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Did Japan stab Germany in the back?

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  • Did Japan stab Germany in the back?

    I wonder how the German leadership felt when Japan attacked Pearl Harbor? Hitler did, of course, honor the treaty they had, but it doesn't seem like Germany got much back in return. I have heard that Germany even stationed U boats in Japan to help the war effort in the Pacific.
    I hate newspapermen. They come into camp and pick up their camp rumors and print them as facts. I regard them as spies, which, in truth, they are. If I killed them all there would be news from Hell before breakfast. -- William Tecumseh Sherman

  • #2
    Well, if they had attacked Hamburg instead, I'd say they certainly did stab Germany in the back.
    “To tell deliberate lies while genuinely believing in them, to forget any fact that has become inconvenient, and then when it becomes necessary again, to draw it back from oblivion for just so long as it is needed…” -1984 about the Big Lie

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    • #3
      Originally posted by rw527
      I wonder how the German leadership felt when Japan attacked Pearl Harbor? Hitler did, of course, honor the treaty they had, but it doesn't seem like Germany got much back in return. I have heard that Germany even stationed U boats in Japan to help the war effort in the Pacific.
      Just a few clarifications here.

      1. The Tri-partite Pact between Germany, Italy & Japan said each of the signatories were to render assistance to the other in the case they were attacked. Japan was not attacked; therefore Hitler was under no obligation to declare war on the US under the treaty.

      2. Yes, Germany sent some U-Boats to the Pacific up until late '44. After that, the US Navy codebreakers forced them to confine their operations to the Indian Ocean.
      Scientists have announced they've discovered a cure for apathy. However no one has shown the slightest bit of interest !!

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      • #4
        They must have not been too miffed about it since the Kawlasaki Ki-61 Hein was developed off of the Me109 and used liscense built Daimler-Benz engines. Cannons for some of the early models were shipped from Germany on subs until the Japanesse had developed their own version. The Japanesee also were developing a jet based on the 262 at the end of the war off of information the Germans had shared with them.

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        • #5
          The Germans were encouraging Japan to attack the British at Singapore. The Germans saw it as a way to weaken the British empire, which they saw as their primary enemy in the west. Kind of ironic, since the Japanese were hoping the same thing would happen with Germans and Americans, which did .
          "Experience should teach us to be most on our guard to protect liberty when the government’s purposes are beneficent. Men born to freedom are naturally alert to repel invasion of their liberty by evil-minded rulers. The greatest dangers to liberty lurk in insidious encroachment by men of zeal, well-meaning but without understanding."

          – Associate Justice Louis D. Brandeis, Olmstead vs. United States.

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          • #6
            hitler?? he was jubelant after he declared war on the US. walking around with a big smile but you could hardly call the german-japan thing an alliance its closer to a techn exchange treaty
            French Soldier: You don't frighten us, English pig dogs. Go and boil your bottoms, you sons of a silly person. I blow my nose at you, so-called "Arthur King," you and all your silly English K-nig-hts.

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            • #7
              hmm.. interesting... tech exchange? Can some1 give me some examples of what tech was transfered from Japan to Germany? ... thx
              Attn to ALL my opponents:

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              • #8
                Germany also gave Japan one of their latest sub-models late in the war, complete with technical diagrams showing how to build them. Never got used though.

                I don't think Japan gave Germany any tech, but they did fill up German blockade runners with rubber and other desperately needed war supplies which Germany had to try to synthesize otherwise.
                "Experience should teach us to be most on our guard to protect liberty when the government’s purposes are beneficent. Men born to freedom are naturally alert to repel invasion of their liberty by evil-minded rulers. The greatest dangers to liberty lurk in insidious encroachment by men of zeal, well-meaning but without understanding."

                – Associate Justice Louis D. Brandeis, Olmstead vs. United States.

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                • #9
                  mikej just took the words out of my mouth, a couple of type XI subs loaded with rubber wouldnt have made much of a difference,
                  and iirc germany tried to sendt uranium to japan early may 1945 germans on board surrendered the japs on board suicided
                  French Soldier: You don't frighten us, English pig dogs. Go and boil your bottoms, you sons of a silly person. I blow my nose at you, so-called "Arthur King," you and all your silly English K-nig-hts.

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                  • #10
                    Not sure what Germany really got out of this deal. If the Japanese had not attacked Pearl Harbor I think it is unlikely that Hitler would have attacked the US on his own. He would have had no reason to do so, and he still needed to deal with Britain eventually anyway.

                    Without the US, Britain would not have been a direct threat to invade Germany, nor did Britain have the strength to liberate France on its own. Had the US not been drawn into the conflict this would have allowed Germany to shift many of its forces to the Eastern Front. I'm not saying that would have allowed Germany to win there, but it certainly would have slowed the Soviets down dramatically. The Germans fielded a very large force on the Western front and throwing all that at the Red Army would have had a fairly significant effect. Possibly slowing the Red Army down long enough for German scientists to develop a nuclear capability?
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                    • #11
                      Hitler was happy with this Japanese attack on the USA. The British colonies in Asia will be threatened, the Americans will turn their main effort to the Pacific instead of Europe, and now the submarine war will be intensified with the removal of the American sanctuary.

                      LaPalice.
                      Monsieur de La Palice est mort
                      Mort devant Pavie.
                      Un quart d'heure avant sa mort
                      Il était encore en vie...

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                      • #12
                        I do not believe Japan stabbed Germany in the back. I believe japan just got a little edgy and jumped the gun when they attacked us. I believe that Hitler had too much to worry about already and he figured we would go after Japan first. I don't think it ever occured to him that the U.S. would have dared come after him first.

                        Adam
                        It's my firm conviction that when Uncle Sam calls, by God we go, and we do the best that we can. - R. Lee Ermey

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by 6thInf grandson View Post
                          ... I believe japan just got a little edgy and jumped the gun when they attacked us ....Adam
                          Japan was more than a little edgy. The US had been able to convinvce the Dutch & Brits to cease seeling the Indonesian oil to Japan. This was the infamous oil embargo that put Japans back to the wall. With six to ten months reserves in storage and only a trickle from other sources Japans government had few choices.

                          1. Seize the oil, perciptating war with the US & Britian.

                          2. Allow the military to become paralyzed for lack of fuel & industry a severe shock.

                          3. Give in to the US pressure & negotiate an armistice for the China war, and eventual withdrawl from occupied territorys such as French Indochina, China itself & Formosa.

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                          • #14
                            Is it ok to bump such old threads here??

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by joea View Post
                              Is it ok to bump such old threads here??
                              I can't see why not, better reopen an old thread and carry on the discussion than starting a new one once in a while on the exact same subject
                              There are tons of great threads buried deep inside the forum, and sometimes I wish we had some sort of thread index. I once planned of doing one for the Vietnam forum but backed down in front of the mammoth task

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