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  • Mig-17 equivalents

    Which western aircraft are considered equals of Mig-17 in the fighter /interceptor role ?

    G-91Y
    F-86D
    Mystair Dassault
    Hawker Hunter
    Javelin ?

    any other ones ?

    Can the Mig-17 survive against more modern fighters like F-8, F-100 etc in point defence interceptor role ?

  • #2
    Originally posted by nastle View Post
    Which western aircraft are considered equals of Mig-17 in the fighter /interceptor role ?

    G-91Y
    F-86D
    Mystair Dassault
    Hawker Hunter
    Javelin ?

    any other ones ?

    Can the Mig-17 survive against more modern fighters like F-8, F-100 etc in point defence interceptor role ?
    Not sure I'd include the Javelin - much more an all weather specialist
    Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe (H G Wells)
    Mit der Dummheit kaempfen Goetter selbst vergebens (Friedrich von Schiller)

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    • #3
      But the Mig-17 had some all weather versions as well, albiet not in the same category in terms of capability

      I was thinking more in terms of performance , agility and armament

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      • #4
        Originally posted by nastle View Post
        Which western aircraft are considered equals of Mig-17 in the fighter /interceptor role ?

        G-91Y
        F-86D
        Mystair Dassault
        Hawker Hunter
        Javelin ?

        any other ones ?

        Can the Mig-17 survive against more modern fighters like F-8, F-100 etc in point defence interceptor role ?
        The Dassault MD.454 Mystère IV was the successor to the Dassault Mystère, and the Israeli AF did good work with them, shooting down some Mig-15s and Mig-17s, and even at least one Mig-21 during the Suez Crisis and Six-Day War.

        You'll live, only the best get killed.

        -General Charles de Gaulle

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        • #5
          Originally posted by nastle View Post
          But the Mig-17 had some all weather versions as well, albiet not in the same category in terms of capability

          I was thinking more in terms of performance , agility and armament
          So was I. The Javelin was not a point defence fighter and was not intended for fighter to fighter dog fights. Essentially it would be a bomber killer especially at night or in poor visibility.
          Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe (H G Wells)
          Mit der Dummheit kaempfen Goetter selbst vergebens (Friedrich von Schiller)

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          • #6
            Originally posted by nastle View Post
            Can the Mig-17 survive against more modern fighters like F-8, F-100 etc in point defence interceptor role ?
            Appears that the MiG-17 held its own against both the F-8 and the F-4.

            If you review all of the F-8 kills scored in Vietnam (originally scored as 18, now at least 19, but possibly 20 or 21 depending on how you score a probable and one in which the pilot bailed out before the F-8 could kill the MiG), then you will find that in many cases the MiG-17s were either flying straight while disengaging, setting up a shot on another aircraft (typically A-4s), or just popped up in front of an F-8 unaware that the F-8 was there and had a good firing opportunity. Many of the pilots clearly reported that they were pulling little or no G at the time of firing the fatal shots since their targets were pulling little or no G. If the MiG-17s had been aware they were under attack and utilized their turn capability, Even the AIM-9D would have been much less effective. Guns were used effectively only 2 or 3 times of the 18 or 20 kills scored. The peformance capabilities the F-8 used against the MiG-17 were: acceleration, climb, and speed, NEVER turning. Separation and mutual support were almost always used to allow turns/reversals with the general exception being quick breaks used to cause overshoots by rapidly appraoching attackers. The only way an F-8 could convert onto a MiG-17s tail is if the MiG-17 wasn't using its full turn performance.

            Combat Ace-dot-com
            Further down on that page are descriptions of all of the F-8's kills versus Mig-17s.

            Couldn't help myself, so I did the math: the F-8 had almost twice the wing loading as the MiG-17, indicating that the MiG-17 should have been able to out-maneuever the F-8 fairly easily at low speed. The factor overlooked by the OP is pilot training: which service invested more time and effort and resources in to pilot training: USN, USMC, USAF, or NVAF? As the war in Viet Nam ground on, USN, USMC, and USAF brass came to be dissatisfied with their services' performance, and thus requested proposals for new anti-radiation measures like "Wild Weasel" and later HARM and "stealth," new air-superiority fighters like the F-14 and F-15, and new pilot training programs like the Navy's and the Air Force's Fighter Weapons Schools aka "Top Gun." Those developments should be viewed as an indicator of the level of satisfaction the service chiefs felt with their performance against NVAF.
            I was married for two ******* years! Hell would be like Club Med! - Sam Kinison

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