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The Dnepr, August-December 1943

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  • The Dnepr, August-December 1943

    With my Kindle copy of "The Dnepr 1943: Hitler's eastern rampart crumbles" appearing tomorrow, I make this thread about this giant campaign.



    http://www.amazon.com/Dnepr-1943-Hit...ds=1943+osprey

    Against the wishes of Hitler, German forces under Erich von Manstein were forced to retreat following the failure of the Kursk offensive of July 1943. The weakened force only had one possible refuge, behind the wide Dnepr River. The race to the natural defensive line was on, with the Soviets launching one of their largest offensives of the war - with over 2 million men on the move. Expert Eastern Front historian Robert Forczyk describes the dramatic four-month campaign that saw the Red Army not only succeed in crossing the Dnepr at multiple points, but also liberate Kiev, capital of the Ukraine. Revealing new detail about the largest Soviet airborne operation of the war and the increasingly desperate delaying tactics employed by Manstein as catastrophic casualties mounted on both sides, Forczyk charts the course of the battle that confirmed to many observers that the relentless Soviet advance westward could not be halted. Berlin would be next.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Dnieper

    24 August 1943 23 December 1943

    The Battle of the Dnieper was a military campaign that took place in 1943 on the Eastern Front of World War II. It was one of the largest operations in World War II, involving almost 4,000,000 troops on both sides and stretching on a 1,400 kilometres (870 mi) long front.[1] During its four-month duration, the eastern bank of the Dnieper was recovered from German forces by five of the Red Army's fronts, which conducted several assault river crossings to establish several lodgements on the western bank. Subsequently, Kiev was liberated in the Battle of Kiev.
    One of the costliest operations of the war,[1] the casualties are estimated at being from 1,700,000 to 2,700,000 on both sides.

  • #2
    Originally posted by Cult Icon View Post
    With my Kindle copy of "The Dnepr 1943: Hitler's eastern rampart crumbles" appearing tomorrow, I make this thread about this giant campaign.



    http://www.amazon.com/Dnepr-1943-Hit...ds=1943+osprey



    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Dnieper

    24 August 1943 23 December 1943
    Those 96 page Osprey campaign books are usually very good.

    But I would like to see this translated to English text:

    http://www.amazon.com/Bitva-za-Dnepr...he+dneper+1943

    Regards,Kurt
    Theo mir ist die munition ausgegangen ich werde diesen ramman auf wiedersehen uns in walhalla

    Comment


    • #3
      ^
      looks interesting (777 pages).

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Kurt Knispel View Post
        Those 96 page Osprey campaign books are usually very good.

        But I would like to see this translated to English text:

        http://www.amazon.com/Bitva-za-Dnepr...he+dneper+1943

        Regards,Kurt
        Looks interesting. Thanks for pointing this one out, I might buy it.

        Comment


        • #5
          Wait, you are Robert Forczyk?
          It is always more difficult to fight against faith than against knowledge.

          Косово је Србија!
          Never go to war with a country whose national holiday celebrates a defeat in 1389.

          Armored Brigade

          Armored Brigade Facebook page

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          • #6
            Originally posted by nikolas93TS View Post
            Wait, you are Robert Forczyk?
            No.

            Just some mad Kiwi

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by broderickwells View Post
              Looks interesting. Thanks for pointing this one out, I might buy it.
              When you get it please translate it in its entirety and mail me a copy

              Regards,Kurt
              Theo mir ist die munition ausgegangen ich werde diesen ramman auf wiedersehen uns in walhalla

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Kurt Knispel View Post
                When you get it please translate it in its entirety and mail me a copy

                Regards,Kurt
                I just got it. The title page reads: Battle for the Dnepr.

                Gosh!

                More later...

                Comment


                • #9
                  anybody get a chance to read it? It focuses on the Dnepr summarizes the period in the south post 4th Battle of Kharkov and ends at the beginning of Zhitomir-Berdichev (Dec 24 1943).

                  The German mobile forces and infantry arm are greatly weakened after the summer of 1943 and have great difficulty containing the Soviets. The German reinforcements come too late- after the Dnepr had been pierced. The Soviets are worn down themselves but are strong enough to support large scale offensives. They had invested in training junior leaders and experienced no shortage of them, which helped things.

                  The Soviets also launched their last brigade-sized (western) airborne drop of the war.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Managed to read about 90 pages of
                    The Red Army may have arrived at the Dnepr in hot pursuit of a weakened Wehrmacht, but the Red Army lead elements were ahead of their logistical tail by some margin, the VVS needed to re-base closer to the action, and most bridges had been destroyed by the retreating Germans so getting heavy weapons and their ammo across the river was a challenge.

                    Btw, the maps in this book are great.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by broderickwells View Post
                      Managed to read about 90 pages of
                      The Red Army may have arrived at the Dnepr in hot pursuit of a weakened Wehrmacht, but the Red Army lead elements were ahead of their logistical tail by some margin, the VVS needed to re-base closer to the action, and most bridges had been destroyed by the retreating Germans so getting heavy weapons and their ammo across the river was a challenge.

                      Btw, the maps in this book are great.
                      I would be interested in knowing if the book uses archival material for the Kanev airborne operation?
                      Leadership is the ability to rise above conventional wisdom.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by R.N. Armstrong View Post
                        I would be interested in knowing if the book uses archival material for the Kanev airborne operation?
                        It does, but as the airborne operation was only a couple of brigades in the September offensive of the 4-5 army Voronezh Front, and the book covers the entire battle of both the (renamed) 1st and 2nd Ukrainian Fronts during September -December 1943, understandably it only gets a few paragraphs.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by broderickwells View Post
                          It does, but as the airborne operation was only a couple of brigades in the September offensive of the 4-5 army Voronezh Front, and the book covers the entire battle of both the (renamed) 1st and 2nd Ukrainian Fronts during September -December 1943, understandably it only gets a few paragraphs.
                          Thanks for checking. My first publication in a scholastic journal, "Military Affairs" (Vol 50, No.3, July 1986), was an article "The Bukrin Drop: Limits to Creativity" solely on the disastrous airborne operation. Glantz had covered the operation primarily with Soviet sources using only E. Binder's "Employment of a Russian Parachute Brigade in Bend of the Dnepr Northwest of Kanev" in a Dept of Army Pam by the Historical Division US Army, Europe, 1953.(Binder was chief of operations for the 19th PzD.)

                          Taking a lead from Paul Carell's "Scorched Earth" I tracked down German POW interrogation reports of the paratroopers in the operation in the 19th PzD Ic files. The article at the time, and still, is the best, balanced account in English or Russian. Soviet literature was relatively silent on the details of this operation--Zhukov did not mention it in his memoirs. I have been waiting for Soviet archives to open up and had hopes with this book.
                          Leadership is the ability to rise above conventional wisdom.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            The book is basically a republication of the old work "1 Ukrainian Front's offensive at Kiev" published by the Soviet General staff back in 1940s plus two relevant articles from other GS publication. Although those work were based on original documents, as a rule they never provided an explicit references to them, which can be a problem.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Artyom_A View Post
                              The book is basically a republication of the old work "1 Ukrainian Front's offensive at Kiev" published by the Soviet General staff back in 1940s plus two relevant articles from other GS publication. Although those work were based on original documents, as a rule they never provided an explicit references to them, which can be a problem.
                              Thanks for qualifying the source, that means material on the airborne operation will be thin gruel.
                              Leadership is the ability to rise above conventional wisdom.

                              Comment

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