Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

All in the Mind? The psychological effect of Tiger Tanks and 88ís

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Michele
    replied
    Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post

    Yet, you have sung the praises of the 87.7mm 25 pdr as an artillery piece...
    Maybe there's more than caliber. For instance, weight of the round (15%-20% heavier for the 25 pounder), quality of the explosive, or, if you are looking at units rather than individual guns, number of barrels (8 in a standard 25-pdr. battery, 4 in a standard 8.8cm battery)... maybe there's more.

    Leave a comment:


  • lcm1
    replied
    I remember an occasion when we, ( Foot soldiers ) came under direct fire from a cluster of 3 88s, and puny would be the last word I would use to describe the effect!! lcm1

    Leave a comment:


  • T. A. Gardner
    replied
    Originally posted by Nick the Noodle View Post

    Absolutely.

    Ammunition expenditure confirms that.

    Further, the 88mm is relatively puny as an artillery weapon, hence its limited use in that role. It was a great direct fire weapon, not as a bombardment gun.
    Yet, you have sung the praises of the 87.7mm 25 pdr as an artillery piece...

    Leave a comment:


  • Nick the Noodle
    replied
    Originally posted by Cult Icon View Post
    105 and 150 mm
    Absolutely.

    Ammunition expenditure confirms that.

    Further, the 88mm is relatively puny as an artillery weapon, hence its limited use in that role. It was a great direct fire weapon, not as a bombardment gun.

    Leave a comment:


  • Von Richter
    replied
    Slightly off topic, but I've just got to a very interesting paragraph in 'With The Jocks'.
    Spring '45, the Platoon's over the Rhine and bedded down/dug in for the night when they're on the receiving end of a devastating artillery stonk. Their Occifer (the author) relates it more devastating and concentrated, even than the dreaded 88s, half the Platoon are killed and wounded and their Veteran Sergeant killed... the culprits, three British 17pdr SP guns.

    Leave a comment:


  • lcm1
    replied
    Originally posted by Nick the Noodle View Post

    Check OOB/TOE of Nazi units and you will find 88mm's are relatively few. As far as AT weapons are concerned the '40' family of 75mm guns will be a tankers greatest concern. As far as HE artillery is concerned, 105mm/150mm will be met in greater numbers. Check ammunition expenditure of these guns. They are available if one can be bothered to look.
    Well Nick,I hate to keep hammering at the personal experience but I must say that the use of the 88 as an anti personal weapon was noted. So do you think that this extra rarity may have left the impression of an increase in the use? lcm1

    Leave a comment:


  • JustAGuy
    replied
    Originally posted by Nick the Noodle View Post

    Check OOB/TOE of Nazi units and you will find 88mm's are relatively few. As far as AT weapons are concerned the '40' family of 75mm guns will be a tankers greatest concern. As far as HE artillery is concerned, 105mm/150mm will be met in greater numbers. Check ammunition expenditure of these guns. They are available if one can be bothered to look.
    Thank you for the response.
    Last edited by JustAGuy; 03 Nov 18, 20:51.

    Leave a comment:


  • Nick the Noodle
    replied
    Originally posted by JustAGuy View Post

    Will you please clarify this for me in light of the recent posts by others?
    Check OOB/TOE of Nazi units and you will find 88mm's are relatively few. As far as AT weapons are concerned the '40' family of 75mm guns will be a tankers greatest concern. As far as HE artillery is concerned, 105mm/150mm will be met in greater numbers. Check ammunition expenditure of these guns. They are available if one can be bothered to look.

    Leave a comment:


  • lcm1
    replied
    Originally posted by Von Richter View Post
    A Veteran told me that the further they got into Europe/Germany the worse the non existent 88s became!
    Dug in and entrenched anti- aircraft guns had prodigious amounts of ammunition... of which Jerry tried to fire off before the advancing allies overran them.
    Yes, they knew that there was no question of resupply!! lcm1

    Leave a comment:


  • JustAGuy
    replied
    Originally posted by Nick the Noodle View Post

    You know more than anybody that 88's were unimportant on the battlefield in 44. You know they were not there in any significant numbers.
    Will you please clarify this for me in light of the recent posts by others?

    Leave a comment:


  • Nick the Noodle
    replied
    Originally posted by Von Richter View Post
    A Veteran told me that the further they got into Europe/Germany the worse the non existent 88s became!
    Dug in and entrenched anti- aircraft guns had prodigious amounts of ammunition... of which Jerry tried to fire off before the advancing allies overran them.
    88's were usually AA weapons. Once Germany was reached AAA 88's became more common. So were 128's.

    Leave a comment:


  • JustAGuy
    replied
    lcm1, Gooner, and Von Richter...... Thank you for answering my question.

    Your answers match up with what I have been told over the years. I know the Germans had other guns including those captured from France and Russia, but had never heard anyone say there were too few 88s to matter in 1944.

    Leave a comment:


  • Von Richter
    replied
    A Veteran told me that the further they got into Europe/Germany the worse the non existent 88s became!
    Dug in and entrenched anti- aircraft guns had prodigious amounts of ammunition... of which Jerry tried to fire off before the advancing allies overran them.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gooner
    replied
    Originally posted by JustAGuy View Post
    Color me confused. ...

    Nick the Noodle says:

    "You know more than anybody that 88's were unimportant on the battlefield in 44. You know they were not there in any significant numbers."

    And Gooner says:

    "So all told hundreds of 88s in Normandy."

    So which is it?


    III Flak Corps in Normandy at peak had 29x4 88s plus received 59 replacement guns, so 175 x 88s for them alone.
    The 11 Panzer and PzG divisions also had at least 12 flak 88s each so we're north of 300 88s in Normandy already.
    Then add all the 88s in the anti-tank units plus the flak 88s in fixed positions in Normandy on 6th June. Then if you will add the 88s in the Tigers and Jagdpanthers and we're looking at 500+.

    Also, any weapon is significant if its firing at you personally ..

    Leave a comment:


  • JustAGuy
    replied
    Originally posted by Cult Icon View Post
    105 and 150 mm
    ???????? Is this more of the "special shorthand" I've encountered here or just an incomplete thought?

    Leave a comment:

Latest Topics

Collapse

Working...
X