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TRUMP WINS AGAIN: Germany's Central Bank Stops $400 Million Cash Delivery To Iran

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Gooner View Post
    There was an EU requirement to become less dependent on Russian energy supplies.

    Germany just went right ahead and made itself more dependent on Russian energy supplies.
    It's less a case of dependency that it is a case of marginal profit.

    Russian gas can easily be replaced by, say US gas, it just costs more atm.

    ...Add to this that significant quantities of natural gas, presently being used for electricity generation, could be freed up for more essential uses (domestic heating and industry) and the conclusion is that Russia, with no alternative outlets for the gas presently being piped into the EU, would be the big loser in a disruption scenario.
    https://www.ft.com/content/a5540290-...9-de94fa33a81e

    It's a buyers market, let the producers compete and sort it out, and simply buy the cheapest available, gas is not exactly short in supply.

    As for oil, that's just a joke.

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/rrapier.../#4042ecb153c0

    This led me to wonder, by comparison, what percentage of U.S. oil imports are being provided by Russia. U.S. reliance of oil imports has fallen as shale oil production has ramped up. Russian oil imports peaked at 624,000 barrels per day in 2011. However, in 2017 the U.S. still imported 384,000 barrels per day of crude oil and products from Russia:
    Overall, OPEC provided 33.3% of U.S. crude oil and finished products in 2017. We are certainly making OPEC richer with our crude purchases to the tune of about $60 billion last year. I can't say whether this poses a problem for NATO.
    Last edited by Snowygerry; 14 Aug 18, 06:35.
    High Admiral Snowy, Commander In Chief of the Naval Forces of The Phoenix Confederation.
    Major Atticus Finch - ACW Rainbow Co.

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    • #17
      Germany IS the EU.
      There are no Nazis in Ukraine. © Idiots

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      • #18
        Yeah sure...and Putin IS Russia, so the gas will keep flowing as it does
        High Admiral Snowy, Commander In Chief of the Naval Forces of The Phoenix Confederation.
        Major Atticus Finch - ACW Rainbow Co.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Emtos View Post
          Germany IS the EU.
          Nein, Die Fuhrerina ist Das Reich.
          Flag: USA / Location: West Coast

          Prayers.

          BoRG

          http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/8757/snap1ws8.jpg

          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PtsX_Z3CMU

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Gooner View Post

            There was an EU requirement to become less dependent on Russian energy supplies.

            Germany just went right ahead and made itself more dependent on Russian energy supplies.
            No, that's been adressed. The problem was always the former eastern bloc countries, who continued to be hooked on the Soviet infrastructure, and somehow for the longest time didn't bother to build some fall-back infrastructure to diversify supply. (In fairness that varies; the Baltics have been doggedly determined, and by now successful, in making sure they have working alternatives in the form of LNG terminals, new underwater power cable connections to the Nordic countries, which Russia has already scouted (possibly mined; they had their Baltic Navy run interference with the ships laying the cable while it was being done) .

            Germany however always had alternatives, just not cheaper or more easily available ones, and they still don't, not least since the Russians have consistently been all sweetness towards Germany in this matter.

            That sweetness is apparently based in the misplaced Russian idea that, as Emtos just put it, "Germany IS the EU". Well, it's not. It certainly is an important part of it, the most important even, but the Russian hope is rather that if they can just pull Germany to the side and "come to an agreement", that alone would be sufficient to get to tell every other bit of Europe what to do. And that is just simplistic, wishful thinking.

            It's an idea similar to the one floated early in the Brexit mess, that the EU would do what it was told by Germany, the German government would tell everyone what to do, and the German car industry would tell the German government what to do on behalf of the UK. I.e. simplistic, wishful thinking.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

              So you feel that financing terrorism is acceptable for Germany?
              Come to think of it, the better mirror response to that (still daft) comment is rather:

              So you want a major war in the Mid East, and soon?

              The interests and activities of Iran in the Mid East are well known, and they are a problem. That money was supposed to be released (since it is Iranian govt property) for transfer to Iran on the basis of the nuclear deal. Which the US really for no reason, unilaterally and for no discernible profit beyond making a major war in the Middle East a LOT more likely, unilaterally reneged on. What has happened now is that the US has shown intent to use pretty much the last tool in its toolbox to strong-arm even allies to push through the atrocious notion of scrapping the deal over the Iranian nukes even in small details (relatively speaking considering it's 400 million USD).

              That deal worked. It didn't adress ALL the trouble Iran can and does make, but with this the US is running out of leverage even with its allies. It USED to get by simply on the basis of common understanding and agreement with its allies to pursue certain courses of action. Now the US has been reduced to use what actual direct leverage to force its allies it has.

              The US used to get things done by other wanting to be right along with the US, but is now reduced to having to try to force others to be wrong alongside it. The US has got lost in the woods, geopolitically speaking. It's fundamentally unclear what it thinks it can even get out of the situation it has created with Iran.

              The Germans in the end didn't force the situation. They created a face-saver for both parties. We still have to work out if the US' threats are empty or if they would actually put the national banks, and national economies, of its European allies in lock-down, and over trivial things. But this won't be know until someone calls the US' threat.

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              • #22
                Just because every one thinks you are wrong doesn’t mean you are wrong.
                Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it whether it exists or not, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedy. -- Ernest Benn

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                • #23
                  The Iranians are probably crying bitter tears because the reign of Grand Vizier Hussein Obama was their last chance to get closer to USA and they failed to take advantage of the opportunity. Oh well, if somebody is going to lose his house, job and savings, I prefer it's them and not me.

                  "Artillery adds dignity to what would otherwise be a ugly brawl."
                  --Frederick II, King of Prussia

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by MonsterZero View Post
                    The Iranians are probably crying bitter tears because the reign of Grand Vizier Hussein Obama was their last chance to get closer to USA and they failed to take advantage of the opportunity. Oh well, if somebody is going to lose his house, job and savings, I prefer it's them and not me.
                    The Iranians offered to axe their nukes program in return for guarantees of security from the US already when GWB was President back in the early 00's. The US response then was to declare Iran part of The Axis of Evil, and go to war in Iraq next door on a bogus pretext.

                    It is not too hard to see how Iran might build a decent case of it being the US that's the nuttier party in this stand-off.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Johan Banér View Post

                      The Iranians offered to axe their nukes program in return for guarantees of security from the US already when GWB was President back in the early 00's. The US response then was to declare Iran part of The Axis of Evil, and go to war in Iraq next door on a bogus pretext.

                      It is not too hard to see how Iran might build a decent case of it being the US that's the nuttier party in this stand-off.
                      It's customary for nuke wannabees to bargain like that, and always renege on their end of the agreement. NK has done it too many times to count and so has Iraq. After all, if they actually cancel their nuclear program, they lose their power and influence and have nothing left to bargain with, and no Western nation wants to take responsibility for "guaranteeing security" in the Middle East. Only a fool goes down that road.
                      Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes? Who is watching the watchers?

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                      • #26
                        [QUOTE=Johan Banér;n5055479]

                        Come to think of it, the better mirror response to that (still daft) comment is rather:

                        So you want a major war in the Mid East, and soon?

                        We're already involved in two major wars in the Middle East. You never noticed?

                        I remember when the terrorists were big in Germany and Germany wanted all of the help it could get, especially from America. Problem is, European nations have very short memories except when they need something.
                        Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes? Who is watching the watchers?

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Johan Banér View Post

                          The Iranians offered to axe their nukes program in return for guarantees of security from the US already when GWB was President back in the early 00's. The US response then was to declare Iran part of The Axis of Evil, and go to war in Iraq next door on a bogus pretext.

                          It is not too hard to see how Iran might build a decent case of it being the US that's the nuttier party in this stand-off.
                          They are a major state sponsor of terrorism. That's where Bush's Axis of Evil moniker came from.

                          It's completely insane to believe they would not pursue nukes, agreement or not. They don't want nukes for defense. They want them so they can flex muscle and command greater influence. They are, after all, Persians.

                          ALL LIVES SPLATTER!

                          BLACK JEEPS MATTER!

                          BLACK MOTORCYCLES MATTER!

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                          • #28
                            The international agreement over Iran's nuclear program was working. Much like the deal preventing Iraq's WMDs was working. The US just tore things up regardless. IF the latest one deos leads to the US in a shooting war with Iran, post-WWII "Atlanticism" and "the west" as a geopolitical partnership will be over.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Johan Banér View Post
                              The international agreement over Iran's nuclear program was working. Much like the deal preventing Iraq's WMDs was working. The US just tore things up regardless. IF the latest one deos leads to the US in a shooting war with Iran, post-WWII "Atlanticism" and "the west" as a geopolitical partnership will be over.
                              It wasn't working. The ballistic missile tests are proof of that.
                              ALL LIVES SPLATTER!

                              BLACK JEEPS MATTER!

                              BLACK MOTORCYCLES MATTER!

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Gixxer86g View Post

                                It wasn't working. The ballistic missile tests are proof of that.
                                No it was working. The rest is US deflection and post-fact rationalization of its decision to scupper it.

                                Really, this is what US diplomacy under Trump is shaping up to be: "Pacta non sunt servanda" and instead of diplomacy Trump will try to hit everyone is their wallet, through tariffs or in this case (threatening of) withholding crucial banking and financial services.

                                Since he makes no actual difference between the US' strategic allies and its adversaries, it's not likely to strengthen the US. Considering where he is aiming, the rational response is to start shifting out of the USD as the reserve-currency-of-choice, and implement alternatives to US led and backed financial systems. Which would further enfeeble the US. It's in a strong position through this for now, at the end of decades long processes of investment in these systems. They're pretty robust still, but Trump does look like he will actually test how far he can push things before there is a vote-by-feet and the beginning of a process of unravelling.

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