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Prussian and Austrian strengths during Napoleonic Wars

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  • Prussian and Austrian strengths during Napoleonic Wars

    Great Britain had the Royal Navy & money
    France had its Revolutionary élan & mititlary efficiency
    Russia had an endless supply of cannon fodder and territory

    What are the typical assets of Austria and Prussia during the Napoleonic Wars??? What do you think?
    Death is nothing, but to live defeated and inglorious is to die daily.- Napoleon

    It is better to fail in originality than to succeed in imitation.- Herman Melville

    Aut viam inveniam aut faciam

    BORG

  • #2
    Originally posted by Stratego View Post
    Great Britain had the Royal Navy & money
    France had its Revolutionary élan & mititlary efficiency
    Russia had an endless supply of cannon fodder and territory

    What are the typical assets of Austria and Prussia during the Napoleonic Wars??? What do you think?
    The Austrians excelled at expanding their territory through strategic marriages. ...... N
    The trout who swims against the current gets the most oxygen..

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    • #3
      Depends on when
      In the first years the Austrians had some excellent light cavalry and light infantry and the Prussians very strong discipline but both were very rigid and conservative in their doctrine. After defeat by France Austria became even more inflexible but Prussia went the other way and became prepared to innovate
      Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe (H G Wells)
      Mit der Dummheit kaempfen Goetter selbst vergebens (Friedrich von Schiller)

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Stratego View Post
        (…)
        Russia had an endless supply of cannon fodder...
        So arguably had the Austrians after the establishment of the Landwehr, I've seen numbers as high as 600.000 at the start of the 1809 campaign…

        and territory
        The main weak point seems to have been their capital, and their heartland was in easy marching distance for the French.


        Their grenadiers were numerous and quite famous, as was their "feudal" heavy cavalry - if not always managed effectively in battles and campaigns.
        High Admiral Snowy, Commander In Chief of the Naval Forces of The Phoenix Confederation.
        Major Atticus Finch - ACW Rainbow Co.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Stratego View Post
          Russia had an endless supply of cannon fodder and territory
          Actually Russia had smaller population than Greater France under Napoleon. Napoleon's Empire population in 1812 - 44 mln.
          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_French_Empire
          Russian Empire in 1812 - 42.8 mln
          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_Empire
          of which very large groups were exempt from military service.

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          • #6
            Austria's greatest strength was its tremendous 'get up again' quality. No matter how many times France knocked them down, Austria got up again to re-enter the fight. France could never keep them down.

            I don't think any other power fought the French as often, and lost as often as the Austrians?

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            • #7
              upper, in Europe
              Originally posted by Artyom_A View Post
              Actually Russia had smaller population than Greater France under Napoleon. Napoleon's Empire population in 1812 - 44 mln.
              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_French_Empire
              Russian Empire in 1812 - 42.8 mln
              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_Empire
              of which very large groups were exempt from military service.
              That is a very good point. My ancestors took up land in the new Russian colonies, under a charter that released them form conscription, in order to get away form the $%$##@^**&^%Prussian *()&^$$#Junkers.

              've become more favorable towards Napoleon over time. For all his faults, the upper classes in continental Europe were overdue for a wake up call.
              The trout who swims against the current gets the most oxygen..

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by marktwain View Post
                (…)
                've become more favorable towards Napoleon over time. For all his faults, the upper classes in continental Europe were overdue for a wake up call.
                It could be said that Napoleons rule was already a "restoration" in itself - compared to the chaotic, murderous insanity of the revolution that went before…,

                his main problem was that he attempted to insert a dynasty of his own, into the existing feudal family European system, and they just were not going to "let them in".

                His tragedy was he came too early to introduce true democracy, too late to start a dynasty.
                High Admiral Snowy, Commander In Chief of the Naval Forces of The Phoenix Confederation.
                Major Atticus Finch - ACW Rainbow Co.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Snowygerry View Post

                  It could be said that Napoleons rule was already a "restoration" in itself - compared to the chaotic, murderous insanity of the revolution that went before…,

                  his main problem was that he attempted to insert a dynasty of his own, into the existing feudal family European system, and they just were not going to "let them in".

                  His tragedy was he came too early to introduce true democracy, too late to start a dynasty.
                  In 1750,
                  Maria Theresa
                  commanded a royal commission to study the decline in tax receipts from Bohemia. They found out that landlords had seized lands from peasants. Since only the peasants paid taxes, the royal revenues decreased. As a response, she issued a series of ordinances to protect the peasants from oppressiv obligations to the landlords. Fees paid by peasants to landlords were regulated from Vienna; rules preventing peasants from selling in the free market were repealed; the lord's authority over justice were diminished, and peasants were allowed to complain against the lords before imperial officers.


                  https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php...ldid=815788021

                  Part of Napoleon's genius was to give smallholders' ironclad title. Men fought like tigers in return.
                  The trout who swims against the current gets the most oxygen..

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Maria Theresa is quite well known here.....

                    She was considered an "enlightened" despot here,

                    https://stamgent.be/nl_be/collectie/kunstwerken/00633

                    In one of those historical ironies as they often happen, the Belgian provinces were in the middle of an (unsuccessful) revolt against the Habsburgs when they were overran by French revolutionaries overthrowing the Bourbons.

                    And of course Napoleons corpse wasn't even rotten when Belgians rose up in revolt again - this time against the House of Orange.

                    Napoleons rule wasn't so unique as some here make it out to be, it perfectly fitted the trend of the times
                    High Admiral Snowy, Commander In Chief of the Naval Forces of The Phoenix Confederation.
                    Major Atticus Finch - ACW Rainbow Co.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Snowygerry View Post
                      His tragedy was he came too early to introduce true democracy, too late to start a dynasty.
                      The United States had managed it. I guess George Washington was a far greater man than Napoleon Buonaparte.

                      Also Napoleons nephew became Emperor and if it hadn't have been for those pesky Prussians, France might have had a Bonaparte on the throne today.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Gooner View Post
                        The United States had managed it.
                        On an isolated continent, yes, and even then only with help of a French King.

                        Also Napoleons nephew became Emperor and if it hadn't have been for those pesky Prussians, France might have had a Bonaparte on the throne today.
                        I seriously doubt that
                        High Admiral Snowy, Commander In Chief of the Naval Forces of The Phoenix Confederation.
                        Major Atticus Finch - ACW Rainbow Co.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Gooner View Post

                          The United States had managed it. I guess George Washington was a far greater man than Napoleon Buonaparte.

                          Also Napoleons nephew became Emperor and if it hadn't have been for those pesky Prussians, France might have had a Bonaparte on the throne today.
                          The United States was not a democracy upon its creation with the new Constitution in the late 1780s. The new nation was a constitutional republic, which it still is.

                          Napoleon greatly admired Washington and the French Army was put into mourning upon his death in 1799,
                          We are not now that strength which in old days
                          Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
                          Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
                          To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Massena View Post

                            The United States was not a democracy upon its creation with the new Constitution in the late 1780s. The new nation was a constitutional republic, which it still is.

                            Napoleon greatly admired Washington and the French Army was put into mourning upon his death in 1799,
                            It is possible to be a democracy but not a republic and there are plenty of very undemocratic republics in the world today.

                            There were some amongst the founding fathers that wanted an elected monarchy even!
                            Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe (H G Wells)
                            Mit der Dummheit kaempfen Goetter selbst vergebens (Friedrich von Schiller)

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by MarkV View Post

                              It is possible to be a democracy but not a republic and there are plenty of very undemocratic republics in the world today.

                              There were some amongst the founding fathers that wanted an elected monarchy even!
                              The bottom line is that the United States was not a democracy during the period and by definition it still isn't because the president is not directly elected by the people. When the US Constitution was passed and put into effect Senators were not either-they were appointed.
                              We are not now that strength which in old days
                              Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
                              Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
                              To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

                              Comment

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