Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Best WW2 Commanders Tank - Part 1

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Best WW2 Commanders Tank - Part 1

    Europe and North Africa 39-41.

    Which tank would you believe to be the Generals choice of best tank for this era?

    PzIII


    https://67.media.tumblr.com/aea5d07f...dapo1_1280.jpg

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panzer_III

    PzIV


    http://www.achtungpanzer.com/images/pz4e_7.jpg

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panzer_IV

    Pz 38t


    http://germandressdaggers.com/panzer38(t)a.jpg

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panzer_38(t)

    Char B1 bis


    http://ww2photo.se/tanks/fr/char/07003.jpg

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Char_B1

    Souma S35


    http://www.worldwarphotos.info/wp-co...erman_tank.jpg

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SOMUA_S35

    Renault R35


    http://carinsuranceav.com/data_image...ult-r35-03.jpg

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renault_R35

    Matilda A12


    http://www.militaryfactory.com/armor...matilda-ii.jpg

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matilda_II

    A10


    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...CruiserMk2.jpg

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cruiser_Mk_II

    M11/39, M13/40 & M14/41


    http://www.tanks-encyclopedia.com/wp...14-41-tank.jpg

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiat_M11/39
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiat_M13/40
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiat_M14/41
    66
    Pz III
    34.85%
    23
    Pz IV
    33.33%
    22
    Pz 38t
    4.55%
    3
    Char B1 bis
    1.52%
    1
    Somua S35
    6.06%
    4
    Renault R35
    1.52%
    1
    Matilda A12
    15.15%
    10
    Cruiser II & IIA A10
    3.03%
    2
    Fiat M11/39, M13/40 and M14/41
    0.00%
    0
    How to Talk to a Climate Skeptic: http://grist.org/series/skeptics/
    Global Warming & Climate Change Myths: https://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php

  • #2
    My knee-jerk reflex would be to vote PZ III,

    based on general considerations such as the command factor contributing to the German success with Blitzkrieg in the indicated period 1939-1941,
    so my choice has to German and
    IIRC the PanzerBefehlsWagen was designed on the hull & turret of the Pz III

    but I like to see some opinions before I cast my vote
    Last edited by Colonel Sennef; 03 Oct 16, 04:10.
    BoRG

    You may not be interested in War, but War is interested in You - Leon Trotski, June 1919.

    Comment


    • #3
      PzIV for me,it had everything the III had but added a useful HE round,it's big and slow AP round was also capable of killing anything that the III's small and fast 37mm AP round could.
      This infantry support tank eventually replaced the III as the Heers anti tank tank and became a mainstay throughout the war.

      Comment


      • #4
        Admittedly I am a bit on thin ice but I was under the impression that Panzerbefehlswagens were equipped with dummy guns
        in order to save space in the interior for the general to command the battle
        while from the outside the command tank with dummy guns did not look too conspiciously as a command tank, lest it would be an obvious prime target.
        BoRG

        You may not be interested in War, but War is interested in You - Leon Trotski, June 1919.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by flash View Post
          PzIV for me,it had everything the III had but added a useful HE round,it's big and slow AP round was also capable of killing anything that the III's small and fast 37mm AP round could.
          This infantry support tank eventually replaced the III as the Heers anti tank tank and became a mainstay throughout the war.
          Zaloga also chose the Pz IV for those very same reasons, although it should be noted that the III had superior overall armour protection than the IV at this time.

          Rommel liked the 38t. It had less armour than the III, and only a 2 man turret, but it was easily maintainable, very reliable and needed fewer resources to keep it operational.

          The Somua S35 and A12 Matilda are probably too unreliable to be considered, and the Char B1 bis too complicated.

          Of the others, I would choose the A10. What you have is a very reliable tank, with a proper 3 man turret, and better armed than either the III or IV with either the 2pdr and 95mm respectively. The only real problem with the A10 within this time frame, was that the concept of a heavy cruiser was lost on the British at this time.

          A10 for me.
          How to Talk to a Climate Skeptic: http://grist.org/series/skeptics/
          Global Warming & Climate Change Myths: https://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php

          Comment


          • #6
            Something has gone very wrong if a general's command tank has to use its gun so armamant is of lesser importance to me than armour.
            I'm still with the PzIII
            BoRG

            You may not be interested in War, but War is interested in You - Leon Trotski, June 1919.

            Comment


            • #7
              Nick, a word of clarification on this poll if you please.

              When you speak of "Which tank would you believe to be the Generals choice of best tank for this era?"
              do you mean: 'which tank would you pick as a general to lead a battle from' (as I interpreted 'WW2 commanders tank' so far)
              or something else?
              BoRG

              You may not be interested in War, but War is interested in You - Leon Trotski, June 1919.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Major Sennef View Post
                Nick, a word of clarification on this poll if you please.

                When you speak of "Which tank would you believe to be the Generals choice of best tank for this era?"
                do you mean: 'which tank would you pick as a general to lead a battle from' (as I interpreted 'WW2 commanders tank' so far)
                or something else?
                By commander, we are looking at operational and strategic issues, rather than tactical ability. For example, you could probably field three Pz 38t's for every two Pz III's. A soldier would prefer to serve in a better armoured tank with superior crew layout, but sometimes numbers count. Further, crew would not really care too much about fuel economy, while a general would.

                A soldiers tank would be one that an individual would want to..
                1. Keep him alive, and...
                2. Kill the enemy. Usually in that order of priority.
                No other priorities come close.

                Generals have to look at the bigger picture. Using an (over) simplified scenario, imagine two commanders about to fight. One has two tanks. The second has a single tank twice as good as the other commanders. At first glance it may appear the odds are even. However, allowing for a Lanchester Square Law scenario, the two tanks are actually twice as effective in overall terms as compared to the better single tank.

                That is why general's choices are often superior to troopers choices, and why Patton preferred Shermans to the 'Cat's' as an example. Hope that clarifies the difference.
                How to Talk to a Climate Skeptic: http://grist.org/series/skeptics/
                Global Warming & Climate Change Myths: https://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Nick the Noodle View Post
                  Hope that clarifies the difference.
                  It does, thnx
                  I was till now considering the choices in the poll as (general's) command vehicle, that will change now.
                  Luckily didn't cast vote yet.
                  BoRG

                  You may not be interested in War, but War is interested in You - Leon Trotski, June 1919.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    PzIV, Pz38t or A10

                    Was able to bring the poll's choices back to two
                    but cannot decide yet between PzIV, Pz38t and A10

                    Will sleep a night over it.
                    Last edited by Colonel Sennef; 04 Oct 16, 02:55.
                    BoRG

                    You may not be interested in War, but War is interested in You - Leon Trotski, June 1919.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I went with the Panzer IV. French tanks were useful only for retreating, and the Brits couldn't build a decent tank until the very end of the war.
                      Any man can hold his place when the bands play and women throw flowers; it is when the enemy presses close and metal shears through the ranks that one can acertain which are soldiers, and which are not.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Nick the Noodle View Post

                        Of the others, I would choose the A10. What you have is a very reliable tank, with a proper 3 man turret, and better armed than either the III or IV with either the 2pdr and 95mm respectively.
                        According to the Wiki article the 3.7" was 84mm and not the later 95mm howitzer seen on the follow on CS tanks.
                        Eagles may fly; but weasels aren't sucked into jet engines!

                        "I'm not expendable; I'm not stupid and I'm not going." - Kerr Avon, Blake's 7

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by RichardS View Post
                          According to the Wiki article the 3.7" was 84mm and not the later 95mm howitzer seen on the follow on CS tanks.
                          3.7" = 93.98mm, ie 94mm .
                          How to Talk to a Climate Skeptic: http://grist.org/series/skeptics/
                          Global Warming & Climate Change Myths: https://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Nick the Noodle View Post
                            3.7" = 93.98mm, ie 94mm .
                            Okay I'll admit the 84mm was probably a typo. But still a different weapon than the later 95mm how. I decided, reluctantly, to go with the Panzer III over the Matilda II.
                            Eagles may fly; but weasels aren't sucked into jet engines!

                            "I'm not expendable; I'm not stupid and I'm not going." - Kerr Avon, Blake's 7

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I chose the Somua, picking as a general.

                              Pruitt
                              Pruitt, you are truly an expert! Kelt06

                              Have you been struck by the jawbone of an ASS lately?

                              by Khepesh "This is the logic of Pruitt"

                              Comment

                              Latest Topics

                              Collapse

                              Working...
                              X