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See how slavery grew in the U.S. over two centuries

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  • See how slavery grew in the U.S. over two centuries

    Slavery's explosive growth, in charts: How '20 and odd' became millions

    https://www.usatoday.com/pages/inter...ctive-graphic/
    Flag: USA / Location: West Coast

    Prayers.

    BoRG

    http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/8757/snap1ws8.jpg

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PtsX_Z3CMU

  • #2
    sad legacy......

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    • #3
      Originally posted by jeffdoorgunnr View Post
      sad legacy......
      Entirely normal throughout the world for thousands of years, and normal in this period of time as well.

      We look at slavery through the eyes of modern civilization which is an incorrect view. Even today, slavery in many forms is practiced throughout the world. What we call "shameful" today was simply the economics of the times.

      We look at empires like Rome and Greece and others as mighty contributors to modern civilization, but for some odd reason we seem to overlook the fact that all of those civilizations were dependent on slavery.

      Even the Dark Ages in Europe was built on the slavery of the serfs.

      Just like all other ancient practices including human sacrifices, slavery was a normal part of the world and really always has been. And it still is.
      Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes? Who is watching the watchers?

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
        Just like all other ancient practices including human sacrifices, slavery was a normal part of the world and really always has been. And it still is.
        You can include animal abuse and pedophilia in that list, too. Does that invalidate today's legal proscriptions, or let its current practitioners off the hook?
        I was married for two ******* years! Hell would be like Club Med! - Sam Kinison

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        • #5
          mans inhumanity to man. in modern times we just hid most of it or took the edge off....Roman gladitorial games have just morphed into "football" Slavery is still with us... but it is more hidden. Of course it has morphed into other slightly less abhorrent types of "slavery" also......credit cards and medical bills......Taxes.....

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

            Entirely normal throughout the world for thousands of years, and normal in this period of time as well.

            We look at slavery through the eyes of modern civilization which is an incorrect view. Even today, slavery in many forms is practiced throughout the world. What we call "shameful" today was simply the economics of the times.

            We look at empires like Rome and Greece and others as mighty contributors to modern civilization, but for some odd reason we seem to overlook the fact that all of those civilizations were dependent on slavery.

            Even the Dark Ages in Europe was built on the slavery of the serfs.

            Just like all other ancient practices including human sacrifices, slavery was a normal part of the world and really always has been. And it still is.
            Since Greece wasn't really Greece back then, but rather a number Greco City-States with different laws, traditions, and types of governments spread out even to places such as Italy and Turkey, so let's concentrate on Rome for comparison.

            Roman laws evolved over time so that it really does make the American chattel slavery look much worse. Most Roman slaves came directly from conquest so the value and duties of slaves varied quite a bit. The average Greek slave was likely educated more so than the average Roman, and served as accountants, engineers, physicians, teachers, scribes, etc. They were even allowed to take on outside work to earn money to buy their own freedom. Slaves that were owned and set free by Roman citizens and never having been branded or involuntarily sent to the gladiatorial games as punishment were granted citizenship with the rights that came with it with few exceptions, such as holding a Senatorial seat, but that is a class issue where most Romans themselves do not have the right to. Former slave took so many key positions in the governmental bureaucracy that Hadrian had to install laws to limit their participation.

            Roman slaves were allowed to marry and have children without the chattel definition that we have with our American slavery, They were allowed to own property, They were allowed to file charges against their masters for abuse. Until Antonio Pius, killing a slave legally became a homicide with the status of being a slave inconsequential.
            Last edited by Salinator; 18 Sep 19, 15:04.
            Flag: USA / Location: West Coast

            Prayers.

            BoRG

            http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/8757/snap1ws8.jpg

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PtsX_Z3CMU

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            • #7
              How about a happy ending for this story?

              Do you have something like this for the decline and fall of slavery?

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              • #8
                Slavery might have been 'normal' with the ancients, but it became very much less so as civilization progressed. And that was why there was an American Civil War-slavery, like it or not.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Salinator View Post
                  Slavery's explosive growth, in charts: How '20 and odd' became millions

                  https://www.usatoday.com/pages/inter...ctive-graphic/
                  A good overview-but what's your point?

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Salinator View Post
                    Since Greece wasn't really Greece back then, but rather a number Greco City-States with different laws, traditions, and types of governments spread out even to places such as Italy and Turkey, so let's concentrate on Rome for comparison.

                    Roman laws evolved over time so that it really does make the American chattel slavery look much worse. Most Roman slaves came directly from conquest so the value and duties of slaves varied quite a bit. The average Greek slave was likely educated more so than the average Roman, and served as accountants, engineers, physicians, teachers, scribes, etc. They were even allowed to take on outside work to earn money to buy their own freedom. Slaves that were owned and set free by Roman citizens and never having been branded or involuntarily sent to the gladiatorial games as punishment were granted citizenship with the rights that came with it with few exceptions, such as holding a Senatorial seat, but that is a class issue where most Romans themselves do not have the right to. Former slave took so many key positions in the governmental bureaucracy that Hadrian had to install laws to limit their participation.

                    Roman slaves were allowed to marry and have children without the chattel definition that we have with out American slavery, They were allowed to own property, They were allowed to file charges against their masters for abuse. Until Antonio Pius, killing a slave legally became a homicide with the status of being a slave inconsequential.
                    The variation in the treatment of Roman slaves was vast. At various times they could be killed or mutilated at their owners whimor they could be freed and rise to command multiple legions.

                    they could be African, German, Spanish, Italian, British or from anywhere.


                    "To be free is better than to be unfree - always."

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Salinator View Post
                      Since Greece wasn't really Greece back then...
                      The location and country (as in countryside not a political element) was Greece no matter how it was organized. The Greek city states were the political entities in Greece, but Greece was still Greece in much the same way the geographical Germany was not a unified political entity until 1871, but was made up of different German states.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Surrey View Post

                        The variation in the treatment of Roman slaves was vast. At various times they could be killed or mutilated at their owners whimor they could be freed and rise to command multiple legions.

                        they could be African, German, Spanish, Italian, British or from anywhere.

                        Did you missed the part where I said Roman slavery laws EVOLVED OVER TIME? American Chattel slavery for the most part did not evolve over time, but rather came to a abrupt halt at the business end of a gun barrel.

                        Slavery practice in general were usually color and racially blind, except for the Trans-Atlantic slave trade.
                        Flag: USA / Location: West Coast

                        Prayers.

                        BoRG

                        http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/8757/snap1ws8.jpg

                        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PtsX_Z3CMU

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Massena View Post

                          The location and country (as in countryside not a political element) was Greece no matter how it was organized. The Greek city states were the political entities in Greece, but Greece was still Greece in much the same way the geographical Germany was not a unified political entity until 1871, but was made up of different German states.
                          For the sake of discussing slavery in the age of antiquity, there is Rome, but no Greece - one would have to discuss individual City-States, some of which were not even in what is now Greece. For the rest of the ancient periods, Greece was either under Macedonian or Roman rule.

                          Fun fact: Greece is not even a Greek word, it is from Latin Graecia. The ancient Greeks referred to themselves by their cities or as Hellenic, thus the modern nation's name is the Hellenic Republic "Helliniki Dimokratia".
                          Flag: USA / Location: West Coast

                          Prayers.

                          BoRG

                          http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/8757/snap1ws8.jpg

                          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PtsX_Z3CMU

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Salinator View Post
                            Fun fact: Greece is not even a Greek word, it is from Latin Graecia. The ancient Greeks referred to themselves by their cities or as Hellenic, thus the modern nation's name is the Hellenic Republic "Helliniki Dimokratia".
                            It's still OK to call it "Hellas" I think, if a bit antiquated

                            High Admiral Snowy, Commander In Chief of the Naval Forces of The Phoenix Confederation.

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