Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Most Maligned Weapons System that Proved Critics Wrong

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Most Maligned Weapons System that Proved Critics Wrong

    Now accepting nominatons for weapons systems that have stood the test of time and proved their critics wrong.. I'll start off the list:

    - M-16 and its many variants

  • #2
    Tell it to the jamming victims of VietNam war and the USMC compound in Beirut and certain checkpoints in Baghdad, etc.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by علامت پیروز View Post
      Tell it to the jamming victims of VietNam war and the USMC compound in Beirut and certain checkpoints in Baghdad, etc.
      You really have to learn to let go.. VN was a looong time ago

      Comment


      • #4
        Well...this one is hard one...

        I thinks even AK47 can get into category...Michael Kalashikov had to fight many bureaucracy,rival designers and sceptical military commanders until finally producing one of finest guns in history.

        Or naval bombers almoust none believed they would change course of naval warfare
        It is always more difficult to fight against faith than against knowledge.

        Косово је Србија!
        Never go to war with a country whose national holiday celebrates a defeat in 1389.

        Armored Brigade

        Armored Brigade Facebook page

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by nikolas93TS View Post
          Well...this one is hard one...

          I thinks even AK47 can get into category...Michael Kalashikov had to fight many bureaucracy,rival designers and sceptical military commanders until finally producing one of finest guns in history.

          Or naval bombers almoust none believed they would change course of naval warfare
          Yeah, Billy Mitchell was a true visionary of the value of bombers in general.

          Another nominee : Abrams MBT

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by kuma View Post
            You really have to learn to let go.. VN was a looong time ago
            There were complaints during the last decade! Even now, the M4 is being maligned by some in Afghanistan for lack of stopping power, range, etc.

            Really, the victims of the USMC compound in Beirut should have had a better weapon- even AKs! Heck even the Israelis built an AK "Galil" (ala Valmet) before US congressmen heaped Colts upon them c/o US taxpayers.
            Last edited by علامت پیروز; 16 Jun 10, 03:44.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by علامت پیروز View Post
              There were complaints during the last decade! Even now, the M4 is being maligned by some in Afghanistan for lack of stopping power, range, etc.

              Really, the victims of the USMC compound in Beirut should have had a better weapon- even AKs! Heck even the Israelis built an AK "Galil" (ala Valmet) before US congressmen heaped Colts upon them c/o US taxpayers.
              The problems with the M-16 were identfied and remedied a long time ago. Switching to a cleaner burning ammo and requiring soldiers to actually clean their weapons largely solved reliability concerns. The fact that it serves as the backbone of the US armed forces and that of many other countries' armed forces half a century later speaks volumes.
              As for Beirut, were the rifles even loaded at the time the compound was struck? Anyway, you're not going to stop a charging truck with any assault rifle.. try a cannon or RPG.

              Comment


              • #8
                The submarine..........now the ultimate weapons system.
                "It's like shooting rats in a barrel."
                "You'll be in a barrel if you don't watch out for the fighters!"

                "Talking about airplanes is a very pleasant mental disease."
                Sergei(son of Igor) Sikorsky, 'AOPA Pilot' magazine February 2003.

                Comment


                • #9
                  The A-10. Seemingly universally hated by its own operating service, it has proven itself time and again as one of the most versatile and useful weapons platforms in current warfare. The last dinosaur, if I may, or the last iteration of the Class A manned tactical bomb truck.
                  Last edited by TacCovert4; 16 Jun 10, 04:18.
                  Tacitos, Satrap of Kyrene

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Basically the aeroplane as a weapons platform was said to be a useless and stupid idea.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by علامت پیروز View Post
                      Tell it to the jamming victims of VietNam war and the USMC compound in Beirut and certain checkpoints in Baghdad, etc.
                      If properly maintained, the M16 family is perfectly capable of consistently good operation without issues.

                      Oh, and with one plus, the M16 is headshot accurate out to 500yds. How do I know? I consistently do it every single rifle range. In fact, I'm going to try to beat my 9 out of 10 next month with a 10 for 10 in the head at 500yds (last year I had a hit in the lower neck/shoulder region, though I personally think that to be BS on the part of the scorer ).

                      As for reliability, I've had consistent reliability both from my issued and personal member of the AR15/M16 family. The key is to keep the bolt and carrier channel clean, and to not overlubricate. Every single problem post-vietnam given to the M16A2 and better in the series can be traced to one of those issues. The Army convoy (Jessica Lynch)? Lack of proper cleaning and overlubrication in desert conditions caused the vast majority of those weapons to jam. IIRC the team that secured the site found that most of the weapons were jammed and totally unusable without disassembly and cleaning.

                      If you wish to doubt the M16 family for reliabilty purposes, you grab your AK47 (which I will admit is heinously reliable. Heck, It'd probably shoot in a sandstorm on the moon) and I'll grab my AR15. We'll start shooting at each other at 600m. See who goes down first............
                      Tacitos, Satrap of Kyrene

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        The Russian Lavochkin fighter of WWII which started out as one of the most widely disliked fighter types in the Red Air Force. The breakthrough came when the hated LaGG-3 was fitted with a Shvetsov ASh-82 radial engine. Because of the failure of the LaGG-3 fighter, the Lavochkin beaureau was out of favor with Stalin and was facing a termination of production. It could have been the end of the beaureau itself because Stalin wasn't very forgiving to industrial leaders who had let him down.

                        If fact, there was so little time to the termination of the LaGG production that Lavochkin didn't even have the time to design a true prototype. They simply took a service LaGG fighter, removed the original inline engine, and installed the new radial. The new radial had a wider cross-section than the fuselage so simple skirting was bonded to the fuselage with glue to blend in the engine.

                        It was a rough-and-ready solution that would have given Reginald Mitchell or Kelly Johnson a heart attack if they saw how that engine was "streamlined", but it resulted in fairly outstanding performance.

                        I don't think it was a sensational aircraft by American standards; most Soviet WWII combat aircraft, including the LaGG/La series suffered from extremely poor quality of manufacturing and were harder to fly. In the La-5 rapid acceleration required pushing 6 separate levers. Accelerating by just pushing the throttle as we do it in computer games required an automatic engine governor which was pretty much an analog computer. The Focke-Wulf 190 had such an automatic governor, but it was beyond the means of the Soviets.

                        Nevertheless, it was a very good plane by the standards of Soviet WWII production.

                        Last edited by MonsterZero; 16 Jun 10, 05:34.

                        "Artillery adds dignity to what would otherwise be a ugly brawl."
                        --Frederick II, King of Prussia

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re the M-16;

                          Isn't the first lesson any soldier learns is to maintain his weapon ?

                          Issuing front-line troops with an unproven weapon and no cleaning kit is asking for trouble, by anyone's standards.

                          Mine are the sten-gun (sorry LCM1) and the PIAT (that bl**dy drainpipe).

                          Resistance fighters all over Europe were very happy with the sten, and it's reputation with paratroops can partly be explained by facing a numerically-superior enemy armed with a mix of self-loading and assault rifles.

                          No SMG can compete on those terms.

                          As for the PIAT, crude, heavy, ugly, yes, but how many of its contemporaries could shoot high explosive, lay down smoke, be fired from an enclosed space and still take out a King Tiger ?
                          Indyref2 - still, "Yes."

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            The M2/M3 Bradley.It's development showcased some of the problems with the US defense industry,but it really grew into a fine vehicle.
                            ALL LIVES SPLATTER!

                            BLACK JEEPS MATTER!

                            BLACK MOTORCYCLES MATTER!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by علامت پیروز View Post
                              Tell it to the jamming victims of VietNam war and the USMC compound in Beirut and certain checkpoints in Baghdad, etc.
                              But most of these problems were caused by human error....."maintenance free " weapon system......No such thing as " maintenance free" in any operating system from fire arms to space shuttles.....you always have to clean dust off everything..PLUS the fact that Winchester messed around with the powder formula and produced a "dirty" powder....

                              Comment

                              Latest Topics

                              Collapse

                              Working...
                              X