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  • Sherman and the March to the Sea...

    The following comments have been made about General Sherman without any sourcing or references:

    Originally posted by B7B Southern View Post
    She hated Southerners as did Sherman.
    Originally posted by B7B Southern View Post
    And he was crazy to boot.
    Originally posted by B7B Southern View Post
    He even said he was crazy.
    Originally posted by B7B Southern View Post
    Never regained his sanity after the breakdown he had. Call it what you want.
    Originally posted by B7B Southern View Post
    He did a fine job against women and children and old men.
    Originally posted by Savez View Post
    Didn't target civilians? Not sure where you get that from.
    I was wondering that instead of a 'popular' misconception of Sherman, perhaps some actual proof of the accusations could be provided?
    We are not now that strength which in old days
    Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
    Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
    To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

  • #2
    Originally posted by Massena View Post
    The following comments have been made about General Sherman without any sourcing or references:













    I was wondering that instead of a 'popular' misconception of Sherman, perhaps some actual proof of the accusations could be provided?
    To be honest the treatment of escaped Slaves on that march and his later role in Military Policy towards American Indians as C in C was probably far worse than those people on his march.

    Would he have even been able to march anyway if the AoT had remained in front of him. He was able to cut loose from his supply lines and do the march because he had a free hand. That would have been much harder to do with an Army at your front.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Massena View Post
      The following comments have been made about General Sherman without any sourcing or references:

      I was wondering that instead of a 'popular' misconception of Sherman, perhaps some actual proof of the accusations could be provided?
      You'll have to define "target". He didn't order civilians killed but the civilian population was the "target" of the march.
      “I do not wish to have the slave emancipated because I love him, but because I hate his master."
      --Salmon P. Chase

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Savez View Post
        You'll have to define "target". He didn't order civilians killed but the civilian population was the "target" of the march.
        You mean on the lines of Jubal Early burning Chambersburg Pennsyvania when they couldn't come up with the ransom/extortion Early demanded of them in 1864?
        We are not now that strength which in old days
        Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
        Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
        To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Massena View Post
          You mean on the lines of Jubal Early burning Chambersburg Pennsyvania when they couldn't come up with the ransomextortion Early demanded of them in 1864?
          Do you want to discuss Early or Sherman? Make up your mind instead of making "Lincoln was racist too" type arguments.
          “I do not wish to have the slave emancipated because I love him, but because I hate his master."
          --Salmon P. Chase

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by History fan View Post
            To be honest the treatment of escaped Slaves on that march and his later role in Military Policy towards American Indians as C in C was probably far worse than those people on his march.

            Would he have even been able to march anyway if the AoT had remained in front of him. He was able to cut loose from his supply lines and do the march because he had a free hand. That would have been much harder to do with an Army at your front.
            That isn't answering the OP.

            Regarding Hood and his army, he chose not to go after Sherman but went north to Tennessee instead and the destruction of his own army.

            Sherman would confront Johnston's assembled army in North Carolina at Bentonville later. As to your question, Sherman had already beaten the Army of Tennessee badly at Atlanta and detached enough troops to handle them as he went for Savannah.

            As a footnote, the marauders and deserters from Sherman's army in Georgia were joined in their looting and pillaging with deserters from the Confederate Army...interesting, I think.
            We are not now that strength which in old days
            Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
            Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
            To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Massena View Post
              That isn't answering the OP.

              Regarding Hood and his army, he chose not to go after Sherman but went north to Tennessee instead and the destruction of his own army.

              Sherman would confront Johnston's assembled army in North Carolina at Bentonville later. As to your question, Sherman had already beaten the Army of Tennessee badly at Atlanta and detached enough troops to handle them as he went for Savannah.

              As a footnote, the marauders and deserters from Sherman's army in Georgia were joined in their looting and pillaging with deserters from the Confederate Army...interesting, I think.
              “To the petulant and persistent secessionists, why death is mercy, and the quicker he or she is disposed of the better. Until we can repopulate Georgia, it is useless to occupy it, but the utter destruction of its roads, houses, and people will cripple their military resources.”
              --William T. Sherman
              “I do not wish to have the slave emancipated because I love him, but because I hate his master."
              --Salmon P. Chase

              Comment


              • #8
                Sherman's definition of strategy:

                'Common sense applied to the art of war. You have got to do something...You can't go around asking corporals and sergeants. You must make it out of your own mind.'

                Sherman became Commanding General of the Army after the war and created the School of Application for infantry and cavalry at Fort Leavenworth which would develop into the Command and General Staff School. He also supported the already established artillery school and developed the Engineer School of Application and supported such thoughtful and innovative officers as Emory Upton.

                That shows great common sense and dedication to duty, not insanity.

                From The Superstrategists by John Elting, 129:

                'Sherman has been called the first advocate of total war and a totalitarian general. Such titles probably would have shocked him; for all the overloose discipline he allowed, for all the bloodcurdling phrases he delighted in, he was a sensitive, merciful individual. He haunts Southern mythology as a degenerate version of Attila the Hun, but by the contemporary European standards his frolic across Georgia was a Sunday school processional.'
                We are not now that strength which in old days
                Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
                Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
                To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Poe Howard, brother of Genl. Howard arrived from the right last night. He says the rebels attacked our troops in position and we repulsed them. We lost 150 men. He says positively that we inflicted a loss of 2000 on the rebels. We now commence burning more than ever. Gen. Sherman says he will burn every house that is known to have sheltered a rebel while shooting upon our troops. The rebels used every house in this town [Sandersville, GA] nearly for that purpose and I should not be a particle surprised if the town would be burned tomorrow morning.
                  Diary of John Van Duzer, Chief Telegraph Officer, Military Division of Tennessee. 24 November 1864.

                  It apparently didn't matter to Sherman if it was guerrilla forces or not as long as it was a houses harboring "rebels", they would be burned. Churches were burnt as well whether they harbored rebels or not.
                  “I do not wish to have the slave emancipated because I love him, but because I hate his master."
                  --Salmon P. Chase

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    That's commonly called 'force protection.'

                    If you don't want bad things to happen, don't hit the bear on the nose with a piece of wood.

                    Seems quite simple...

                    One thing that is usually ignored is that the South was in rebellion and was not an independent country. Those in the South were lucky to only suffer what actually happened and not what could have happened, which would have been much worse.
                    We are not now that strength which in old days
                    Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
                    Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
                    To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Still, your OP seems to be mostly from one poster... not the forum's comments/opinions in general.

                      War sucks... Sherman was given an order and he basically followed it.

                      Like you mentioned... total war.

                      Georgia did howl.

                      IMO Hood should have followed and harrassed Sherman as best as they could.

                      Wouldn't have made much difference IMO but what happened sure didn't either.
                      SPORTS FREAK/ PANZERBLITZ COMMANDER/ CC2 COMMANDER

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        One of the first communities in South Carolina to be invaded by the advancing army was Hardeeville. There, one of the town's largest and loveliest houses of worship was completely demolished by men of the Twentieth Corps. After the pulpit and pews had been carried from the building, the siding was ripped off. The corner posts were then cut, which caused the towering and majestic spire to come crashing down into what was left of the building. As the walls broke apart, the soldiers yelled out to the sorrowful and apprehensive citizens watching on: "There goes your damned gospel shop!" Most of the other buildings in Hardeeville were either burned or torn down to make room and provide shelters for the troops. One of Sherman's soldiers, James T. Ayers, said the community literally disappeared.
                        As in Georgia, Sherman's troops lived off the land and the possessions of the people. Special bands of foragers would frequently take everything of value they could carry. Sometimes these foragers, or "bummers", com mitted rape. The evidence indicates that incidents of rape upon white women by Union soldiers were relatively few. There were, however, numerous rapes of black women. One instance of a white woman being raped happened not far from Columbia. Confederate scouts, in search of foragers, came upon a farmhouse where they found an older man sobbing with uncontrolled grief. The man, a Baptist minister, choking on his tears, told the scouts, "My daughter. A bunch of Yankees raped her ? they just left here." The scouts rode on in rapid pursuit. A few miles down the road they overtook the band of foragers, killing all of them except a young soldier who had satisfied them that he had nothing to do with the rape.
                        Sounds like a "Sunday school processional" to me!

                        Chesebrough, David B.. “"there Goes Your Damned Gospel Shop!" the Churches and Clergy as Victims of Sherman's March Through South Carolina”. The South Carolina Historical Magazine 92.1 (1991): 15–33
                        “I do not wish to have the slave emancipated because I love him, but because I hate his master."
                        --Salmon P. Chase

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Massena View Post
                          That's commonly called 'force protection.'

                          If you don't want bad things to happen, don't hit the bear on the nose with a piece of wood.

                          Seems quite simple...

                          One thing that is usually ignored is that the South was in rebellion and was not an independent country. Those in the South were lucky to only suffer what actually happened and not what could have happened, which would have been much worse.
                          That's how Sherman saw it...

                          "The Government of the United States has in North-Alabama any and all rights which they choose to enforce in war — to take their lives, their homes, their lands, their everything . . . and war is simply power unrestrained by constitution or compact. If they want eternal warfare, well and good; we will accept the issue and dispossess them, and put our friends in possession. Many, many people, with less pertinacity than the South, have been wiped out of national existence.
                          To those who submit to the rightful law and authority, all gentleness and forbearance; but to the petulant and persistent secessionists, why, death is mercy, and the quicker he or she is disposed of the better. Satan and the rebellious saints of heaven were allowed a continuance of existence in hell merely to swell their just punishment."

                          --William T. Sherman
                          “I do not wish to have the slave emancipated because I love him, but because I hate his master."
                          --Salmon P. Chase

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            We are not only fighting hostile armies, but a hostile people, and we must make old and young, rich and poor, feel the hard hand of war as well as their organized armies.
                            William T. Sherman
                            “I do not wish to have the slave emancipated because I love him, but because I hate his master."
                            --Salmon P. Chase

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Massena View Post
                              ...Sherman had already beaten the Army of Tennessee badly at Atlanta...
                              Doesn't look 'badly' to me...

                              Atlanta Campaign
                              Battle....................................Victor
                              Resaca...................................Union (tactically a draw)
                              New Hope Church & vicinity.....Confederate
                              Kennesaw Mountain................Confederate
                              Peachtree Creek (20 July)........Union
                              Atlanta (22 July).....................Confederate
                              Ezra Church (28 July)..............Union
                              Jonesboro...............................Union

                              ...and casualties were about equal.
                              {}

                              "Any story sounds true until someone tells the other side and sets the record straight." -Proverbs 18:17

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