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Rnd 1 Grp 4 - K1/K1A1 (South Korea) vs M60A1/A3 (USA)

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  • Rnd 1 Grp 4 - K1/K1A1 (South Korea) vs M60A1/A3 (USA)

    Round 1, Group 4: K1/K1A1 (South Korea) vs M60A1/A3 (USA)


    South Korea has put itself at the forefront of MBT development with its indigenous K1/K1A1 series, the general concept being based on the US M1 Abrams tanks. The Koreans went their own way with certain features such as the combination hydro-pneumatic and torsion-bar suspension; and a river-crossing/fording kit. Considering the terrain and seasonal changes in Korea, these are useful assets to general mobility. This is an advanced, well balanced and highly capable MBT.

    The US M60A1/A3 is a candidate in Group 3 and appears again here. It is a solid, very effective and proven design that has rendered excellent service for decades and continues to serve in some armies today.


    Question is, which of these very fine tanks should be considered tops for significance and influence?


    Only one of these two candidates will make it to the next round!

    Which of them is the most significant and/or influential?



    Candidate #57 - K1/K1A1 (South Korea)

    Service Entry – 1987
    Weight – 51-53 metric tons
    Top Speed – 65 km/h (40 mph)
    Main Armament – 105mm gun (K1); 120mm smoothbore (K1A1)
    No. Produced – 1,500 (approx.)

    For further info, check here:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/K1_88-Tank
    http://www.army-technology.com/projects/k1/














    Candidate #63 - M60A1/A3 (USA)

    Service Entry – 1962/63 (M60A1) 1978 (M60A3)
    Weight – 48-52 tons
    Top Speed – 48 km/h (30 mph)
    Main Armament – 105mm gun
    No. Produced – 15,000+ (includes original M60)

    For further info, check these:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M60_Patton
    http://www.army-technology.com/projects/m60/
















    Consider the criteria with care! You decide!


    87
    K1/K1A1 (South Korea)
    21.84%
    19
    M60A1/A3 (USA)
    78.16%
    68

    The poll is expired.

    Last edited by panther3485; 29 Jun 14, 04:05.
    "England expects that every man will do his duty!" (English crew members had better get ready for a tough fight against the combined French and Spanish fleets because that's what England expects! However, Scotland, Wales and Ireland appear to expect nothing so the Scottish, Welsh and Irish crew members can relax below decks if they like!)

  • #2
    I had a real problem with this one, since both were designed as improvements. Eventually went M60 which at least saw combat in a variety of places.
    How to Talk to a Climate Skeptic: http://grist.org/series/skeptics/
    Global Warming & Climate Change Myths: https://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php

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    • #3
      I would go with the M-60A3 with add on reactive armor.

      Pruitt
      Pruitt, you are truly an expert! Kelt06

      Have you been struck by the jawbone of an ASS lately?

      by Khepesh "This is the logic of Pruitt"

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Nick the Noodle View Post
        I had a real problem with this one, since both were designed as improvements. Eventually went M60 which at least saw combat in a variety of places.
        I agree. I don't think an unblooded design can count.
        Any man can hold his place when the bands play and women throw flowers; it is when the enemy presses close and metal shears through the ranks that one can acertain which are soldiers, and which are not.

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        • #5
          On paper the Korean tank is impressive, unfortunately ( or fortunately?) is is not battle tested. The M60 was a proven Work-horse.
          BoRG
          "... and that was the last time they called me Freakboy Moses"

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          • #6
            The K1 spawned the K2. Unfortunately, while the M60A3 is a great tank, it is also the end of the line for its design....it simply couldn't get better without prohibitive expense involved.

            In this case I'm going with the K1. I went with the M60 in the previous era because it continued to get better. By this current time it is rapidly becoming a 2nd line tank for any army, and the K1 design still has some room for improvement.
            Tacitos, Satrap of Kyrene

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            • #7
              The last M-60A3 was almost as modern as the first M-1 Abrams. The difference is the Chobham armor. The Korean tank is also designed to handle smaller people. I don't see this as an advantage but they wanted it that way.

              Pruitt
              Pruitt, you are truly an expert! Kelt06

              Have you been struck by the jawbone of an ASS lately?

              by Khepesh "This is the logic of Pruitt"

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              • #8
                SK's tank is a better design, lower and more ballistic, than the aging M60 series.
                Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes? Who is watching the watchers?

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                • #9
                  The K1A1 is much smaller and more modern than the M60A3,it has advanced armour and a 120mm gun coupled with sexy electronics.
                  The M60 has reached its sell by date,it was a helluva tank and I know that crewmen still miss the floor escape hatch for,ahem,private reasons!

                  The K1A1.

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                  • #10
                    If the US Army had not been buying a superior tank in the M-1, we could have fitted the same 120mm to our M-60 tanks in the inventory. The electronic gear could also have been changed out.

                    Pruitt
                    Pruitt, you are truly an expert! Kelt06

                    Have you been struck by the jawbone of an ASS lately?

                    by Khepesh "This is the logic of Pruitt"

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                    • #11
                      Based on the arguments made so far, I voted for the M60-A3.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Pruitt View Post
                        If the US Army had not been buying a superior tank in the M-1, we could have fitted the same 120mm to our M-60 tanks in the inventory. The electronic gear could also have been changed out.

                        Pruitt
                        I think there's an upgrade package that allows an M60 user to do just that.

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                        • #13
                          M60 gets my vote mainly due to its significant service record, being used in the past, or currently, by many countries. I'm not sure either is that influential, though I could see where future Korean designs might be based on the K1. It's a bit of a toss up here but I'll go with the M60.
                          "A foolish man thinks he knows everything if placed in unexpected difficulty; but he knows not what to answer, if to the test he is put."

                          --Hávamál

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                          • #14
                            Over 15,000 (all variants) of the M60 series.... we won't see production numbers like that these days. It was large enough to receive improvements, thus extending its life in the armed forces.
                            "In modern war... you will die like a dog for no good reason."
                            Ernest Hemingway.

                            In english "silence" means yelling louder than everyone else.

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                            • #15
                              My view of this Korean tank is ...

                              ... that it's an excellent modern MBT.

                              However, like the Japanese Type 90 its value is confined within the borders of its homeland, AFAIK. Both seem to have had zippo impact or influence outside of the nations that created them.

                              The US M60 series has been in service for much longer, with a considerable list of nations, and has fought in a substantial number of conflicts. Beside proving itself in battle in the general sense, it has also shown itself to be supremely upgradable.

                              Significance and influence both favour the M60A1/A3, IMO.
                              "England expects that every man will do his duty!" (English crew members had better get ready for a tough fight against the combined French and Spanish fleets because that's what England expects! However, Scotland, Wales and Ireland appear to expect nothing so the Scottish, Welsh and Irish crew members can relax below decks if they like!)

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