Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Does 100% healthcare coverage mean nobody ever has to die?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Does 100% healthcare coverage mean nobody ever has to die?

    Hilary Clinton is advocating 100% healthcare coverage for all in the US Theoretically, the UK and other European countries already have universal healthcare.

    What does this mean?

    Growing up, I heard now and again that someone had died from "old age". Later, I learned that there is no such thing as dying from old age. We die because, just like automobiles, one or more of our vital parts has failed - heart, lungs, kidneys whatever.

    This week, the former Israeli President has been admitted to hospital because of an irregular heart rhythm (something I also suffer from). He is 92 years old. Maybe they will give him a heart transplant. If so, he may be able to continue for another 5 or 10 years.

    Until after 5 or 10 years more, his kidneys give out Then, they could give him new kidneys.

    I find this most odd. Where does it end?

    Are we now to accept that we should have medical interventions that will enable us to replace the parts that fail so that we can go on forever?

    Seems unnatural and unsustainable to me, especially regarding the cost of such interventions. And how could such expensive interventions be implemented equitably globally?

    What do you think?

    Philip
    "The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts."— Bertrand Russell

  • #2
    If you are 92 you are waaaaaay down the list of recipients. After 70 you are unlikely to receive any kind of transplant because of the risk of surgery.

    Comment


    • #3
      As a Christian I get to win eternal life without the pain of getting old.

      It works. Eternal life. By love. Ask your kid...



      Love wins.
      Last edited by Bwaha; 25 Jan 16, 22:54.
      Credo quia absurdum.


      Quantum mechanics describes nature as absurd from the point of view of common sense. And yet it fully agrees with experiment. So I hope you can accept nature as She is - absurd! - Richard Feynman

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by PhilipLaos View Post
        Hilary Clinton is advocating 100% healthcare coverage for all in the US
        It will never happen. Various Democratic politicians have brought up this little Holy Grail for years now, but when elected fail to follow through - primarily because they are in the pay of big health insurance corporations. Case in point - Obamacare. The promise was public, socialized healthcare. What Americans got instead was a government-enforced and government-subsidized private-sector health-care system written up by lobbyists for the health insurance corporations.

        Comment


        • #5
          If there is universal health care, it means there will be shortages of health care. My Great Grandfather had heart surgery when he was 99 years old! His surgeon was the one stressed out! Unfortunately he did not make 100, but his heart worked fine until the end!

          Pruitt
          Pruitt, you are truly an expert! Kelt06

          Have you been struck by the jawbone of an ASS lately?

          by Khepesh "This is the logic of Pruitt"

          Comment


          • #6
            Whatever they can do in the matter of organ replacements eventually your brain will go (jn the case of some politicians this already seems to be happening) and a head transplant isn't going to preserve the old you.
            The concept has long ago been considered see Gulliver's Travels by Jonathan Swift: Chapter 26 which introduces the Struldbrugs of Laputa, miserable creatures that never die but become drooling immortal imbeciles warehoused away from society
            Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe (H G Wells)
            Mit der Dummheit kaempfen Goetter selbst vergebens (Friedrich von Schiller)

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by PhilipLaos View Post
              Hilary Clinton is advocating 100% healthcare coverage for all in the US Theoretically, the UK and other European countries already have universal healthcare.

              What does this mean?

              Growing up, I heard now and again that someone had died from "old age". Later, I learned that there is no such thing as dying from old age. We die because, just like automobiles, one or more of our vital parts has failed - heart, lungs, kidneys whatever.

              This week, the former Israeli President has been admitted to hospital because of an irregular heart rhythm (something I also suffer from). He is 92 years old. Maybe they will give him a heart transplant. If so, he may be able to continue for another 5 or 10 years.

              Until after 5 or 10 years more, his kidneys give out Then, they could give him new kidneys.

              I find this most odd. Where does it end?

              Are we now to accept that we should have medical interventions that will enable us to replace the parts that fail so that we can go on forever?

              Seems unnatural and unsustainable to me, especially regarding the cost of such interventions. And how could such expensive interventions be implemented equitably globally?

              What do you think?

              Philip
              How to Talk to a Climate Skeptic: http://grist.org/series/skeptics/
              Global Warming & Climate Change Myths: https://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php

              Comment


              • #8
                My father (68) has a younger man's liver (now 40s) since around 1990. I suspect that it has prolonged his life although he has a several health problems (suffered a micro stroke recently, now seeing heart doctor). His hair has not greyed very much at all.

                In fact his hair condition is closer to that of a man in his 40s.

                Comment


                • #9
                  ...the UK and other European countries already have universal healthcare.
                  Universal healthcare does equal 100% healthcare, there are always some experimental or rare therapies, or simply more luxurious medical facilities that are NOT covered under social healthcare,

                  that's why most people have private insurance in addition to social.
                  Lambert of Montaigu - Crusader.

                  Bolgios - Mercenary Game.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    100% Universal healthcare in the US is sort of like why communism can never work...greed. Simple greed.
                    ARRRR! International Talk Like A Pirate Day - September 19th
                    IN MARE IN COELO

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Jose50 View Post
                      100% Universal healthcare in the US is sort of like why communism can never work...greed. Simple greed.
                      The US is simply too big and diversified to operate one system of social healthcare,

                      on a state level it might work...maybe
                      Lambert of Montaigu - Crusader.

                      Bolgios - Mercenary Game.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        When the NHS was established here one long term miscalculation was made. It was assumed that a universal free system would mean that the general health of the population would be better hence more people would be in productive employment, earning more money and therefore paying more tax. This was a virtuous circle spend more money on the health service and you have more money to spend and people are healthier and put less demand on the system. However it goes into reverse once you get more people living longer into retirement where they pay less in tax and make increasing demands on the health service as they age. The more you spend on the service the greater the demand and the more you need to spend. Unfortunately this was never taken into consideration and appropriate funding structures were not identified and put in place. At the same time large state run organisations do tend to be bureaucratic and inefficient. Our biggest problem that looms over us like a wave about to break is the need not for health care but social care for all those who are living into a frail old age.

                        Now I'm not knocking our heath service - it saved my life twice, once when I was ten and caught meningitis and about 12 year ago when I needed a very big and complex op (and the surgeon was sort of hinting not to start reading any long novels) and a private hospital once nearly killed me by bungling a routine simple procedure. I just wish those who established it had been bright enough to consider the long term implications. But of course in the long run, just like Keynes said, they're all dead.
                        Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe (H G Wells)
                        Mit der Dummheit kaempfen Goetter selbst vergebens (Friedrich von Schiller)

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by MarkV View Post
                          At the same time large state run organisations do tend to be bureaucratic and inefficient.
                          A rather neat solution was found here, rather than have the state operate healthcare, a hybrid system was created, using specialized health insurance funds.

                          As part of the social security enrolment process, all employees and self-employed must register and start making contributions to a health insurance fund (mutuelle / ziekenfonds). Contributions are 7.35 percent of your gross salary (3.55 percent deducted at source; 3.8 percent paid by your employer). Self-employed people pay the full 7.35 percent through social security payments. You and any dependents are covered. If you hold an EHIC (European Health Insurance Card) you can use this until you take up permanent residence and/or employment; then you have to register with a mutuelle / ziekenfonds like everyone else.
                          Of course - in regard to 100% coverage.

                          The amount of reimbursement varies according to the treatment and your personal circumstances but, for example, most people can claim up to 75 percent of the cost for a normal doctor's consultation or minor treatment. For hospital stays, you pay a fixed amount for accommodation; medical fees are paid directly by the insurer. You can take out extra insurance to cover amounts not refunded. Check the details of your cover with your own mutuelle / ziekenfonds; for example if you’re self-employed you will only be insured for major health problems and may want to take out extra cover.

                          http://www.expatica.com/be/healthcar...um_100097.html
                          Lambert of Montaigu - Crusader.

                          Bolgios - Mercenary Game.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by PhilipLaos View Post
                            Hilary Clinton is advocating 100% healthcare coverage for all in the US Theoretically, the UK and other European countries already have universal healthcare.

                            What does this mean?

                            Growing up, I heard now and again that someone had died from "old age". Later, I learned that there is no such thing as dying from old age. We die because, just like automobiles, one or more of our vital parts has failed - heart, lungs, kidneys whatever.

                            This week, the former Israeli President has been admitted to hospital because of an irregular heart rhythm (something I also suffer from). He is 92 years old. Maybe they will give him a heart transplant. If so, he may be able to continue for another 5 or 10 years.

                            Until after 5 or 10 years more, his kidneys give out Then, they could give him new kidneys.

                            I find this most odd. Where does it end?

                            Are we now to accept that we should have medical interventions that will enable us to replace the parts that fail so that we can go on forever?

                            Seems unnatural and unsustainable to me, especially regarding the cost of such interventions. And how could such expensive interventions be implemented equitably globally?

                            What do you think?

                            Philip
                            What it means is that those that have jobs will be paying higher taxes to pay for all the lazy couch potatoes. Simple but unfair concept.
                            My worst jump story:
                            My 13th jump was on the 13th day of the month, aircraft number 013.
                            As recorded on my DA Form 1307 Individual Jump Log.
                            No lie.

                            ~
                            "Everything looks all right. Have a good jump, eh."
                            -2 Commando Jumpmaster

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by PhilipLaos View Post
                              Growing up, I heard now and again that someone had died from "old age". Later, I learned that there is no such thing as dying from old age. We die because, just like automobiles, one or more of our vital parts has failed - heart, lungs, kidneys whatever.

                              Philip
                              Yes, there is such thing. When one gets old, metabolic activity of the entire organism slows down and can stop eventually. Unless, of course, opportunistic causes would take their toll. For example, a very old man can have good heart and other organs but can die due to infection (e.g. pneumonia), especially because his immunity functions are weaker (its physiologically predetermined - because of aging) than youngsters' functions.




                              Health insurance is the worst ever kind of healthcare.
                              "Keep Calm. Use Less X's"

                              Comment

                              Latest Topics

                              Collapse

                              Working...
                              X