Marine Division.
          If one thinks about it BoB didn't cover the whole War in Europe, just one unit's experiences in the war ans the fighting was limited (by reasons of history) to the last year. That said, I don't see a problem with showing the Old Breed in a BoB 2.

          I did not know that their supply problems were attributable to poor loading. I always thought that a good deal of their supply problem was because of Fletcher's pulling away after the night of 8/8/1942 to avoid an air raid of Betties from Rabaul. Fletcher stayed away for a week at least.

          Of course, no one says this has to be about a particular unit. An episode could cover both the !st Marine Div and Naval Air units involved in the naval battles around Guadalcanal. The surviving characters could be brought back a few episodes later when they return to combat. In the meantime, there could be episodes about the 2nd Marine Div at Guadalcanal, at Tarawa, at Saipan, at Tinian and Okinawa. There could be something showing the ships caught in typhoons of late December of 1944 and army units on Leyte and Luzon. And finally an episode about the fire bombing of Tokyo.
          I come here to discuss a piece of business with you and what are you gonna do? You're gonna tell me fairy tales? James Caan in the movie "Thief" ca 1981

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          • #6
            "With The Old Breed'

            Perhaps this miniseries will not be a dissapointment. I wonder if they will base this miniseries on the book "WITH THE OLD BREEED", by Eugune Sledge. I've read the book and absolutly loved it. It was a great first preson perspective on the war in the Pacific told by The 1st Marine division. BAND OF BROTHERS was based on the book by Ambrose, so why not base this series on Sledge's Book!!

            SEMPER FI
            Thanks
            Peter Williams

            "We're not lost private, we're in Normandy"-

            Lt. Richard Winters 101st 506 pir

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            • #7
              A Very Interesting Subject

              I'm not surprised that you have not heard about the problems loading the supplies for the 1st Marine Division heading to Guadacanal. The loading problem was severe and lead to many problems for the Marines.

              If I had to pick the most difficult problem to solve for a military unit, combat loading for an amphibious landing might well be my pick. By 1945, the Marines and the US Navy got very good at loading the supplies for major amphibious landings. However, in 1942 and 1943 they had huge problems.

              Some of the problems I can recall:

              1. Supplies were dumped on the docks in Australia and New Zealand. Sufficient warehousing was not available and the supplies sat in the weather. Cardboard boxes left in humid or wet conditions simply fall apart. This problem was solved later in the war with better packaging of supplies. The Japanese on the other hand never solved the problem. Japanese ammunition was often ruined when shipped.

              2. A ship needs to be loaded so the last thing on the ship is the first thing to hit the beach. That means you have to decide how much ammunition you will use, how much food you will consume, and how much other supplies gets loaded. Since the supply ships were not combat loaded, when the ships left early they took vital supplies. The Marines ended up with too much ammo and not enough food. Luckily, the Japanese left them some rice.

              3. The one big supply difficulty remembered by the combat troops was the lack of pioneer and engineering equipment. Again the Marine got lucky and captured a small bulldozer the Japanese were using to build Henderson field. However, they lacked basic supplies like sandbags, lumber, axes, saws, picks, shovels, and machetes. Tough to fight in a jungle environment without the proper tools for clearing fields of fire and building defensive positions.

              In the end, most of the deficiencies were made good over time. In addition, the Marines have always been good at improvising. However, the initial efforts were a shambles. I'm not surprised that most of the official histories and press releases gloss over the difficulties. The Marines were very good and are still good at staying on message.

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              • #8
                My God... can you imagiene trying to film the landing at Tarawa? That would rival or surpass the DDay scene in SPR....

                I could just imagiene the Corps having a real hissy fit if an attempt to depict the Makin Raid accurately was made.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Good Point

                  Your right. The Makin raid would be a bad choice. The Marines would have a fit.

                  How about the Big 'E' as a topic? The USS Enterprise is after all a famous ship. The Big 'E' went through the entire war. The USS Enterprise's conversion to a night carrier later in the war would be an interesting topic. In addition, would not be that hard to find an aircraft carrier to play the backdrop.

                  During WWII she participated in almost every major battle, and was the only US aircraft carrier operating in the Pacific at times. Early in 1942 she escorted USS Hornet on the famous Doolittle Raid on Tokyo, and was rushing south to join in the Battle of the Coral Sea when she was recalled to Pearl to prepare for the Battle of Midway. At Midway her aircraft participated in the sinking of four Japanese carriers, ending the Japanese offensive in the Pacific.

                  She fought with distinction through the rest of the war, collecting 20 of 22 possible combat stars, sinking 71 enemy ships and shooting down 911 aircraft. She was the most decorated ship of the war.

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                  • #10
                    This sounds very interesting. I will be very interested to see a 1st Marines BoB 2. My question is, will they concentrate on one company as in BoB as a microcasm (sp) of the war? Or will they depict the entire regiment?

                    And as for a continuing depiction of different WWII units, this would be exciting. Pretty cool. If they keep them as good and accurate as the original BoB, there's no doubt they should be able to afford to keep doing them.
                    "Anything worth fighting for is worth fighting dirty for"
                    "The journey of a thousand miles begins with one step, and a lot of bitching"

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                    • #11
                      BoB set the bar rather high. If they can keep focused I would love to see BoB2. For all we know this could start to be a series and we could have BoB28 in about 20 years...

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Some of the alternatives that have been mentioned are worthy of their own stories, but I see nothing wrong with the 1st Marines being the unit in BoB2.

                        Sure the management of their deployment to Guadalcanal was a cluster f*ck, but letting this generation know what their forefathers went through was one of the goals of the producers. I don't think the public needs (or wants) the story sugar coated.

                        If it spurs half the interest BoB did it can only be a good thing. Tell their story while a few of them are still here to see it.
                        Lance W.

                        Peace through superior firepower.

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                        • #13
                          I think that that might be a good movie but would be hard pressed to live up to the first Band of Brothers
                          :bang: Rock on :bang:

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by T-34ComandaBen
                            I think that that might be a good movie but would be hard pressed to live up to the first Band of Brothers
                            It would not need to live up to BoB I. The opportunity that is here is to relate the story of our men and women who served their country. Every story is different. Therefore, the telling will be different. The style will be different.

                            If care is taken, a series of series can be created that covers the US military from the Continental Army, on to the present. There is certainly no shortage of stories.
                            Retreat hell, we just got here. Every Marine, a rifleman.

                            Never let the facts get in the way of the truth.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Band of Brothers 2: The Pacific

                              IIRC there will be a sequel to BoB, again by HBO, but this time not about paratroops from 101 Airborne in the ETO but about either a unit of 1 Marine Div or more likely an USO troupe for variety's sake. Rationale for choosing for USO is that following an USO troupe, as opposed to trailing a marine unit, will allow the writers much more freedom of movement in time, place and action. Reading this my fear was that this variety might go at the expense of the intensity of action scenes, as USO troupes normally were not where fighting was thickest. But perhaps flash-backs will be used to portray the biggest air, land and sea battles in the Pacific: Pearl Harbor, Midway, Guadalcanal, Tarawa, Iwo Jima. The formula will even allow to cover Hiroshima as a very sobering event, comparable to the episode 'Why we fight' (discovery of concentration camps in BoB).
                              Also I understood that Captain Dale Dye (USMC), who played Col. Sink in BoB1 would try his hand in directing an episode of BoB The Pacific.
                              I have no idea of the current state of affairs, has filming started etc, but it should be possible to make something beautiful out of all this. I have high expectations. Anybody who has more info on this, as the last contribution of the thread is from 2004 and I cannot imagine that such an event can have eluded an alert and eager forum like ACG?
                              Last edited by Colonel Sennef; 22 Jul 06, 07:10.
                              BoRG

                              You may not be interested in War, but War is interested in You - Leon Trotski, June 1919.

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