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How to Deal With Falujah?

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  • How to Deal With Falujah?

    If you were a coalition commander, what would you do with the hotbed of terrorism Falujah?
    17
    Artillery & air strikes on the city. Destroy the city and population
    11.76%
    2
    Combined arms assault on the city. Protect population as much as possible
    5.88%
    1
    Evacuate the city. Move population to detention center. Search empty city for insurgents and weapon stockpiles
    17.65%
    3
    Use special forces and spies to infiltrate. Launch precision air strikes on selected targets (such as safehouese) only
    41.18%
    7
    Negotiate with militants
    11.76%
    2
    Stay away from the city, ignore militants
    5.88%
    1
    Other (explain)
    5.88%
    1

    "Artillery adds dignity to what would otherwise be a ugly brawl."
    --Frederick II, King of Prussia

  • #2
    Nuke 'em !
    "The conventional army loses if it does not win. The guerrilla wins if he does not lose."

    Henry Alfred Kissinger

    Comment


    • #3
      Well first you invite a lot of Hollywood liberals, like Hanks, Penn, Depp, Babs and Serandon, to Falujah to help negociate with the militants....then nuke 'em !!!!!

      Comment


      • #4
        What's the objective? Maximum casualties?

        Comment


        • #5
          Neutron weapon effectiveness test?
          Black & blue from the TOAW learning curve!

          Comment


          • #6
            I chose negotiate. I don't think force will bring the city, or the region under control. The militants enjoy considerable support, which is a great cover. More importantly, the use of force by the Coalition reinforces their argument of oppression.

            The best we can hope for is that there are still reasonable individuals among the city's ranks who possess the political influence to deter further violence given specific conditions are provided. If all else fails, the Coalition could seek to somehow isolate the city, while moving forward with reforms elsewhere. Hopefully, the local population will change it's mind after seeing other Iraqis prosper, and want to be a part of that. If not, containment undermines the militants ability to project violent intent, and buys everyone time to hopefully find an alternate solution.

            (Of course containment is easier said than done. There are number of drawbacks, particularly if conditions in the city are more quiet or severe than elsewhere.)

            In the end, we (America and the international community) has to show more concern for innocent civilians than our opponents, even if doing so exposes us to greater danger.

            Fallujah would have little choice, but to seek peace if the Coalition were able to establish better conditions for the greater good. So while we must pay attention to the city, and try to curtail violence arising from that point, our main focus must be on Iraq as a whole.
            "As soon as men decide that all means are permitted to fight an evil, then their good becomes indistinguishable from the evil that they set out to destroy."-Christopher Dawson - The Judgement of Nations, 1942

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            • #7
              i think tactical nuke would be appropriate for this town.
              "Speaking here in my capacity as a polished, sophisticated European as well, it seems to me the laugh here is on the polished, sophisticated Europeans. They think Americans are fat, vulgar, greedy, stupid, ambitious and ignorant and so on. And they've taken as their own Michael Moore, as their representative American, someone who actually embodies all of those qualities." - Christopher Hitchens

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              • #8
                I like the special forces and spy idea most. You have to get a couple of guys with LTD's in make some birds loaded with GBU's circle the city and strike fast on a target paonted by the personell on the ground, thus effectively blowing away the "rebel leaders" opening the way to nagotiations thus giving the uncontrolled mob the chance to surrender.
                "A platoon of Chinese tanks viciously attacked a Soviet harvester,
                which was peacefully working a field near the Soviet-Chinese border.
                The harvester returned fire and upon destroying the enemy
                returned to its home base."

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by mr_clark
                  I like the special forces and spy idea most. You have to get a couple of guys with LTD's in make some birds loaded with GBU's circle the city and strike fast on a target paonted by the personell on the ground, thus effectively blowing away the "rebel leaders" opening the way to nagotiations thus giving the uncontrolled mob the chance to surrender.
                  They've been employing this tactic for weeks now. Marine Sniper/Scout teams and special operations forces have been infiltrating the city, setting up covert observation stations, and trying to pinpoint key rebels. CENTCOM say they came real close to pushing Zarqawi's wig back.

                  Its not a bad tactic. However, I don't believe it is the most efficient, at least at the moment. I believe the opposition force is a classic example of "Netwar." There is no leader. Instead, groups are united only by a common "story". They might have standard operating procedure-like plans in place that permits the execution of coordinated attacks.

                  I don't think we can abandon the use of force. However, our only real chance for bringing Fallujah under control is finding a way to work with community leaders who are against violence. They don't need to be a member of the terrorist group. He just needs to be influential enough to undermine support for violence.

                  At the same time, the US might want to consider planning an all-out assault on the city at later date. If Fallujah is the center-of-gravity so to speak, then we might be able to isolate the city, and improve our position in the rest of the country. This would give us more political latitude in the event of a major attack on Fallujah.
                  "As soon as men decide that all means are permitted to fight an evil, then their good becomes indistinguishable from the evil that they set out to destroy."-Christopher Dawson - The Judgement of Nations, 1942

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    If this place really is such a threat then why not just seal it off. Nobody allowed in and just women and kids out.

                    The present policy just backfires. Time and again ''leaders'' are killed in these situations and another just takes his place.
                    Fighting in an urban enviroment is obviously just going to push up the civilian casualty toll. The US gets the blame of course.
                    So who said War is fair?

                    Like most wars these days Propaganda is all important and the US loses big time over this sort of thing. All it means is that just more and more Iraqis want to see you go and your supporters over there as puppets.

                    This once again is a clear case of the Military dictating the politics of the situation, instead of the Politicians dictating to the military.

                    If it was my call I would keep the military out of a mess like that. All that is happening at the moment is that Faluja is costing America support within Iraq and on the wider World stage in what from a purely military angle is basically a tactical situation.

                    Is it worth it?
                    http://www.irelandinhistory.blogspot.ie/

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                    • #11
                      I very curious how the special forces or spies who watch those homes actually establish coordinates of the target. Map of the city and personal GPS? Those are JDAMs hitting those safehouses, aren't they?

                      "Artillery adds dignity to what would otherwise be a ugly brawl."
                      --Frederick II, King of Prussia

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Wolfe Tone
                        If this place really is such a threat then why not just seal it off. Nobody allowed in and just women and kids out.
                        Unfortunately the Americans are not Fourth Panzer army at Leningrad! There are not enough troops for this kind of WW2 tactics. The strangest thing is that in the original plan Rumsfeld wanted to conquer and pacify Iraq with something like two army divisions (30 thousand men). He and his protégés should be removed from office.
                        Last edited by MonsterZero; 26 Jun 04, 08:41.

                        "Artillery adds dignity to what would otherwise be a ugly brawl."
                        --Frederick II, King of Prussia

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Priest
                          Well first you invite a lot of Hollywood liberals, like Hanks, Penn, Depp, Babs and Serandon, to Falujah to help negociate with the militants....then nuke 'em !!!!!
                          Why not just nuke Hollywood or heck just all of California

                          Thanks for looking!!

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by MonsterZero
                            Unfortunately the Americans are not Fourth Panzer army at Leningrad! There are not enough troops for this kind of WW2 tactics. The strangest thing is that in the original plan Rumsfeld wanted to conquer and pacify Iraq with something like two army divisions (30 thousand men). He and his protégés should be removed from office.
                            I take your point, but bearing in mind that 4th Panzer Army is not on call right now then why send limited forces back into the place where they are bound to get bogged down.
                            The last thing the US needs right now is a Stalingrad or maybe a better example would be a Grozny or Beirut type situation.

                            There can only be so many exit points out of the city. Block them and use mobile patrols to cover the rest.

                            I thought the US forces and the locals had worked out some kind of deal on this one? What went wrong?
                            http://www.irelandinhistory.blogspot.ie/

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by mr_clark
                              I like the special forces and spy idea most. You have to get a couple of guys with LTD's in make some birds loaded with GBU's circle the city and strike fast on a target paonted by the personell on the ground, thus effectively blowing away the "rebel leaders" opening the way to nagotiations thus giving the uncontrolled mob the chance to surrender.
                              No it won't work. This isn't like fighting a conventional war. Insurgent groups don't need an organised command and control structure. The only major "leaders" of these groups are spiritual/moral ones, and I can assure you "blowing them away" will do nothing but spur on their followers.

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