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  • Blue-water Navy

    What exactly is a blue-water navy?

    Aside from the US Navy, what other navy/ies in the world can be classified as such?


    _______
    The recipe for perpetual ignorance is: be satisfied with your opinions and content with your knowledge.
    -Elbert Hubbard
    I hate it when I see one of those road signs that says "Draw Bridge Ahead" and I don't have a pencil.
    -Lou Chiafullo

  • #2
    Re: Blue-water Navy

    Originally posted by Geeky Nerd
    What exactly is a blue-water navy?

    Aside from the US Navy, what other navy/ies in the world can be classified as such?

    It is a naval force that is capable of operatinfg outside outside of its coastal water.

    Most NATO members would be classified as such, as would China (barely). India is debatable. No African or South American navy would be so labelled.


    _______
    The recipe for perpetual ignorance is: be satisfied with your opinions and content with your knowledge.
    -Elbert Hubbard
    Mens Est Clavis Victoriae
    (The Mind Is The Key To Victory)

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    • #3
      Re: Blue-water Navy

      Originally posted by Geeky Nerd
      What exactly is a blue-water navy?

      Aside from the US Navy, what other navy/ies in the world can be classified as such?
      Any ocean going navy that can sustain ops is a blue-water navy.

      Off the top of my head.

      Australia
      Canada
      China
      India
      Japan
      Russia
      New Zealand (limited)
      UK
      France
      Germany (limited)
      Neatherlands (limited)
      Norway
      Argentina (limited)
      Brazil (limited)
      Greece (limited)
      Turkey (limited)
      South Korea (limited)
      Spain
      Italy
      Malaysia (but dropping to limited status)
      Israel (Submarines only)

      Limited means that they would be hard pressed to support more than one real blue water mission over an extended period of time.

      Cheers!


      :armed:
      Eagles may fly; but weasels aren't sucked into jet engines!

      "I'm not expendable; I'm not stupid and I'm not going." - Kerr Avon, Blake's 7

      What didn't kill us; didn't make us smarter.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Re: Blue-water Navy

        Originally posted by RichardS
        Any ocean going navy that can sustain ops is a blue-water navy.

        Off the top of my head.

        Australia
        Canada
        China
        India
        Japan
        Russia
        New Zealand (limited)
        UK
        France
        Germany (limited)
        Neatherlands (limited)
        Norway
        Argentina (limited)
        Brazil (limited)
        Greece (limited)
        Turkey (limited)
        South Korea (limited)
        Spain
        Italy
        Malaysia (but dropping to limited status)
        Israel (Submarines only)

        Limited means that they would be hard pressed to support more than one real blue water mission over an extended period of time.

        Cheers!


        :armed:
        Not to upset anyone but I would put Russia as dropping to the limited status also. But Russia has always been more of a land power.:thumb:
        Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it whether it exists or not, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedy. -- Ernest Benn

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        • #5
          I posted this because a friend is very adamant that the UK's Royal Navy and the French Navy could not be considered 'blue water navies' because although both have aircraft carrier battle groups that could sail out to any ocean in the world, but not enough of them to cover ALL oceans and major seas, unlike the US Navy.

          To him, a navy is not a blue water navy if it could not project power throughout the world's oceans at the same time.

          Duh?

          _______
          Let not thy will roar, when thy power can but whisper.
          -Dr. Thomas Fuller
          I hate it when I see one of those road signs that says "Draw Bridge Ahead" and I don't have a pencil.
          -Lou Chiafullo

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          • #6
            Here is a site called "Blue Water Navies".

            http://www.navalships.org/
            Only Tearful, Animal Man Through the Nature of his Being is Destined to
            a Life of Warfare...

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Geeky Nerd
              I posted this because a friend is very adamant that the UK's Royal Navy and the French Navy could not be considered 'blue water navies' because although both have aircraft carrier battle groups that could sail out to any ocean in the world, but not enough of them to cover ALL oceans and major seas, unlike the US Navy.

              To him, a navy is not a blue water navy if it could not project power throughout the world's oceans at the same time.
              Power projection has nothing to do if a Navy is Blue Water or not. And while the French have done some incredibly stupid things with the Charles De Gaulle; she has a blue water navy just like the Royal Navy is.

              The simple fact is most navies do NOT need to fight in more than one ocean or sea at any time. In fact using the criteria of more than one ocean/sea at a time to defend; the list drops dramatically.

              United States
              Canada
              Russia
              Australia
              Argentina

              Those who could if desired
              UK
              France
              Norway


              A couple who would be stretched to the breaking to cover more than one ocean/sea.
              India
              Japan

              The thing your friend is not taking into consideration is: 1) Geography and 2) Purpose in the design of the fleet. France or the UK wouldn't/couldn't build a fleet like the US because this type of fleet is not one they need or want.



              Cheers!


              :armed:
              Eagles may fly; but weasels aren't sucked into jet engines!

              "I'm not expendable; I'm not stupid and I'm not going." - Kerr Avon, Blake's 7

              What didn't kill us; didn't make us smarter.

              Comment


              • #8
                I'd be very upset if someone suggested that the Royal Navy was anything other than a blue-water Navy - it's demonstrably just not true.

                Dr. S.
                Imagine a ball of iron, the size of the sun. And once a year a tiny sparrow brushes its surface with the tip of its wing. And when that ball of iron, the size of the sun, is worn away to nothing, your punishment will barely have begun.

                www.sinisterincorporated.co.uk

                www.tabletown.co.uk

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Doctor Sinister
                  I'd be very upset if someone suggested that the Royal Navy was anything other than a blue-water Navy - it's demonstrably just not true.

                  Dr. S.
                  Don't worry Dr. S., we know who has the second best navy in the world.......and its not bad to be number two when your best friend is number one.
                  Lance W.

                  Peace through superior firepower.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Lance Williams
                    Don't worry Dr. S., we know who has the second best navy in the world.......and its not bad to be number two when your best friend is number one.
                    Reminds me of a story I was told once by an old Navy Veteran of WWII.

                    The US Navy had finally overtaken the RN as the largest in the world, and an RN Officer met a US Navy counterpart in England.

                    "Hi there!" said the US chap, "What's it like to be part of the second-largest Navy in the world?"

                    "Not bad" replied the British Officer, quick as a flash "What's it like to be part of the second-best?"

                    Dr. S.
                    Imagine a ball of iron, the size of the sun. And once a year a tiny sparrow brushes its surface with the tip of its wing. And when that ball of iron, the size of the sun, is worn away to nothing, your punishment will barely have begun.

                    www.sinisterincorporated.co.uk

                    www.tabletown.co.uk

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Doctor Sinister
                      I'd be very upset if someone suggested that the Royal Navy was anything other than a blue-water Navy - it's demonstrably just not true.

                      Dr. S.
                      Never fear, Britannia will continue to rule it's part of the waves. Despite the occassional "oopsies".




                      Cheers!


                      Eagles may fly; but weasels aren't sucked into jet engines!

                      "I'm not expendable; I'm not stupid and I'm not going." - Kerr Avon, Blake's 7

                      What didn't kill us; didn't make us smarter.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Is it true that the French are interested in acquiring one of the new British carriers to replace the CdG?



                        ______
                        We joined the Navy to see the world, / And what did we see? We saw the sea.
                        -Irving Berlin (1888 - 1989) US composer
                        We Saw the Sea, "Follow the Fleet."
                        I hate it when I see one of those road signs that says "Draw Bridge Ahead" and I don't have a pencil.
                        -Lou Chiafullo

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Geeky Nerd
                          Is it true that the French are interested in acquiring one of the new British carriers to replace the CdG?
                          I haven't heard anything about that. But as much money as they sunk into the Charles De Gaulle; I have to doubt they'll replace her any time soon. Also you'd have to look into how the Rafale and JSF compare in handling characteristics.



                          Cheers!


                          :armed:
                          Eagles may fly; but weasels aren't sucked into jet engines!

                          "I'm not expendable; I'm not stupid and I'm not going." - Kerr Avon, Blake's 7

                          What didn't kill us; didn't make us smarter.

                          Comment

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