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Rnd 5 - Messerschmitt Me 262 (Germany) vs McDonnell Douglas F-15 Eagle (USA)

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  • Rnd 5 - Messerschmitt Me 262 (Germany) vs McDonnell Douglas F-15 Eagle (USA)

    Round 5 (Quarter-Final): Messerschmitt Me 262 (Germany) vs McDonnell Douglas F-15 Eagle (USA)


    Messerschmitt Me 262
    The Me 262 Schwalbe ("Swallow") of Nazi Germany was the world's first operational jet-powered fighter aircraft. Design work started before World War II began but engine problems and other issues kept the aircraft from operational status with the Luftwaffe until mid-1944. Heavily armed, it was faster than any Allied fighter, including the British jet-powered Gloster Meteor. The Me 262 was used in a variety of roles including day fighter/interceptor, light bomber, reconnaissance and experimental night fighter versions. Me 262 pilots claimed a total of 542 Allied kills, although higher claims are sometimes made. The Allies countered its potential effectiveness in the air by attacking the aircraft on the ground and during takeoff and landing. Engine reliability problems, from the pioneering nature of its Junkers Jumo 004 axial-flow turbojet engines - the first ones ever placed in mass production - and attacks by Allied forces on fuel supplies during the deteriorating late-war situation also reduced the effectiveness of the aircraft. In the end, the Me 262 had a negligible impact on the course of the war. German use of the aircraft ended with the close of the Second World War but a small number were operated by the Czechoslovak Air Force until 1951. Captured Me 262s were studied and flight tested by the major powers, and ultimately influenced the designs of a number of post-war aircraft such as the North American F-86 Sabre and Boeing B-47 Stratojet.

    McDonnell Douglas F-15 Eagle
    The McDonnell Douglas (now Boeing) F-15 Eagle is an American twin-engine, all-weather tactical fighter designed to gain and maintain air superiority. It is among the most successful modern fighters, with over 100 aerial combat victories. Following reviews of proposals, the United States Air Force selected McDonnell Douglas' design in 1967 to meet the service's need for a dedicated air superiority fighter. The F-15's outstanding maneuverability for a large fighter is derived from low wing loading (weight to wing area ratio) with a high thrust-to-weight ratio enabling the aircraft to turn tightly without losing airspeed. The F-15 can climb to 30,000 ft (10,000 m) in around 60 seconds. The thrust output of the dual engines is greater than the aircraft's weight, thus giving it the ability to accelerate in a vertical climb. The weapons and flight control systems are designed so that one person can safely and effectively perform air-to-air combat. The A and C-models are single-seat variants; these were the main air superiority versions produced. B and D-models add a second seat behind the pilot for training. E-models use the second seat for a weapon systems officer. The Eagle first flew in July 1972, and entered service in 1976. The Eagle has since been exported to Israel, Japan, and Saudi Arabia, among other nations. The F-15 was originally envisioned as a pure air superiority aircraft. Its design included a secondary ground-attack capability that was largely unused. The design proved flexible enough that an all-weather strike derivative, the F-15E Strike Eagle, was later developed, entering service in 1989. The F-15 Eagle is expected to be in service with the U.S. Air Force past 2025. Newer models are still being produced for foreign users. The F-15 production line is set to end in 2019, 47 years after the type's first flight.


    In your opinion, which fighter rates highest against the criteria for this tournament? The Me 262 or the F-15?

    Only one of these two candidates will make it to the Semi-Final!


    Which of them was/is the more significant and/or influential?




    Candidate #83 - Messerschmitt Me 262 (Germany)

    Full Service From (approx) – 1944
    Quantity produced - 1,433
    User Nations - Germany, Czechoslovakia

    For further info & some technical details, you can start with Wiki here:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messerschmitt_Me_262











    Candidate #119 - McDonnell Douglas F-15 Eagle (USA)

    Full Service From (approx) – 1976
    Quantity produced - 1,198
    User Nations - USA, Israel, Japan, Saudi Arabia

    For further info & some technical details, you can start with Wiki here:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McDonne...las_F-15_Eagle











    Consider the criteria with care! You decide!
    91
    Messerschmitt Me 262 (Germany)
    59.34%
    54
    McDonnell Douglas F-15 Eagle (USA)
    40.66%
    37

    The poll is expired.

    Last edited by panther3485; 01 May 15, 11:10.
    "England expects that every man will do his duty!" (English crew members had better get ready for a tough fight against the combined French and Spanish fleets because that's what England expects! However, Scotland, Wales and Ireland appear to expect nothing so the Scottish, Welsh and Irish crew members can relax below decks if they like!)

  • #2
    I went the 262. It was the start of the era of the jet fighter. That shouts significant. Though it did not influence much in terms of the next fighters being first counts.
    you think you a real "bleep" solders you "bleep" plastic solders don't wory i will make you in to real "bleep" solders!! "bleep" plastic solders

    CPO Mzinyati

    Comment


    • #3
      The Me 262 was a very poor fighter if you take in all of its defects. The F-15 was a great improvement over the F-4 and F-106.

      Pruitt
      Pruitt, you are truly an expert! Kelt06

      Have you been struck by the jawbone of an ASS lately?

      by Khepesh "This is the logic of Pruitt"

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Pruitt View Post
        The Me 262 was a very poor fighter if you take in all of its defects. The F-15 was a great improvement over the F-4 and F-106.

        Pruitt
        This Is not a best of though.
        you think you a real "bleep" solders you "bleep" plastic solders don't wory i will make you in to real "bleep" solders!! "bleep" plastic solders

        CPO Mzinyati

        Comment


        • #5
          The Eagle is still the premier fighter since its introduction. And one hasn't been lost in air combat yet.

          It shattered 8 time to climb records, shot down a hundred migs for no losses.

          No doubt that the Russians were rightfully afraid of this plane.

          http://www.boeing.com/history/products/f-15-eagle.page

          While I like the ME-262, it's not even close...
          Credo quia absurdum.


          Quantum mechanics describes nature as absurd from the point of view of common sense. And yet it fully agrees with experiment. So I hope you can accept nature as She is - absurd! - Richard Feynman

          Comment


          • #6
            The Me262 is still and always the first jet fighter flown in combat, and remains the genesis of all which follow.
            Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes? Who is watching the watchers?

            Comment


            • #7
              In this match up you have the Me 262 which in the big picture is now just one of a number of early jet fighters (He 280, Meteor, P-59) to appear. It had no real influence on future aircraft design beyond the contribution of aeronautical data on swept wings.

              The F-15 represents a new generation of aircraft that was revolutionized by the use of computer modelling and design. It was the first to really make major use of that and it shows not just in the F-15 but in why so many other aircraft in the next 20 years look vaguely similar to it.

              The F-15 took the fighter to a new level of excellence.
              The Me 262 was one of several first generation jets and potentially one of the best but it was also crippled by its terrible engines and iffy manufacturing standards.

              Comment


              • #8
                I went with the 15.
                Dispite our best intentions, the system is dysfunctional that intelligence failure is guaranteed.
                Russ Travers, CIA analyst, 2001

                Comment


                • #9
                  Me-262 - it's not the quality of the beast, it proved the viability of the concept.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by broderickwells View Post
                    Me-262 - it's not the quality of the beast, it proved the viability of the concept.
                    If that's all there is to it, then the He 280, P-59, and Meteor did that before the 262 did and did it much better.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I'm stunned.

                      The F-15 is trailing is this poll.....
                      "In modern war... you will die like a dog for no good reason."
                      Ernest Hemingway.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Achtung Baby View Post
                        I'm stunned.

                        The F-15 is trailing is this poll.....
                        Me too. In the larger scheme of things the Me 262 had little significance and no real impact on anything. There were other jets around at the same time, and even before it. The only thing it contributed to was showing the value of the swept wing and even that is tenuous.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          F-15: it was the greatest air superiority fighter ever built and is still being imitated today. The ME-262 was a rushed-out attempt to stem the Allied tide with a horrid survival rate and an even more horrid engine life

                          Susie
                          Will no one tell me what she sings?--
                          Perhaps the plaintive numbers flow
                          For old, unhappy, far-off things,
                          And battles long ago:
                          -William Wordsworth, "The Solitary Reaper"

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
                            Me too. In the larger scheme of things the Me 262 had little significance and no real impact on anything. There were other jets around at the same time, and even before it. The only thing it contributed to was showing the value of the swept wing and even that is tenuous.
                            Still, the 262 is the only one that had a combat record and not that bad of a one considering it was operating against all but total air superiority. Swept wings have been used ever since. Isn't that a bit of influence?
                            "Ask not what your country can do for you"

                            Left wing, Right Wing same bird that they are killing.

                            you’re entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Achtung Baby View Post
                              I'm stunned.

                              The F-15 is trailing is this poll.....
                              Remeber that the theme is most influence.
                              "Ask not what your country can do for you"

                              Left wing, Right Wing same bird that they are killing.

                              you’re entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts.

                              Comment

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