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So what was the trigger event for radical islam?

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  • marktwain
    replied
    Originally posted by nastle View Post

    there is no radical islam, even the sufi sunni orders savagely fought the russians in the dagestan region in the 17th century
    islam has been attacking raiding and slaving christians for centuries esp the russians
    islam itself is no more savage than any of the abrahamic faiths
    its the people of middle east that are more savage than their neighbors and thats the root of the problem
    our socalled conservatives are so concerned with russian menace while the real menace are the muslim countries + india+ china + japan
    We and russians both have common enemies , those who truly are against islam should wholeheartedly support russians and push for limiting immigration in europe
    we should also fully support israel's expansion at the expense of its neighbors , more european jewish immigration there but we should not send our boys to die for the security of the jewish state in fact it should be the other way round
    |Good post.
    communists<
    Remember, however, that from 1948-88, SOVI|ET R|USS|IA was the supposed mastermind behind "all Worldwide Communists, and that we backed Sadamn Hussien, etc., because that BRAND OF WARLORD was seen asw seen as secular Muslims "tough on Commies..'

    Be Cautious....

    Leave a comment:


  • MonsterZero
    replied
    The Islamic conquests of the Middle East and Africa have killed over 270 million people who had rejected Islam and had to be killed. We tend to forget many traditionally Islamic countries are not traditional at all and had to be converted by slaughter. This supports the hypothesis that Islamic extremism is in the Quran. If anything, Islam of today is less violent and brutal than centuries ago. The founding father of modern Turkey, Mustafa Kemal, himself a Muslim, rejected orthodox Islam as barbaric and preventing normal development of the country. He imposed severe punishment, including prison sentences, for spreading Islamic orthodoxy in the country.

    Leave a comment:


  • nastle
    replied
    Originally posted by Stonewall_Jack View Post

    Erdogan may be controversial. What we know is the foundation of Turkey is based on equality among man. The USA has gone through controversial leaders such as Mr Clinton and Dick Nixon. But its the foundation of the USA that has been able to hold up.
    he is shaking its foundation to its core

    if we strict kemalist then I have no problem but this guy sees himself as a lattar day sultan

    Leave a comment:


  • Karri
    replied
    Originally posted by wolfhnd View Post

    That was certainly a factor in the anti war protest during the Vietnam war and is a necessary part of the calculus of any cultural upheaval. The central question remains regarding focus. While the internal and external conflicts of Islam were somewhat quiet for a period after WWII, if you ignore Israeli wars, there was a tipping point beginning with the Iranian revolution after which it returns to the traditional pattern of violent expansionism. What was the trigger or triggers and why does it look so different than the upheavals in the West when the baby boomers were coming of age?
    European population boom happened during 19th and 20th century. According to Wiki between Napoleonic wars and WW1 about 60 million people emigrated. For example between 1800 and 1900 Finnish population tripled from one million to three million. At the same time some 300 000 people emigrated to USA(mostly at the end of the period). After WW2 there was a period of urbanisation in Finland(changing from agricultural to an industrialised society), which saw massive migration to cities, as well as hundreds of thousands of people moving to Sweden. Similar population boom only happened in developing countries after WW2.

    It really isn't any different. Well, except that that powers that be in Europe had abandoned religion a long time ago, whereas in moslem majority countries they still hold sway. Europeans also had the luxury of migrating to three different continents(if you count Australia as one)...compared to our "violent expansion" the current migrant crisis is a drop in the ocean.

    One should take note that most of Islamic terror is directed against their own subjects to keep them in line; attacks against West are more of media publicity than anything else.
    Last edited by Karri; 27 Sep 18, 10:41.

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  • wolfhnd
    replied
    Originally posted by Artyom_A View Post
    Demographic boom in the Middle East. Just like the demographic boom in Europe kicked off WWI, Russian Revolution and WWII.
    That was certainly a factor in the anti war protest during the Vietnam war and is a necessary part of the calculus of any cultural upheaval. The central question remains regarding focus. While the internal and external conflicts of Islam were somewhat quiet for a period after WWII, if you ignore Israeli wars, there was a tipping point beginning with the Iranian revolution after which it returns to the traditional pattern of violent expansionism. What was the trigger or triggers and why does it look so different than the upheavals in the West when the baby boomers were coming of age?

    Leave a comment:


  • Stonewall_Jack
    replied
    Originally posted by nastle View Post

    one that is being abrogated by that arrogant tyrant erdogan?
    Erdogan may be controversial. What we know is the foundation of Turkey is based on equality among man. The USA has gone through controversial leaders such as Mr Clinton and Dick Nixon. But its the foundation of the USA that has been able to hold up.

    Leave a comment:


  • Artyom_A
    replied
    Originally posted by Arnold J Rimmer View Post
    What kicked off the current wave of bloodshed?
    Demographic boom in the Middle East. Just like the demographic boom in Europe kicked off WWI, Russian Revolution and WWII.

    Leave a comment:


  • nastle
    replied
    Originally posted by Stonewall_Jack View Post
    Only The Turkish Constitution stands out in the middle east as providing equality among man.

    Israel and Saudi need a legit Constitution.

    Facts always defeat the distortions created by supremacist Christians, Muslims and Jews of the world.
    one that is being abrogated by that arrogant tyrant erdogan?

    Leave a comment:


  • nastle
    replied
    Originally posted by Stonewall_Jack View Post

    Well friend can you convince 60+ year old white Americans that Russia and by default Iran and Israel(two of the Russians allied countries) are friends? Remember the Communist witch hunts and Vietnam War?

    Last time the Americans and Russians had a truly significant relationship was when real men were in power, during WW2....at least then those men spoke openly and we knew what their actions were.

    When FDR passed away, the USA and the world was set back for years, we are still recovering from the disaster of the so called Cold war. WW2 was suppose to be the last time civilized nations fought, it was not. For your vision to partially take place(minus the unnesscary religious strife) FDR would have had to live past April of 1945...and the USA of today would have to have allies with the same values we have...as for the middle east the only country today that has the values the USA has is Turkey...thats undeniable to based on the law systems of the countries.
    thats the problem we in US have grown up to hate the germans and russians

    its really sad and hollywood to this day churns out anti-nazi ( anti-german ) movies every year on a regular basis

    can we make a movie on arab slave trade ? or turkish atrocties in balkans ? for a change
    or about the evils of british empire ...no ofcourse not ,

    Leave a comment:


  • nastle
    replied
    Originally posted by Stonewall_Jack View Post
    Most people in the world admire Islam, along with Christianity and Hinduism due to its sheer number and obvious and clear cut attractiveness. Being against Islam is like being against the Roman Empire, its annoying and anti historical.

    Some Anti Muslims do not understand that if they are against Islam, they are default against Judaism. The few anti Muslims here on ACG like G David Bock and Hida are pro Israel, they ought change their views on being anti Muslim because Muhammad was a warrior as David was. Muhammad carried the very sword that David carried.
    i cannot think of any decent person who does not HATE roman empire and all its evils

    i do agree with latter part of your post though, Muhammad did style himself as an old testament prophet.But how can you defend the shocking barbarity of the old testement ?


    I'm pro-israel precisely because it is a secular jewish state founded by primarily EUROPEAN jews and serves as an outpost of european civilization in the middle east , if israel would follow the ways of the old testement prophets then they would look like a jewish version of isis
    I also support israel as they are the natural enemies of arabs ( not neccessarily muslims ), christian and secular arabs are just as bad as religious muslim arabs

    Leave a comment:


  • Stonewall_Jack
    replied
    Only The Turkish Constitution stands out in the middle east as providing equality among man.

    Israel and Saudi need a legit Constitution.

    Facts always defeat the distortions created by supremacist Christians, Muslims and Jews of the world.

    Leave a comment:


  • Stonewall_Jack
    replied
    Originally posted by nastle View Post

    there is no radical islam, even the sufi sunni orders savagely fought the russians in the dagestan region in the 17th century
    islam has been attacking raiding and slaving christians for centuries esp the russians
    islam itself is no more savage than any of the abrahamic faiths
    its the people of middle east that are more savage than their neighbors and thats the root of the problem
    our socalled conservatives are so concerned with russian menace while the real menace are the muslim countries + india+ china + japan
    We and russians both have common enemies , those who truly are against islam should wholeheartedly support russians and push for limiting immigration in europe
    we should also fully support israel's expansion at the expense of its neighbors , more european jewish immigration there but we should not send our boys to die for the security of the jewish state in fact it should be the other way round
    Well friend can you convince 60+ year old white Americans that Russia and by default Iran and Israel(two of the Russians allied countries) are friends? Remember the Communist witch hunts and Vietnam War?

    Last time the Americans and Russians had a truly significant relationship was when real men were in power, during WW2....at least then those men spoke openly and we knew what their actions were.

    When FDR passed away, the USA and the world was set back for years, we are still recovering from the disaster of the so called Cold war. WW2 was suppose to be the last time civilized nations fought, it was not. For your vision to partially take place(minus the unnesscary religious strife) FDR would have had to live past April of 1945...and the USA of today would have to have allies with the same values we have...as for the middle east the only country today that has the values the USA has is Turkey...thats undeniable to based on the law systems of the countries.
    Last edited by Stonewall_Jack; 25 Sep 18, 20:00.

    Leave a comment:


  • Stonewall_Jack
    replied
    Most people in the world admire Islam, along with Christianity and Hinduism due to its sheer number and obvious and clear cut attractiveness. Being against Islam is like being against the Roman Empire, its annoying and anti historical.

    Some Anti Muslims do not understand that if they are against Islam, they are default against Judaism. The few anti Muslims here on ACG like G David Bock and Hida are pro Israel, they ought change their views on being anti Muslim because Muhammad was a warrior as David was. Muhammad carried the very sword that David carried.
    Last edited by Stonewall_Jack; 25 Sep 18, 20:07.

    Leave a comment:


  • Karri
    replied
    Originally posted by nastle View Post

    its not all poverty related
    inluence of ideology of expansion in islam by force cannot be underestimated
    in short its a plethora of reasons
    Of course not, but for the guys blowing themselves up or doing the dirty work it usually is. You don't go to work every day because you are studying capitalism either.

    Leave a comment:


  • nastle
    replied
    Originally posted by Karri View Post

    Yep. In the end, it's a lot of people with no money or future, a society in turmoil, and power structures that are trying everything not to become irrelevant. We have quite a few people here who got their education thanks to US military. It's no secret that even in America fighting in wars is a way out of poverty and misery...just that in places like Afghanistan or Syria the difference are much bigger.



    And obviously, that is why they are doing everything in their power not to be destroyed.
    its not all poverty related
    inluence of ideology of expansion in islam by force cannot be underestimated
    in short its a plethora of reasons

    Leave a comment:

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