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Rnd 1 Grp 1 - Whippet tanks (Britain) vs Renault FT17 (France)

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  • Rnd 1 Grp 1 - Whippet tanks (Britain) vs Renault FT17 (France)

    Round 1, Group 1: Whippet tanks (Britain) vs Renault FT17 (France)

    The British 'Whippet' mediums were advanced for their day and helped to point the way to a series of successful inter-war designs.
    The French FT17 pioneered the internal layout that would become the norm for later generations of tanks right up until today.
    What will you favour? A major early progenitor of the "bread and butter" medium tank - a staple of some later armoured forces?
    Or do you lean towards a French machine that set the fundamental design pattern for the future of the tank?
    Only one of these two candidates will make it to the next round!

    Which of them is the most significant and/or influential?


    Candidate #2 - Whippet tanks (Britain)

    Active Service Entry 1918 (Whippet A; the B did not serve in the war)
    Weight 14 tons (Whippet A) 18 tons (Whippet B)
    Top Speed 13.4 km/h (8.3 mph) (A) 10 km/h (6 mph) (B)
    Main Armament 4 x .303 MGs (A and B)
    No. Produced 200 (A) 102 (B)

    For further basic info, you can start with Wiki here:


    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medium_Mark_A_Whippet

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medium_Mark_B


    Whippet A



    Whippet B




    Candidate #10 - Renault FT17 (France)

    Active Service Entry 1917/18
    Weight 6.6 metric tons
    Top Speed 8 Km/h (5 mph)
    Main Armament 37mm gun or 8mm MG
    No. Produced 3,800 (approx.)

    For further basic info, you can start with Wiki here:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renault_FT








    Consider the criteria with care! You decide!

    93
    Whippet tanks (Britain)
    17.20%
    16
    Renault FT17 (France)
    82.80%
    77

    The poll is expired.

    Last edited by Skoblin; 22 Jun 14, 04:46.
    "Chatfield, there seems to be something wrong with our bloody ships today!"
    Vice Admiral Beatty to Flag Captain Chatfield; Battle of Jutland, 31 May - 1 June, 1916.

  • #2
    While I have always liked the look of the Whippet tanks. The FT-17 was the more evolutionary design.
    BoRG
    "... and that was the last time they called me Freakboy Moses"

    Comment


    • #3
      The FT-17 design was still being used in WW II. That may not be a good thing! Maybe a bad tank is better than no tank at all? The Whippet was a worse design. There was no turret and no "main gun". The Renault was also a smaller target!

      Pruitt
      Pruitt, you are truly an expert! Kelt06

      Have you been struck by the jawbone of an ASS lately?

      by Khepesh "This is the logic of Pruitt"

      Comment


      • #4
        The Whippet(A) seems to me more an armed and armoured tractor than a tank.

        Paul
        ‘Tis said his form is tiny, yet
        All human ills he can subdue,
        Or with a bauble or medal
        Can win mans heart for you;
        And many a blessing know to stew
        To make a megloamaniac bright;
        Give honour to the dainty Corse,
        The Pixie is a little shite.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Arthwys View Post
          While I have always liked the look of the Whippet tanks. The FT-17 was the more evolutionary design.
          Totally agreed. This was one of the easier options.
          How to Talk to a Climate Skeptic: http://grist.org/series/skeptics/
          Global Warming & Climate Change Myths: https://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Dibble201Bty View Post
            The Whippet(A) seems to me more an armed and armoured tractor than a tank.
            Paul
            Dat is vey het get me vote

            Actually - tougher than it seems. The Whippet pioneered blitzkrieg tactics in 1920 with Wrangell AT:
            Esatz Stalingrad
            and in1921 in the Crimean. It 'pushed the speed envelope to the max for its mechanics.

            Major Philip Johnson, the unofficial head of Central Tank Corps Workshops in France, as soon as he received them began fitting one of the Whippets with leaf springs. Later, in 1918, he fitted this vehicle with sprung track rollers, Walter Gordon Wilson's epicyclical transmission from the Mark V and a 360 hp V12 Rolls-Royce Eagle aero-engine. A top speed of about 30 mph (48 km/h) was reached. This project made Johnson the best qualified man to develop the later fast Medium Mark D, which looks like a reversed Medium A. Other experiments included the fitting of a large trailing wheel taken from an old Mark I tank and attaching a climbing tail, in both cases attempts to increase trench-crossing ability.[12]
            Last edited by marktwain; 30 Jun 14, 10:15.
            The trout who swims against the current gets the most oxygen..

            Comment


            • #7
              Renault - more advanced and on the right track design-wise.
              Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes? Who is watching the watchers?

              Comment


              • #8
                The FT 17 was the first recognisable tank to enter service,the only advantage the Whippet has over it is firepower,given the conditions prevalent in WW1 an MG in every face of a fixed square cupola is not necessarily a disadvantage compared to one MG in a rotating turret.
                There were many targets presented simultaneously and I also wonder about the amount of ammo actually carried,can't be much in the teeny weeny hull of the FT17.
                Nevertheless,I'm going with the FT17 because it showed the way.

                Renault FT17.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by flash View Post
                  The FT 17 was the first recognisable tank to enter service,the only advantage the Whippet has over it is firepower,given the conditions prevalent in WW1 an MG in every face of a fixed square cupola is not necessarily a disadvantage compared to one MG in a rotating turret.
                  There were many targets presented simultaneously and I also wonder about the amount of ammo actually carried,can't be much in the teeny weeny hull of the FT17.
                  Nevertheless,I'm going with the FT17 because it showed the way.

                  Renault FT17.
                  The Whippet does also have a substantially longer track run and with it, one might expect, better trench-crossing ability. However, the FT is by far the more advanced of the two designs in general terms (most importantly, its layout) and, IMO, massively more significant/influential.
                  "Chatfield, there seems to be something wrong with our bloody ships today!"
                  Vice Admiral Beatty to Flag Captain Chatfield; Battle of Jutland, 31 May - 1 June, 1916.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Have to go with the Renault as the more important historically.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Another easy decision

                      The Renault FT: Of all the tanks that saw combat in WW1, a big jump ahead of any previous design in terms of internal layout and the main armament in a traversing turret.
                      "Chatfield, there seems to be something wrong with our bloody ships today!"
                      Vice Admiral Beatty to Flag Captain Chatfield; Battle of Jutland, 31 May - 1 June, 1916.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        The Renault FT is just the archetypical tank. A master stroke on the part of Louis Renault.

                        Ed.
                        The repetition of affirmations leads to belief. Once that belief becomes a deep conviction, you better wake up and look at the facts.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by dutched View Post
                          The Renault FT is just the archetypical tank. A master stroke on the part of Louis Renault.

                          Ed.
                          Renault matched the technology of the time by producing rugged light tank that could be steered and repaired.

                          the whippet was a deadly concept - when everything worked.
                          The trout who swims against the current gets the most oxygen..

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Must go with the Renault for all the obvious tech reasons. That and the Whippet is just ugly.
                            John

                            Play La Marseillaise. Play it!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              The FT 17 might be called the great grandfather of all modern tanks. It was the first to have a rotating turret and a really good layout for the time. It made economical use of manpower and was relatively easy and cheap to produce.
                              The Whippet was a very limited design with a very specialized purpose. Outside that niche at the time it was really a marginal tank.

                              Comment

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