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Passion For The Sport

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  • Passion For The Sport

    Well, it only took 5 pages for the European section discussion on the riot that broke out in the football/soccer match between England and France.
    I DON'T want to discuss that particular incident as it will simply get this thread locked before we even begin.
    My question is this: Why does this sport have such bad behavior associated with it as far as the spectators are concerned? That question raises another: What can be done to eliminate it to the greatest degree possible, making it safer for fans, which includes young family members?

    My personal take view on those questions is this: This sport is viewed as passionately as religion. The first game I ever attended was a match between Italy and Germany. I have been to hockey games (NHL), baseball games (MLB), basketball games (NBA) and North American football games (NFL) and none of these had the atmosphere of that game between Italy and Germany.

    How do you control such? In my opinion, the only way to do it is to penalize the team, at the club level if it's a league match and the country if it is an international match. Anything short of that, these fans will ignore. It would be horrible to see a whole country and the players suspended due to a few hundred idiots but I just do not see anything else short of this that would send the message to these thugs that it will NOT be tolerated at all.

    What do you think on this?

    PS - I put this here rather than the sports thread in hopes that more people read it and comment on it. You do not need to be a sports fan to have a valid idea on it.

    Thanks
    "War is hell, but actual combat is a motherf#cker"
    - Col. David Hackworth

  • #2
    Load up on security and arrest all parties involved. No penalty for teams unless they riled up or sent in thugs as spectators.

    If you fight or disrupt others around you in the U.S. you get booted/arrested immediately. No questions asked. No matter the sport.

    Security is everywhere.
    SPORTS FREAK/ PANZERBLITZ COMMANDER/ CC2 COMMANDER

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    • #3
      Originally posted by DeltaOne View Post
      I have been to hockey games (NHL), baseball games (MLB), basketball games (NBA) and North American football games (NFL) and none of these had the atmosphere of that game between Italy and Germany.
      I'm going to differ with you. I've been to MLB, NHL, and NBA games that were every bit as raucous and as violent as any European or Latin American football match.

      That being said, the difference I see between Europe and North America is that here the bad behavior is usually casual, where as in Europe it's deliberate, and it's organized. Often these "ultras" are affiliated with some political club or political party. In my view they're gangsters plain and simple, and should be treated as such. That pithy observation, however, does not offer a solution to a gang problem, which similar events have vexed many societies throughout the years.

      One solution hit upon by the major sports leagues in N America is to price the aholes out: most tickets here are so expensive that they're practically an investment. The kinds of people who join ultra gangs are not usually the types who can afford Madison Square Garden. Granted, that renders the crowds rather lily white and dull, but at least they're not killing each other.

      Usually. There are exceptions even to that.
      I was married for two ******* years! Hell would be like Club Med! - Sam Kinison

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      • #4
        When was this game between Italy and Germany?
        "Ask not what your country can do for you"

        Left wing, Right Wing same bird that they are killing.

        you’re entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Half Pint John View Post
          When was this game between Italy and Germany?
          2006 and 2012. I've been to a few more of Italy's game due to my wife's family coming from Italy. We travel there regularly as she has many relatives there. I have been to 2 others in Britain (club matches) where there were fights in the stand, thankfully no where close to me and my son.

          Do you get to many in Germany?
          "War is hell, but actual combat is a motherf#cker"
          - Col. David Hackworth

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          • #6
            I can remember going and watching Aberdeen play at home on New Years day IIRC 1971. Bottles of Scotch were being passed around on the terraces but there was zero crowd trouble even when Aberdeen lost (through trying to be too clever). The main job the very few police did was to give directions to departing away fans. At the same time an Old Firm game in Glasgow was degenerating into rioting and fighting. It depends more than one might think on local culture and social attitudes and isn't necessarily specific to the game , booze etc etc.

            I also remember the Emir's cup final in Doha when the project team I was managing went off to the game. The referee awarded a penalty towards the end whereupon the team against whom it had been awarded started to beat up the ref to whose rescue other other team came. The stands then emptied as the spectators flowed down to the pitch and joined in. The TV news that night showed a pitched battle in the middle of the national stadium with a small group (my project team) still in the stands watching with horrified fascination. The following year I believe the Qatari national team became the only national team in the world to be all sent off in a World Cup qualifier

            Given that the next two World Cup hosts are Russia and Qatar one wonders.
            Last edited by MarkV; 15 Jun 16, 09:33.
            Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe (H G Wells)
            Mit der Dummheit kaempfen Goetter selbst vergebens (Friedrich von Schiller)

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            • #7
              I think the Russian game would be pretty safe, would you like to be put a Russian jail? I imagine it'd be a really rough spot...

              And as far a Qatar goes, anyone who goes there is betraying humanity by giving them any money...
              Credo quia absurdum.


              Quantum mechanics describes nature as absurd from the point of view of common sense. And yet it fully agrees with experiment. So I hope you can accept nature as She is - absurd! - Richard Feynman

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Bwaha View Post
                I think the Russian game would be pretty safe, would you like to be put a Russian jail? I imagine it'd be a really rough spot...

                And as far a Qatar goes, anyone who goes there is betraying humanity by giving them any money...
                They've already got plenty of that. How else do you think they bought the fixture from FIFA in the first place? Owning the largest natural gas reservoir and supplying Japan's needs does put a bob or two in the pocket.
                Last edited by MarkV; 16 Jun 16, 04:04.
                Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe (H G Wells)
                Mit der Dummheit kaempfen Goetter selbst vergebens (Friedrich von Schiller)

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by DeltaOne View Post
                  2006 and 2012. I've been to a few more of Italy's game due to my wife's family coming from Italy. We travel there regularly as she has many relatives there. I have been to 2 others in Britain (club matches) where there were fights in the stand, thankfully no where close to me and my son.

                  Do you get to many in Germany?
                  Been to one friendly between Bayern and a local club.Three or four NFL, one MBL and two Top Ten college games. I don't like crowds Then the hassle of getting there
                  "Ask not what your country can do for you"

                  Left wing, Right Wing same bird that they are killing.

                  you’re entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Well...duh!

                    Identifying and neutralizing potential soccer rowdies/thugs is something that is key in preventing riots and disturbances during games/playoff series. In my humble opinion law enforcement, in its many and myriad manifestations, has GOT to learn and act upon...(wait for it)...PROFILING!

                    I know it's not PC and is looked upon as racist, bigoted, sectarian, unfair, etc., etc., but when it comes down to the nitty-gritty, it's usually spot-on. If it looks like, walks, talks, moves, smells like what you suspect it is...go with your gut and check it out with a bit more scrutiny.

                    Profiling..., making an educated guess for the greater good.
                    ARRRR! International Talk Like A Pirate Day - September 19th
                    IN MARE IN COELO

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Jose50 View Post
                      Identifying and neutralizing potential soccer rowdies/thugs is something that is key in preventing riots and disturbances during games/playoff series. In my humble opinion law enforcement, in its many and myriad manifestations, has GOT to learn and act upon...(wait for it)...PROFILING!

                      I know it's not PC and is looked upon as racist, bigoted, sectarian, unfair, etc., etc., but when it comes down to the nitty-gritty, it's usually spot-on. If it looks like, walks, talks, moves, smells like what you suspect it is...go with your gut and check it out with a bit more scrutiny.

                      Profiling..., making an educated guess for the greater good.
                      Unfortunately the profile of a football hooligan appears to be white,male between 18 and 45 which is also the profile of a lot of non hooligans. FHs have come from every class and almost all nationalities. There are tall, short, thin and fat ones. Tattooed and untattooed. If it were that simple it would already been done in some manner.
                      Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe (H G Wells)
                      Mit der Dummheit kaempfen Goetter selbst vergebens (Friedrich von Schiller)

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                      • #12
                        Lack of front teeth may be a dead giveaway...
                        ARRRR! International Talk Like A Pirate Day - September 19th
                        IN MARE IN COELO

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Jose50 View Post
                          Lack of front teeth may be a dead giveaway...
                          No those are just the incompetent ones.

                          I remember a discussion between a couple of sociologists, one was putting forward the view that studies of prison populations suggested that criminals tended to have deprived backgrounds. No said the other all that shows is that criminals who get caught tend to come from deprived circumstances - we don't know the profile of criminals who get away with it.
                          Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe (H G Wells)
                          Mit der Dummheit kaempfen Goetter selbst vergebens (Friedrich von Schiller)

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            What surprised me was that the French allowed the sale of alcohol in the fanzones. That's a no-no as far as I can tell. Over here the sale of alcohol is completely banned in a radius of several miles around the stadiums and fanzones when high-risk games are played.

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                            • #15
                              I'll be going to Copa America tomorrow night (Giants Stadium NJ, Colombia v Peru.) Can't bring bags unless they're clear plastic. No bottles or cans. Everyone gets wanded and patted down at the gate. I'll let you know if the South Americans emulate the Europeans' example.
                              I was married for two ******* years! Hell would be like Club Med! - Sam Kinison

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