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Rnd 8 (Supp) - Avro 504, U-1 & K2Y (Brit; SU; Jpn) vs DC-3/C-47 & Li-2 (USA; SU)

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  • Rnd 8 (Supp) - Avro 504, U-1 & K2Y (Brit; SU; Jpn) vs DC-3/C-47 & Li-2 (USA; SU)

    Round 8 (Supplementary)

    Avro 504 + U-1 & K2Y (Britain; SU/Russia; Japan)
    vs
    Douglas DC-3 & C-47 Skytrain/Dakota + Lisunov Li-2 (USA; SU/Russia)




    Candidate #129 - Avro 504 + U-1 & K2Y (Britain; SU/Russia; Japan)

    Service Intro - 1914
    Roles - Fighter/Interceptor; bomber; artillery spotting; recon; maritime patrol; anti-submarine; trainer; communications; target tug
    Quantity Produced - 10,000+
    User Nations - Britain; SU/Russia; Japan + more than 30 other countries

    For further info & some technical details, you can start with Wiki here:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avro_504












    Soviet U-1




    Candidate #76 - Douglas C-47* Skytrain/Dakota & Lisunov Li-2 (USA; SU/Russia)
    (*For tournament purposes, deemed to include all variants of this same basic airframe including the original US DC-3 passenger aircraft; as well as later Soviet/Russian & Japanese production.)

    Service Intro - 1936 (DC-3) and 1942 (C-47)
    Roles - airliner; general transport; VIP/liaison; paratroop; ambulance; search & rescue; glider & target tug; trainer; maritime patrol; photo recon; light bomber; carrier ops; gunship; ELINT & EW
    Quantity Produced - 18,000 (approx.)
    User Nations - USA + about 100 other countries

    For further info & some technical details, you can start with Wiki here:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_DC-3
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_C-47_Skytrain
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lisunov_Li-2
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Showa/Nakajima_L2D















    This match pits the Avro 504 against the Douglas DC-3/C-47. Which aircraft do you think most deserves to win?

    Only one of these two candidates will make the second and final Supplementary Round!
    Which of them is the more significant and/or influential, in your opinion?

    Consider the criteria with care! You decide!
    63
    Avro 504, U-1 & K2Y (Britain; SU/Russia; Japan)
    14.29%
    9
    Douglas C-47 Skytrain/Dakota & Li-2 (USA; SU/Russia)
    85.71%
    54

    The poll is expired.

    Last edited by panther3485; 16 Apr 16, 03:57.
    "England expects that every man will do his duty!" (English crew members had better get ready for a tough fight against the combined French and Spanish fleets because that's what England expects! However, Scotland, Wales and Ireland appear to expect nothing so the Scottish, Welsh and Irish crew members can relax below decks if they like!)

  • #2
    Gooney Bird for me!

    Pruitt
    Pruitt, you are truly an expert! Kelt06

    Have you been struck by the jawbone of an ASS lately?

    by Khepesh "This is the logic of Pruitt"

    Comment


    • #3
      Tough one, the Avro 504's influence is remarkable.
      "In modern war... you will die like a dog for no good reason."
      Ernest Hemingway.

      Comment


      • #4
        Very tricky. The Avro, I suspect ,is comparatively unknown -in stark contrast with the Dakota -which actually suggests that the latter has been more influential.
        But it's a near-run thing.
        "I dogmatise and am contradicted, and in this conflict of opinions and sentiments I find delight".
        Samuel Johnson.

        Comment


        • #5
          Voted Arvo, because it deserves some acknowledgment.
          "In modern war... you will die like a dog for no good reason."
          Ernest Hemingway.

          Comment


          • #6
            Puff the magic dragon
            you think you a real "bleep" solders you "bleep" plastic solders don't wory i will make you in to real "bleep" solders!! "bleep" plastic solders

            CPO Mzinyati

            Comment


            • #7
              You miss a lot of Avro roles including - anti sub, marine patrol (floatplane), kamikaze, artillery spotting, corps recce. AFAIK only type to have carried out bombing missions in both world wars. Made world's first strategic bombing raid in 1914
              Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe (H G Wells)
              Mit der Dummheit kaempfen Goetter selbst vergebens (Friedrich von Schiller)

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by MarkV View Post
                You miss a lot of Avro roles including - anti sub, marine patrol (floatplane), kamikaze, artillery spotting, corps recce. AFAIK only type to have carried out bombing missions in both world wars. Made world's first strategic bombing raid in 1914
                Thanks; I was in a bit of a hurry but would almost certainly still have missed at least one or two anyway; if previous experience in the campaign is any guide.
                Roles updated.

                Achievements, on the other hand (such as you point to in the second half of your post) rely more on a combination of individual member knowledge/research - at the most basic level, they can start with the wiki links I've provided - and quality posts in-thread, such as yours and those of other members with a substantial background in researching aircraft.
                Last edited by panther3485; 16 Apr 16, 07:42.
                "England expects that every man will do his duty!" (English crew members had better get ready for a tough fight against the combined French and Spanish fleets because that's what England expects! However, Scotland, Wales and Ireland appear to expect nothing so the Scottish, Welsh and Irish crew members can relax below decks if they like!)

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by panther3485 View Post
                  Round 8 (Supplementary)

                  Avro 504 + U-1 & K2Y (Britain; SU/Russia; Japan)
                  vs
                  Douglas DC-3 & C-47 Skytrain/Dakota + Lisunov Li-2 (USA; SU/Russia)



                  Candidate #129 - Avro 504 + U-1 & K2Y (Britain; SU/Russia; Japan)

                  Service Intro - 1914
                  Roles - Fighter/Interceptor; bomber; artillery spotting; recon; maritime patrol; anti-submarine; trainer; communications; target tug
                  Quantity Produced - 10,000+
                  User Nations - Britain; SU/Russia; Japan + more than 30 other countries

                  For further info & some technical details, you can start with Wiki here:
                  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avro_504



                  Candidate #76 - Douglas C-47* Skytrain/Dakota & Lisunov Li-2 (USA; SU/Russia)
                  (*For tournament purposes, deemed to include all variants of this same basic airframe including the original US DC-3 passenger aircraft; as well as later Soviet/Russian & Japanese production.)

                  Service Intro - 1936 (DC-3) and 1942 (C-47)
                  Roles - airliner; general transport; VIP/liaison; paratroop; ambulance; search & rescue; glider & target tug; trainer; maritime patrol; photo recon; light bomber; carrier ops; gunship; ELINT & EW
                  Quantity Produced - 18,000 (approx.)
                  User Nations - USA + about 100 other countries

                  For further info & some technical details, you can start with Wiki here:
                  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_DC-3
                  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douglas_C-47_Skytrain
                  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lisunov_Li-2
                  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Showa/Nakajima_L2D



                  This match pits the Avro 504 against the Douglas DC-3/C-47. Which aircraft do you think most deserves to win?

                  Only one of these two candidates will make the second and final Supplementary Round!
                  Which of them is the more significant and/or influential, in your opinion?

                  Consider the criteria with care! You decide!
                  The 504 was great for its time and was quite a handsome looking job but I can't go past the Dakota. lcm1
                  Last edited by panther3485; 17 Apr 16, 01:59. Reason: Removal of repeat images to reduce post size on screen
                  'By Horse by Tram'.


                  I was in when they needed 'em,not feeded 'em.
                  " Youuu 'Orrible Lot!"

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Achtung Baby View Post
                    Voted Arvo, because it deserves some acknowledgment.
                    Agreed, although if it were a close call, I would correctly vote US..
                    How to Talk to a Climate Skeptic: http://grist.org/series/skeptics/
                    Global Warming & Climate Change Myths: https://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I voted for the C-47 against the C-130 and I'll vote for it against this/these

                      Susie
                      Will no one tell me what she sings?--
                      Perhaps the plaintive numbers flow
                      For old, unhappy, far-off things,
                      And battles long ago:
                      -William Wordsworth, "The Solitary Reaper"

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I voted Avro as it had the far more important role - trainer.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Wicked. The Skytrain is mega-influential. It widened the envelope of aviation design and development, paving the way for the jet age.
                          My Articles, ALMOST LIVE, exclusive to The Armchair!

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                          • #14
                            Snap Poll for 2nd Supplementary

                            For all participating members, there is a snap poll to decide the match for the last Round:

                            http://www.armchairgeneral.com/forum...12#post3204912

                            "England expects that every man will do his duty!" (English crew members had better get ready for a tough fight against the combined French and Spanish fleets because that's what England expects! However, Scotland, Wales and Ireland appear to expect nothing so the Scottish, Welsh and Irish crew members can relax below decks if they like!)

                            Comment

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