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Rnd 1 Grp G - NA F-100 Super Sabre (USA) vs English Electric Lightning (Britain)

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  • Rnd 1 Grp G - NA F-100 Super Sabre (USA) vs English Electric Lightning (Britain)

    Round 1, Group G: North American F-100 Super Sabre (USA) vs English Electric Lightning (Britain)


    North American F-100 Super Sabre
    The F-100 Super Sabre served with the United States Air Force (USAF) from 1954 to 1971 and with the Air National Guard (ANG) until 1979. The first of the "Century Series" collection of USAF jet fighters, it was the first USAF fighter capable of supersonic speed in level flight. The F-100 was originally designed as a higher performance follow-on to the F-86 Sabre air superiority fighter. Adapted as a fighter bomber, the F-100 was supplanted by the Mach two class F-105 Thunderchief for strike missions over North Vietnam. The F-100 flew extensively over South Vietnam as the air force's primary close air support jet until being replaced by the more efficient subsonic LTV A-7 Corsair II. The F-100 also served in other NATO air forces and with other U.S. allies. In its later life, it was often referred to as "the Hun"; a shortened version of "one hundred". By 1972, the F-100 was mostly phased out of USAF active service and turned over to tactical fighter groups and squadrons in the ANG.

    English Electric Lightning
    The English Electric Lightning is a supersonic jet fighter aircraft of the Cold War era. It was designed, developed, and manufactured by English Electric, who were subsequently absorbed by the newly-formed British Aircraft Corporation. It was then marketed as the BAC Lightning. The Lightning was the only all-British Mach 2 fighter aircraft to enter service and was the first aircraft capable of supercruise. The Lightning was used by the Royal Air Force (RAF) and the Royal Saudi Air Force (RSAF). Although it was the RAF's primary interceptor for more than two decades it was never required to attack another aircraft. The Lightning was developed to intercept increasingly capable bomber aircraft (Tupolev Tu-16, Tupolev Tu-22, Tupolev Tu-95), and thus had exceptional rate of climb, ceiling, and speed; pilots have described flying it as "being saddled to a skyrocket". This performance made the Lightning a 'fuel critical' aircraft meaning that its missions are dictated to a high degree by its limited range (point defense interceptor). Later developments provided greater range and speed along with aerial reconnaissance and ground-attack capability. The EE Lightning was retired from service in the late 1980s.


    Will you vote for the Super Sabre or the Lightning?

    Only one of these two candidates will make it to the next round!

    Which of them is the more significant and/or influential?




    Candidate #97 - North American F-100 Super Sabre (USA)

    Full Service From (approx) 1954
    Quantity produced - 2,294
    User Nations - USA, Denmark, France, Taiwan, Turkey

    For further info & some technical details, you can start with Wiki here:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_A...00_Super_Sabre











    Candidate #106 - English Electric Lightning (Britain)

    Full Service From (approx) 1960
    Quantity produced - 337
    User Nations - Britain, Kuwait, Saudi Arabia

    For further info & some technical details, you can start with Wiki here:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_Electric_Lightning











    Consider the criteria with care! You decide!
    75
    North American F-100 Super Sabre (USA)
    72.00%
    54
    English Electric Lightning F1 & F2 (Britain)
    28.00%
    21

    The poll is expired.

    Last edited by panther3485; 07 Mar 15, 11:06.
    "England expects that every man will do his duty!" (English crew members had better get ready for a tough fight against the combined French and Spanish fleets because that's what England expects! However, Scotland, Wales and Ireland appear to expect nothing so the Scottish, Welsh and Irish crew members can relax below decks if they like!)

  • #2
    I like both fighters, but I believe the "Thud" was better.

    Pruitt
    Pruitt, you are truly an expert! Kelt06

    Have you been struck by the jawbone of an ASS lately?

    by Khepesh "This is the logic of Pruitt"

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    • #3
      Lightning, because I want to own and fly one .
      How to Talk to a Climate Skeptic: http://grist.org/series/skeptics/
      Global Warming & Climate Change Myths: https://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php

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      • #4
        The "Hun" was a mediocre design that rendered better service than almost any other aircraft of its generation. There were F-100's that few to nearly 50,000 + hours on the airframe.
        As a fighter bomber it was nothing special. As a fighter it was outmatched. But, it flew reliably and was dogged and flogged for its very long and successful career.

        The BAC Lighting on the other had was a victim of short-sighted British aircraft procurement policy. The plane was essentially little more than a F-104A or C flying a decade too late. It didn't evolve into much more than a daylight interceptor with a couple of cannon and IR missiles. The fighter bomber role never materialized and foreign sales were all but non-existent.
        It was another decent British design that was behind the times and crippled by horrid government policy.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Pruitt View Post
          I like both fighters, but I believe the "Thud" was better.

          Pruitt
          I may be mistaken but I think the affectionate nickname "Thud" was given to the F-105 Thunderchief, rather than the F-100? At least, that's what I seem to remember reading somewhere.
          "England expects that every man will do his duty!" (English crew members had better get ready for a tough fight against the combined French and Spanish fleets because that's what England expects! However, Scotland, Wales and Ireland appear to expect nothing so the Scottish, Welsh and Irish crew members can relax below decks if they like!)

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by panther3485 View Post
            I may be mistaken but I think the affectionate nickname "Thud" was given to the F-105 Thunderchief, rather than the F-100? At least, that's what I seem to remember reading somewhere.
            The F-100 was nicknamed the "Hun" or less commonly "the Lead Sled." Both were references to it's less than capable handling versus other aircraft. What made it a great aircraft was it was relatively cheap to produce... 16 Fighter Wings equipped with it at its height.
            The plane was everywhere. When the USAF started to phase them out every foreign military got them. The National Guard and Reserve flew them into the 80's.
            The F-100 also pioneered life extension programs so many aircraft use today. Many exceeded 10,000 hours flying time. Compare that to a P-51 or Spitfire where the service life was expected to be 100 to 300 hours...!
            The 3rd TFW in Vietnam alone flew over 100,000 combat missions... Overall, the Hun flew more missions and had more flight time than every P-51 combined.
            It was a remarkable aircraft of pedestrian qualities. It wasn't particularly fast. It had so-so maneuverability. The payload wasn't anything remarkable. Yet, around the world the Hun trucked in bombs, flew Wild Weasel, and served in other roles, almost none of which required it to be an air superiority fighter.
            Last edited by T. A. Gardner; 08 Mar 15, 00:19.

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            • #7
              Not the Lightning F6, I notice.(An oversight, perhaps ?).

              Whatever, the English Electric / BAC product was a superb interceptor but for versatility and influential design I think that the "Hun" was more significant. And it did possess a combat record.
              "I dogmatise and am contradicted, and in this conflict of opinions and sentiments I find delight".
              Samuel Johnson.

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              • #8
                I've always loved the Lightning. And now, I can identify with it. It's got a gut.

                But the Hun wins.
                ALL LIVES SPLATTER!

                BLACK JEEPS MATTER!

                BLACK MOTORCYCLES MATTER!

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by BELGRAVE View Post
                  Not the Lightning F6, I notice.(An oversight, perhaps ?).

                  Whatever, the English Electric / BAC product was a superb interceptor but for versatility and influential design I think that the "Hun" was more significant. And it did possess a combat record.
                  Yes indeed, an oversight and thanks for picking that up.
                  Even though the poll heading doesn't mention the F6, for the purpose of their evaluations members can deem it to include that variant as well, if they wish.

                  A bit late to tamper with a heading for this round I suppose but if the EE Lightning survives Round 1 I can fix it before Round 2 kicks off. Especially as the F6 was supposed to be included.
                  "England expects that every man will do his duty!" (English crew members had better get ready for a tough fight against the combined French and Spanish fleets because that's what England expects! However, Scotland, Wales and Ireland appear to expect nothing so the Scottish, Welsh and Irish crew members can relax below decks if they like!)

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
                    The F-100 was nicknamed the "Hun" or less commonly "the Lead Sled."
                    I was under the impression the CF-100 was known as the "Lead Sled".

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      F-100.

                      For the record, TAG, the "Lead Sled" was one of the monikers given to the F-105.

                      The initial reaction of the fighter pilot community to their new aircraft was lukewarm. Between its massive dimensions and troubled early service life, the F-105 had garnered a number of uncomplimentary nicknames. In addition to the aforementioned "Thud", nicknames included the "Squat Bomber", "Lead Sled", and the "Hyper Hog" and/or "Ultra Hog".[38] The aircraft's offensive capabilities were sarcastically referred to as a "Triple Threat" it could bomb you, strafe you, or fall on you.
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                      • #12
                        Apparently, there were a number of "Lead Sleds" at that time...

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                        • #13
                          The major reason the EE Lighting really was a minor player in the 60's and 70's was again a myopic British government procurement policy. It was almost a miracle that the plane got built at all. The project was deemed too far advanced to cancel but procurement was limited to a relative handful of planes.
                          That same policy meant that the Lighting never advanced beyond being a simple day fighter armed with cannon and IR missiles. As a basic daylight interceptor it was great. But, it was competing with other double sonic aircraft that were truly multi-mission and all weather capable armed with radar guided missiles, IR missiles of more advanced design, and cannon. It had the potential to be a sales rival for Lockheed's F-104 but the powers that be in the British government saw to it that would never happen.

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                          • #14
                            lighting because i have seen them flying. All so, super cruise
                            you think you a real "bleep" solders you "bleep" plastic solders don't wory i will make you in to real "bleep" solders!! "bleep" plastic solders

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                            • #15
                              Super Sabre easily.

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