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Rnd 2 Grp EF - De Havilland Mosquito (Britain) vs Martin B-26 Marauder (USA)

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  • Rnd 2 Grp EF - De Havilland Mosquito (Britain) vs Martin B-26 Marauder (USA)

    Round 2, Group EF:

    De Havilland Mosquito (Britain)
    vs
    Martin B-26 Marauder (USA)




    Candidate #75 - De Havilland Mosquito (Britain)

    Service Intro - 1942
    Roles - bomber; fighter-bomber; day & night fighter/interceptor; pathfinder; maritime strike; special & precision ops; recon; fast transport; carrier-based torpedo bomber; trainer; target tug
    Quantity Produced - 7,781
    User Nations - Britain + 20 other countries

    For further info & some technical details, you can start with Wiki here:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_Havilland_Mosquito









    Candidate #79 - Martin Marauder (USA)

    Service Intro - 1942
    Roles - medium bomber; torpedo bomber/anti-shipping; minelayer; recon; trainer
    Quantity Produced - 4,683
    User Nations - USA, Britain, France, South Africa

    For further info & some technical details, you can start with Wiki here:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_B-26_Marauder









    Will you vote for the Mosquito or the Marauder?


    Only one of these two candidates will make it to the next round!


    Which of them is the more significant and/or influential?


    Consider the criteria with care! You decide!
    87
    De Havilland Mosquito (Britain)
    90.80%
    79
    Martin B-26 Marauder (USA)
    9.20%
    8

    The poll is expired.

    Last edited by panther3485; 17 Jan 16, 03:26.
    "Chatfield, there seems to be something wrong with our bloody ships today!"
    Vice Admiral Beatty to Flag Captain Chatfield; Battle of Jutland, 31 May - 1 June, 1916.

  • #2
    The marauder was a great aircraft...
    but...

    "One a day in Tampa Bay"

    I vote for the Mossie, with truly multiple roles

    Susie
    Will no one tell me what she sings?--
    Perhaps the plaintive numbers flow
    For old, unhappy, far-off things,
    And battles long ago:
    -William Wordsworth, "The Solitary Reaper"

    Comment


    • #3
      I was determined with this match, to find something good to say about the Marauder.

      And it does have a very nice paint job in invasion markings.

      Seriously, the ETO and Pac theaters would be lost without the Martin bomber and its contribution. But, it was a might short ranged, and everything a Marauder could do the excellent and reliable b-25J Mitchell could do better.

      Sorry, Martin....you go down
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      • #4
        The Mossie did more roles and did them all well. It will be hard to choose against her based on performance. Of course the B-26 never fell apart in weather when the glue dissolved...

        Pruitt
        Pruitt, you are truly an expert! Kelt06

        Have you been struck by the jawbone of an ASS lately?

        by Khepesh "This is the logic of Pruitt"

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Pruitt View Post
          The Mossie did more roles and did them all well. It will be hard to choose against her based on performance. Of course the B-26 never fell apart in weather when the glue dissolved...

          Pruitt
          I suggest you read up on the findings. The glue wasn't the problem, it was shoddy workmanship in gluing the surface to the main spar combined with a faulty batch of said main spars.

          The Fighter-bomber variant still did its fighting and bombing against the Japs and still served out there after the war.

          You should also read up on the PR Mosquitoes in the Far East, where it was common for them to fly 2,000 to 2,500 mile missions.

          As an aside: One Mosquito flew from England to India in 12 hrs 25 minutes in mid 1945, beating the previous record held by another Mosquito by two minutes.

          Paul
          Last edited by Dibble201Bty; 18 Jan 16, 00:55.
          ‘Tis said his form is tiny, yet
          All human ills he can subdue,
          Or with a bauble or medal
          Can win mans heart for you;
          And many a blessing know to stew
          To make a megloamaniac bright;
          Give honour to the dainty Corse,
          The Pixie is a little shite.

          Comment


          • #6
            Tough choice on this one... I love both planes. I'm going with the wooden wonder.
            Credo quia absurdum.


            Quantum mechanics describes nature as absurd from the point of view of common sense. And yet it fully agrees with experiment. So I hope you can accept nature as She is - absurd! - Richard Feynman

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Dibble201Bty View Post
              I suggest you read up on the findings. The glue wasn't the problem, it was shoddy workmanship in gluing the surface to the main spar combined with a faulty batch of said main spars.

              The Fighter-bomber variant still did its fighting and bombing against the Japs and still served out there after the war.

              You should also read up on the PR Mosquitoes in the Far East, where it was common for them to fly 2,000 to 2,500 mile missions.

              As an aside: One Mosquito flew from England to India in 12 hrs 25 minutes in mid 1945, beating the previous record held by another Mosquito by two minutes.

              Paul
              The glue was a problem - it becomes very brittle after a time I have a mahogany table that was glued together using Mosquito glue - this has completely ceased to hold it together. I married into a Dh family and the consensus was that the findings were a bit of a cover up.
              Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe (H G Wells)
              Mit der Dummheit kaempfen Goetter selbst vergebens (Friedrich von Schiller)

              Comment


              • #8
                Another thing to consider is if it was faulty workers, the aircraft would have failed in other climes. The problem was only in the CBI area. Oh, I did look into it and faulty glue was mentioned as a possible cause.

                Pruitt
                Pruitt, you are truly an expert! Kelt06

                Have you been struck by the jawbone of an ASS lately?

                by Khepesh "This is the logic of Pruitt"

                Comment


                • #9
                  Mark, no doubt, has a lengthy 'tome' hidden away in his collection dealing with the issue of glue and Mosquitos in the Far East, no doubt written by a career academic specializing in wooden aircraft and the effects of tropical weather on main spar.

                  Mark, sometimes its just a privelage to sit back and watch some of your posts. God knows, half the time, I cannot comment, so must just observe.
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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by MarkV View Post
                    The glue was a problem - it becomes very brittle after a time I have a mahogany table that was glued together using Mosquito glue - this has completely ceased to hold it together. I married into a Dh family and the consensus was that the findings were a bit of a cover up.
                    The findings were not covered up. There was a difference in the findings but what isn't liked by some was that the faults were found to have emanated from the very de Havilland plant at Hatfield. The glue wasn't faulty at all. Now the environment in the far east may have had adverse effect on the glue but to say that the glue was at fault is wrong.
                    And just to state that the Mosquito served in the far east for 8 years which included the Malayan Emergency.

                    "It was eventually determined that the initial problems were the result of a combination of poor mate-up of some structural members, poor gluing practices and failure of glued joints, apparently most common among Far East aircraft after prolonged outdoor storage. It also appeared that swelling of the top skin could lead the securing screws to pull through.

                    Subsequent examination of European theatre aircraft found a much lower prevalence of joint defects, and no lifting of wing skins. Further investigation in India identified two main defects: the wing spar scarf joints, and the spar boom joints with the plywood skin and other ply members, leading to lifting of the upper surface plywood skin.

                    Consequently, Modification 638 was adopted: adding a spanwise plywood strip to seal the upper surface skin joint along the length of the front spar; along with application of protective aluminium dope overall (from February 1945). Despite these efforts, in the tropical conditions of the Far East the combination of heat and water soakage continued to give rise to swelling and shrinkage, resulting in spar defects until as late as 1954."

                    Paul
                    ‘Tis said his form is tiny, yet
                    All human ills he can subdue,
                    Or with a bauble or medal
                    Can win mans heart for you;
                    And many a blessing know to stew
                    To make a megloamaniac bright;
                    Give honour to the dainty Corse,
                    The Pixie is a little shite.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      While the B-26 does not deserve to win here, it is one of those planes who remains one of the very best MRA of all time, and plenty of less deserving aircraft will get a much higher placing. C'est la vie.
                      How to Talk to a Climate Skeptic: http://grist.org/series/skeptics/
                      Global Warming & Climate Change Myths: https://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Dibble201Bty View Post
                        The findings were not covered up. There was a difference in the findings but what isn't liked by some was that the faults were found to have emanated from the very de Havilland plant at Hatfield. The glue wasn't faulty at all. Now the environment in the far east may have had adverse effect on the glue but to say that the glue was at fault is wrong.
                        And just to state that the Mosquito served in the far east for 8 years which included the Malayan Emergency.

                        "It was eventually determined that the initial problems were the result of a combination of poor mate-up of some structural members, poor gluing practices and failure of glued joints, apparently most common among Far East aircraft after prolonged outdoor storage. It also appeared that swelling of the top skin could lead the securing screws to pull through.

                        Subsequent examination of European theatre aircraft found a much lower prevalence of joint defects, and no lifting of wing skins. Further investigation in India identified two main defects: the wing spar scarf joints, and the spar boom joints with the plywood skin and other ply members, leading to lifting of the upper surface plywood skin.

                        Consequently, Modification 638 was adopted: adding a spanwise plywood strip to seal the upper surface skin joint along the length of the front spar; along with application of protective aluminium dope overall (from February 1945). Despite these efforts, in the tropical conditions of the Far East the combination of heat and water soakage continued to give rise to swelling and shrinkage, resulting in spar defects until as late as 1954."

                        Paul
                        The physical make-up, fabrication/gluing, etc of the Mossie seems obviously to have been at something of a maintenance/durability disadvantage in hot, moist tropical climates.
                        However, I think we can accept such a climate-specific issue as being a notable but not excessively great flaw in an otherwise brilliant multi-role combat plane.
                        And it would seem the glue could eventually start to fail in almost any climate; given enough time; but how long was any combat plane - and especially one born to serve during WW2 - intended to last?

                        No plane is perfect but a handful have/do come close to perfection for their roles and IMHO the Mosquito is among that relative few.
                        "Chatfield, there seems to be something wrong with our bloody ships today!"
                        Vice Admiral Beatty to Flag Captain Chatfield; Battle of Jutland, 31 May - 1 June, 1916.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Again another tough choice. I like the Mosquito. How Many ships were sunk by the Marauder in Europe.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Wow, that was fast!
                            Had to throw a sympathy vote at the B-26 as we wave goodbye.

                            Mossie will certainly be in the final 4.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Probably wouldn't matter anyway, but I think the B-25 should have made it through to this round instead of the B-26 but the match-ups in round one were advantageous to the B-26. Head to head I believe the B-25 would beat the Marauder as a multi-role aircraft. Really just based on the fact that the B-25 was at least one time a carrier based medium bomber!
                              That being said, the Mossie should win either way. I think it would be a bit closer vs. the B-25 but not enough to sway it away from the Mossie. I think the multiple roles that the Mossie was able to handle made it pretty unique in WW2 terms. When a fast aircraft was needed for a specialty mission it seems that it was the Mossie that was called upon, and it handled whatever they could throw at it.

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