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  • How will the second US civil war go?

    The United States are deeply divided. The success of the Tea Party movement both inflames emotions and may bring forth a Republican president who will further deepen the divide, only in the other direction, thus assuring that no conciliator will approach from either side.

    I am not asking who will start the second American civil war, because I know already what each and everyone of you will say: the other guys, because they are bad.

    No I wonder how it will develop. Especially former and current members of the military I ask how strong is the obedience of the military forces towards the Commander-in-Chief, particularly if he happens to be a Democrat?
    And of loyally runs high even IF the president is unpopular among the armed forces, how much of misconduct during the internal crisis will it take for units to switch sides? How much "they provoked us" will you take as an excuse from the combat factions, and respectively how much from the people you sympathize with and how much from the other camp?
    Which forces lean to what political camp, and how strongly? Is it true that technical specialists have a rather high quota of Democratic sympathizers that could sabotage the civil war effort if they find themselves on the Republican side? Conversely, will the bulk of all armed services stick with the GOP?
    How strong are the fighting capabilities of the state? And will military bases be able to enforce the rule of the government's side of the conflict or will they be taken by the state's or even switch sides to the state they are in?

    A lot of questions, but please stick to the technicals and spare me how the other side sacrifices babies to Satan so he will grant them their wish of an unholy orgy with Hitler and Stalin, I only want to hear the military side, not the moral one.
    Reaction to the 2016 Munich shootings:
    Europe: "We are shocked and support you in these harsh times, we stand by you."
    USA: "We will check people from Germany extra-hard and it is your own damn fault for being so stupid."

  • #2
    Originally posted by Acheron View Post
    The United States are deeply divided. The success of the Tea Party movement both inflames emotions and may bring forth a Republican president who will further deepen the divide, only in the other direction, thus assuring that no conciliator will approach from either side.

    I am not asking who will start the second American civil war, because I know already what each and everyone of you will say: the other guys, because they are bad.

    No I wonder how it will develop. Especially former and current members of the military I ask how strong is the obedience of the military forces towards the Commander-in-Chief, particularly if he happens to be a Democrat?
    And of loyally runs high even IF the president is unpopular among the armed forces, how much of misconduct during the internal crisis will it take for units to switch sides? How much "they provoked us" will you take as an excuse from the combat factions, and respectively how much from the people you sympathize with and how much from the other camp?
    Which forces lean to what political camp, and how strongly? Is it true that technical specialists have a rather high quota of Democratic sympathizers that could sabotage the civil war effort if they find themselves on the Republican side? Conversely, will the bulk of all armed services stick with the GOP?
    How strong are the fighting capabilities of the state? And will military bases be able to enforce the rule of the government's side of the conflict or will they be taken by the state's or even switch sides to the state they are in?

    A lot of questions, but please stick to the technicals and spare me how the other side sacrifices babies to Satan so he will grant them their wish of an unholy orgy with Hitler and Stalin, I only want to hear the military side, not the moral one.
    The chances of a new civil war are extremely slim, if nothing else because most members of the armed forces are conservatives. Now, a conservative coup d'etat is far more likely.
    Give me a fast ship and the wind at my back for I intend to sail in harms way! (John Paul Jones)

    Initiated Chief Petty Officer
    Hard core! Old School! Deal with it!

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by bass_man86 View Post
      The chances of a new civil war are extremely slim, if nothing else because most members of the armed forces are conservatives. Now, a conservative coup d'etat is far more likely.
      Fair enough, however, wouldn't many soldiers and officers object to such a move of the Pentagon, thus creating an outright war between President-loyalists and Pentagon-loyalists? And what about the states that disagree, the Pentagon would need to rule through force some of them, couldn't resistance amount to more than petty insurgency?
      Reaction to the 2016 Munich shootings:
      Europe: "We are shocked and support you in these harsh times, we stand by you."
      USA: "We will check people from Germany extra-hard and it is your own damn fault for being so stupid."

      Comment


      • #4
        I really don't see a civil war... Not at all... In my very worst case cenario, some political reforms and a couple street riots.
        Some sort of right wing militia fighting an evil communist armour division in the fields of Texas? Don't see anything like that happening. A civil war is still a war, I don't antecipate any kind of war in US land anytime soon.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Acheron View Post
          The United States are deeply divided. The success of the Tea Party movement both inflames emotions and may bring forth a Republican president who will further deepen the divide, only in the other direction, thus assuring that no conciliator will approach from either side.

          I am not asking who will start the second American civil war, because I know already what each and everyone of you will say: the other guys, because they are bad.

          No I wonder how it will develop. Especially former and current members of the military I ask how strong is the obedience of the military forces towards the Commander-in-Chief, particularly if he happens to be a Democrat?
          And of loyally runs high even IF the president is unpopular among the armed forces, how much of misconduct during the internal crisis will it take for units to switch sides? How much "they provoked us" will you take as an excuse from the combat factions, and respectively how much from the people you sympathize with and how much from the other camp?
          Which forces lean to what political camp, and how strongly? Is it true that technical specialists have a rather high quota of Democratic sympathizers that could sabotage the civil war effort if they find themselves on the Republican side? Conversely, will the bulk of all armed services stick with the GOP?
          How strong are the fighting capabilities of the state? And will military bases be able to enforce the rule of the government's side of the conflict or will they be taken by the state's or even switch sides to the state they are in?

          A lot of questions, but please stick to the technicals and spare me how the other side sacrifices babies to Satan so he will grant them their wish of an unholy orgy with Hitler and Stalin, I only want to hear the military side, not the moral one.
          It'll go exactly how ones imagination wants it to go.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Castro View Post
            I really don't see a civil war... Not at all... In my very worst case cenario, some political reforms and a couple street riots.
            Some sort of right wing militia fighting an evil communist armour division in the fields of Texas? Don't see anything like that happening. A civil war is still a war, I don't antecipate any kind of war in US land anytime soon.
            Agree, and if I may add, I personally see the Tea Party splitting the right, rather than weakening the left. In any case, I personally regard the Tea Party as the last hurrah of a white America that is reluctantly facing up to the fact that in the very near future people of European descendance will be the minority. I see people that hail from Latin America taking over the reins of power in the United States,and to be clear, this does not necessarily mean that liberals will have things their way. People of Cuban extraction tend to vote Republican, and the general tendency among minorities is to become more conservative as they become part and parcel of American society. Nonetheless, I believe that the days white hands holding the reins of power in America have ended with the election of Barak Obama. All we can do now is turn and face the changes, to what degree of serenity will be an individual choice.
            Give me a fast ship and the wind at my back for I intend to sail in harms way! (John Paul Jones)

            Initiated Chief Petty Officer
            Hard core! Old School! Deal with it!

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by bass_man86 View Post
              Agree, and if I may add, I personally see the Tea Party splitting the right, rather than weakening the left. In any case, I personally regard the Tea Party as the last hurrah of a white America that is reluctantly facing up to the fact that in the very near future people of European descendance will be the minority. I see people that hail from Latin America taking over the reins of power in the United States,and to be clear, this does not necessarily mean that liberals will have things their way. People of Cuban extraction tend to vote Republican, and the general tendency among minorities is to become more conservative as they become part and parcel of American society. Nonetheless, I believe that the days white hands holding the reins of power in America have ended with the election of Barak Obama. All we can do now is turn and face the changes, to what degree of serenity will be an individual choice.
              If there is to be civil war, that is it. White people in America do not have the cultural mindset to become like the Whites in Mexico: a minority that runs everything top to bottom. It's been said the Mexican Legislature is whiter than the Harvard Yacht Club, and there's a reason for that. White people will at some point before 2050 flip out over there inevitable loss of demographic hegemony, the backbone of their power, society will collapse like in the early days of the Spanish Civil War. More than that we will be the Serbs in this Yugoslavia and this time there will be no NATO to stop us. The Whites will win; there will be no division of the country and because most minorities lives in the cities, far more so than whites, starving them into submission would not be hard (yes I know there's a lot of Latinos in the rural ares, but by percentage it's not a lot). I would like to say there will be no genocide, but I can't make that guarantee.

              I actually don't think it will be a Nazi style white supremacy that will drive this. Asians and affluent (probably white looking) Hispanics will make common cause with the Whites while on the other side there will be Blacks and Hispanics. I say this because those groups are both wealthy and largely bought into the American Dream. There is the chance this could be avoided, the way different ethnicity's found common ground before. We could all just say 'Hey, at least we're not Black.' Really, any anthropologist dealing with America will tell you the divide in this country have never been Who is White? But rather, Who is Black? And I hate to point out Blacks are not particularly well liked by any non-Black group. Civil War though requires more than Blacks in revolt, and the only people who could have common cause with them are unassimilated Latinos. And I mean been here three generations and not been made white like the Irish and Italians.

              I kinda see this reversal of racial values to be inevitable because if White people truly understood the dangers of interracial assimilation, we would have sealed the border in 1990 and there wouldn't be a Muslim in Western Europe. Whites don't feel threatened...yet. When they do, the Swastikas will fly again. But that moment will end quickly. A cleansed West will lead to a "normalization" of politics, and the Nazis-esque thugs will be unable to provide things like job growth, infrastructure rebuilding and such. Not to mention we needed them for a dirty task and the task is done. By 2100, the West will be lilly white and most democratic.
              How many Allied tanks it would take to destroy a Maus?
              275. Because that's how many shells there are in the Maus. Then it could probably crush some more until it ran out of gas. - Surfinbird

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Wolery View Post
                If there is to be civil war, that is it. White people in America do not have the cultural mindset to become like the Whites in Mexico: a minority that runs everything top to bottom. It's been said the Mexican Legislature is whiter than the Harvard Yacht Club, and there's a reason for that. White people will at some point before 2050 flip out over there inevitable loss of demographic hegemony, the backbone of their power, society will collapse like in the early days of the Spanish Civil War. More than that we will be the Serbs in this Yugoslavia and this time there will be no NATO to stop us. The Whites will win; there will be no division of the country and because most minorities lives in the cities, far more so than whites, starving them into submission would not be hard (yes I know there's a lot of Latinos in the rural ares, but by percentage it's not a lot). I would like to say there will be no genocide, but I can't make that guarantee.

                I actually don't think it will be a Nazi style white supremacy that will drive this. Asians and affluent (probably white looking) Hispanics will make common cause with the Whites while on the other side there will be Blacks and Hispanics. I say this because those groups are both wealthy and largely bought into the American Dream. There is the chance this could be avoided, the way different ethnicity's found common ground before. We could all just say 'Hey, at least we're not Black.' Really, any anthropologist dealing with America will tell you the divide in this country have never been Who is White? But rather, Who is Black? And I hate to point out Blacks are not particularly well liked by any non-Black group. Civil War though requires more than Blacks in revolt, and the only people who could have common cause with them are unassimilated Latinos. And I mean been here three generations and not been made white like the Irish and Italians.

                I kinda see this reversal of racial values to be inevitable because if White people truly understood the dangers of interracial assimilation, we would have sealed the border in 1990 and there wouldn't be a Muslim in Western Europe. Whites don't feel threatened...yet. When they do, the Swastikas will fly again. But that moment will end quickly. A cleansed West will lead to a "normalization" of politics, and the Nazis-esque thugs will be unable to provide things like job growth, infrastructure rebuilding and such. Not to mention we needed them for a dirty task and the task is done. By 2100, the West will be lilly white and most democratic.
                You make some good points, and may I point out that I chose the term "Latin America" quite deliberatly. I do not care for the term Hispanic as it gives one the impression that people from Latin America are somehow ethnically homegenous, which is simply not true; Argentina is home to a very large number of caucasians for example. The biggest divide is, and will continue to remain economic status, but I do believe that given the current demographic trends people that are largely descended to from the Protestant countries of north-western Europe will be supplanted by a population that is more akin to the Spanish speaking, Catholic countries of Central and South America.
                Give me a fast ship and the wind at my back for I intend to sail in harms way! (John Paul Jones)

                Initiated Chief Petty Officer
                Hard core! Old School! Deal with it!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Wolery View Post
                  I kinda see this reversal of racial values to be inevitable because if White people truly understood the dangers of interracial assimilation, we would have sealed the border in 1990 and there wouldn't be a Muslim in Western Europe.
                  What are the dangers of interracial assimilation?
                  Reaction to the 2016 Munich shootings:
                  Europe: "We are shocked and support you in these harsh times, we stand by you."
                  USA: "We will check people from Germany extra-hard and it is your own damn fault for being so stupid."

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I don't see a civil war as very likely at all since the military is far more representative of the US mainstream as a whole, with little or no chance of their dividing into factions.

                    I do see a real possibility of factional insurrections, especially based on an increasing number of issue groups. If there is violence, then the states will use national or state guard troops in conjucntion with police prganizations to quash the rebellions. Sort of what the American Civil War might have been had Virginia not secceded.

                    The Tea Part movement is the opposite of what is being depicted. It is a grass roots coalition of many interest groups rather than a new one itself. It is understandable that the old school left wing activist and interest groups are fearful of the new model as nothing will bring people together like promoting the US Constitution over "progressive ideas" from on high.
                    "I ask, Sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people. To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them."
                    George Mason
                    Co-author of the Second Amendment
                    during Virginia’s Convention to Ratify the Constitution, 1788

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Acheron View Post
                      What are the dangers of interracial assimilation?
                      When it doesn't work!

                      Seriously though, I have no doubt whatsoever that if the peoples of the Middle East had not been Islamized, Arabs would be considered as white as Sicilians. Race is largely a social construct, the question of our time is how far can assimilation go. Unfortunately Islam renders most of your immigrants non-assimilable. Turks and Greeks have the same genetic stock, the Greeks will assimilate, if you let them, the Turks will not. Islamic is an evil religion, and if you do not eventually drive out the Muslims, they will destroy Western Europe. If you don't believe me, that's OK, just watch.

                      And Bass_Man, I see what you're getting at. I used the term Latino loosely, because Identity politics is trying to MAKE them a solid block. If that happens race war is inevitable. I've largely given up hope on Blacks, such is the monolithic voting and grievance block (although there are dissenters, the Tea Parties have a smattering of Black conservatives), and so the left doing the same to the Latino population is frightening. I think though bloodline is less important than passing, so at least a good chunk of them will assimilate regardless. Consider too that Protestantism is flourishing across Latin America, and a lot of immigrants are Protestant or becoming so. Besides the Catholic church is not nearly as scary as it was in centuries past, so even if they don't convert, it probably won't matter.

                      What kinda concerns me in this is how the Jews will play out. If Jews side with the whites, American Jewry will continue, for the same reasons Asians will probably stay. If they side with Blacks and Hispanics (and liberal whites), I fear what will happen when New York for example is retaken. Anti-semitism in America could be especially harsh because Conservative types are more pro-Israel than the left, so a feeling of betrayal could be massaged into democidal violence. This is not my favorite thing to talk about, though the White die-off that makes demographic changes possible is worse among Jews so there could be a huge conservative shift as the conservative (ideological, not denominational) people tend to have more kids across the board.
                      How many Allied tanks it would take to destroy a Maus?
                      275. Because that's how many shells there are in the Maus. Then it could probably crush some more until it ran out of gas. - Surfinbird

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Wolery View Post
                        More than that we will be the Serbs in this Yugoslavia and this time there will be no NATO to stop us.
                        Yeah if NATO haven't decided to stop us,Serbian borders would be from Slovenia to Macedonia no white Al-Quada camps,Taliban drug trafficking and Muslim Mujahedinds ....If CIA only worked better those years
                        It is always more difficult to fight against faith than against knowledge.

                        Косово је Србија!
                        Never go to war with a country whose national holiday celebrates a defeat in 1389.

                        Armored Brigade

                        Armored Brigade Facebook page

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                        • #13
                          There isn't going to be any civil war. Everyone is too lazy.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            There won't be a civil war. The Chief is right. The military tends to be more conservative. So does most law enforcement outside of a few large cities. The citizens who believe in gun ownership and own a lot of them are almost all conservatives. So the guns are in the hands of the conservatives, but you never hear them talk about revolution.

                            On the other hand, you do hear the far leftists talk about revolution, especially young college kids. But they don't believe in gun ownership. So how are they going to start a revolution? The guns are all in the hands of the conservatives and you just don't hear them preaching revolution. Largely because being conservative means you really don't want to mess up what you have already achieved. You just want to be left alone to do your thing and enjoy what you accomplish. Civil war would not be good for that. In order to tempt a conservative into civil war they will have to feel like their way of life or individual liberty is seriously threatened, and we aren't there yet.

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                            • #15
                              So the guns are in the hands of the conservatives, but you never hear them talk about revolution.
                              \
                              wide brush crock of_________. Fox brain washing in action.
                              "Ask not what your country can do for you"

                              Left wing, Right Wing same bird that they are killing.

                              you’re entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts.

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