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  • Canadians vs. Hitler Youth

    Hi, I'm new.

    John Keegan and others refer to the rather personal nature and viciousness that occurred between the invading Canadian Army and the Hitler Youth SS Division. Does anybody know more about theis (Details, anecdotes) or have a kink that might help me?
    Will no one tell me what she sings?--
    Perhaps the plaintive numbers flow
    For old, unhappy, far-off things,
    And battles long ago:
    -William Wordsworth, "The Solitary Reaper"

  • #2
    Originally posted by Desiree Clary View Post
    Hi, I'm new.

    John Keegan and others refer to the rather personal nature and viciousness that occurred between the invading Canadian Army and the Hitler Youth SS Division. Does anybody know more about theis (Details, anecdotes) or have a kink that might help me?

    If a kink would help you, you may be on the wrong forums.

    Just kidding.
    You may want to consider using the search feature as there have been several threads about this subject.
    Scientists have announced they've discovered a cure for apathy. However no one has shown the slightest bit of interest !!

    Comment


    • #3
      Thanks!
      Will no one tell me what she sings?--
      Perhaps the plaintive numbers flow
      For old, unhappy, far-off things,
      And battles long ago:
      -William Wordsworth, "The Solitary Reaper"

      Comment


      • #4
        Hey Pierre,
        I have looked/searched but can't find any specific thread. Help needed.
        SPORTS FREAK/ PANZERBLITZ COMMANDER/ CC2 COMMANDER

        Comment


        • #5
          From: http://www.holocaustresearchproject....tleryouth.html

          The year 1943 marked the military turning point for Hitler's Reich. In January, the German Sixth Army was destroyed by the Soviets at Stalingrad and the call to arms amongst the ranks of the Hitler Youth was raised. The result was the formation of the 12th SS-Panzer Division Hitlerjugend.

          The division was deployed during the Battle of Normandy to be deployed against the British and Canadian forces in the north of Caen. During the following months, the Hitlerjugend division earned itself a reputation for ferocity and fanaticism.


          13 year old Hitler Youth captured near Nartinzell

          Towards the fall of 1944, many of the Hitler Youth were drafted into service digging anti-tank ditches around eastern German towns to stop the advancing Red Army, and in the west to stem the advance of the Allied forces. Hundreds of miles of trenches were frantically dug by young boys all over the country.

          By September of the same year, the war had taken its toll on German youth. The Hitlerjugend division numbered only 600 surviving soldiers, and with little ammunition and no armor, thousands had of young lives were wasted in Normandy and Falaise. The division also participated in the failed Battle of the Bulge, and were later sent to Hungary where they participated in the failed attempt to recapture Budapest.


          On May 8, 1945, numbering just 455 soldiers and one tank, the 12th SS-Panzer Division Hitlerjugend surrendered to the American 7th Army.
          The Hitler Youth formed a major part of the last line of German defense, and were reportedly among the fiercest fighters. The city commander, General Helmuth Weidling, ordered Axmann to disband the Hitler Youth combat formations but the order was never carried out, and many more Hitler Youth died defending Berlin street by street from the ever-advancing Soviet army.

          The Hitler Youth was disbanded by Allied authorities as part of the De-Nazification process and many of its leaders were put on trial by Allied authorities for corrupting the hearts and minds of millions of young Germans.
          "The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." Bertrand Russell

          Comment


          • #6
            Wow, thanks
            Will no one tell me what she sings?--
            Perhaps the plaintive numbers flow
            For old, unhappy, far-off things,
            And battles long ago:
            -William Wordsworth, "The Solitary Reaper"

            Comment


            • #7
              Nice informations.
              "Give me 100 000 croatian soldiers and I will conqure all world" - Napoleon Bonaparte

              Soldiers are coming and leaving while war will never end.

              Comment


              • #8
                A very detailed account of fighting between the Hitler Youth and Canadian forces can be read at: http://www.waffen-ss.no/SS-Panzer-Di...tlerjugend.htm

                Here's an extract:

                According to accounts from Canadian prisoners who survived the events, the youth of the Hitler Jugend were frustrated and mad with rage and there were numerous incidences of North Nova prisoners being shot, bludgeoned to death and even run over with a truck while they were being marched along a road. Battle casualties for the day on both sides were virtually even. Both forces suffered approximately 80 killed and around 175 wounded or captured. It was a hard and bloody fight to a draw.
                Philip
                "The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts." Bertrand Russell

                Comment


                • #9
                  Wherever adolf's SS fanatics turned up in Normandy, from whatever Division, the Geneva Convention went out the window, on both sides.

                  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ardenne_Abbey
                  The long toll of the brave
                  Is not lost in darkness
                  Over the fruitful earth
                  And athwart the seas
                  Hath passed the light of noble deeds
                  Unquenchable forever.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by dgfred View Post
                    Hey Pierre,
                    I have looked/searched but can't find any specific thread. Help needed.

                    I know there are some posts that mention the various battles of the bridgehead like Bretteville-L'Orgueilleuse, Putot-en-Bessin, Buron and Authie but they are probably hidden in threads with other names.

                    I've dug through the internet and some of my saved sites and come up with a few.


                    http://www.junobeach.org/e/2/can-eve-rod-nor-cam-e.htm

                    http://www.canadiansoldiers.com/hist...otenbessin.htm

                    http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/UN/C...ormandy-2.html

                    http://www.canadaatwar.ca/content-33...attle-account/

                    http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/6233353491/

                    http://www.triposo.com/poi/W__19614429
                    Scientists have announced they've discovered a cure for apathy. However no one has shown the slightest bit of interest !!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Desiree Clary View Post
                      John Keegan and others refer to the rather personal nature and viciousness that occurred between the invading Canadian Army and the Hitler Youth SS Division.
                      Actually there is a ton of information available about the Canadian Army's liberation of Normandy and its subsequent combat with the 12th SS Panzer Division.

                      First off, please don't get fooled by the SS Division's title of 'Hitlerjugend.' It was formed from a draft of Germanic males from the occupied territories who had reached the age of 17 by 1943. The officers and NCOs were taken from the 1st SS Panzer Division 'Hitler's Bodyguard.' After a year of training the 12th SS was sent to Normandy as part of the armoured reserve.

                      When the Canadians landed at Juno Beach they advanced inland to the south and began combat operations against the 12th SS who were advancing north from Caen. You are correct in that the fighting was vicious, close and hateful. Prisoners were killed on both sides.

                      By the time of the break-out from Normandy the 12th SS was virtually destroyed as a formation and was never again as strong in numbers nor as effective in combat.

                      After the war, the crimes of the SS involving the shooting of Canadian prisoners was followed up by the Canadian Forces and the SS Division commander, Kurt Meyer, stood trial for murder. He was found guilty and sentenced to death, but the Canadian General in charge of the court martial (Major-General Chris Vokes) commuted the sentence to life in prison. Vokes said of his mitigation that Canadian soldiers were doing the same thing to the SS soldiers that the SS soldiers were doing to Canadians.

                      Kurt Meyer served about 10 years in a Canadian prison before being paroled back to Germany where he lived a good life as a beer salesman. In fact he sold beer to the Canadian Army NATO camps in Westphalia. He was also a lecturer at the Canadian Army Staff College in Kingston, and was apparently held in high regard by his guests. He eventually died of natural causes. Fifteen-thousand people attended his funeral.

                      There are now monuments in the farmyards in Normandy were the Canadian soldiers were murdered by the SS.

                      See if you can get a hold of Meeting of the Generals (1986) by Tony Foster, or Steel Inferno (2008) by Michael Reynolds.

                      Cheers,
                      Dan.

                      So long as men worship the Caesars and Napoleons, Caesars and Napoleons will duly rise and make them miserable.

                      Aldous Huxley: Ends and Means (1937)

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by PhilipLaos View Post
                        From: http://www.holocaustresearchproject....tleryouth.html

                        The year 1943 marked the military turning point for Hitler's Reich. In January, the German Sixth Army was destroyed by the Soviets at Stalingrad and the call to arms amongst the ranks of the Hitler Youth was raised. The result was the formation of the 12th SS-Panzer Division Hitlerjugend.

                        The division was deployed during the Battle of Normandy to be deployed against the British and Canadian forces in the north of Caen. During the following months, the Hitlerjugend division earned itself a reputation for ferocity and fanaticism.


                        13 year old Hitler Youth captured near Nartinzell

                        Towards the fall of 1944, many of the Hitler Youth were drafted into service digging anti-tank ditches around eastern German towns to stop the advancing Red Army, and in the west to stem the advance of the Allied forces. Hundreds of miles of trenches were frantically dug by young boys all over the country.

                        By September of the same year, the war had taken its toll on German youth. The Hitlerjugend division numbered only 600 surviving soldiers, and with little ammunition and no armor, thousands had of young lives were wasted in Normandy and Falaise. The division also participated in the failed Battle of the Bulge, and were later sent to Hungary where they participated in the failed attempt to recapture Budapest.


                        On May 8, 1945, numbering just 455 soldiers and one tank, the 12th SS-Panzer Division Hitlerjugend surrendered to the American 7th Army.
                        The Hitler Youth formed a major part of the last line of German defense, and were reportedly among the fiercest fighters. The city commander, General Helmuth Weidling, ordered Axmann to disband the Hitler Youth combat formations but the order was never carried out, and many more Hitler Youth died defending Berlin street by street from the ever-advancing Soviet army.

                        The Hitler Youth was disbanded by Allied authorities as part of the De-Nazification process and many of its leaders were put on trial by Allied authorities for corrupting the hearts and minds of millions of young Germans.
                        You are simplifying matters somewhat.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Add "Holding Juno" by Zuehlke and "Fields of Fire" by Terry Copp as good books on the topic.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by AdrianE View Post
                            Add "Holding Juno" by Zuehlke and "Fields of Fire" by Terry Copp as good books on the topic.

                            Both very good, though I do prefer Zuehlke's.
                            Scientists have announced they've discovered a cure for apathy. However no one has shown the slightest bit of interest !!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by AdrianE View Post
                              Add "Holding Juno" by Zuehlke and "Fields of Fire" by Terry Copp as good books on the topic.
                              I own the latter, haven't had a chance to read it yet.
                              A wild liberal appears! Conservative uses logical reasoning and empirical evidence! It's super effective! Wild liberal faints.

                              Comment

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