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Bin-Laden, the old ally

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  • Bin-Laden, the old ally

    I find it very interesting that Bin-Laden was once an ally of the USA. During the Afghans war with the Soviets, America gave arms and supplies to the Afghans, which helped them fight off the Russians.They personally knew Bin-Laden and liked him for the time being. This has happened countless times before to America, where we have supported a country, and a few years later, they turn against us.
    Navy Seals- The only easy day was yesterday

  • #2
    Yeah, the exact same thing happened with Saddam. We funded him during the Iran-Iraq War because back then we thought Iran was more dangerous. I guess im not oppossed to things like this, sometimes we have to team up ugly people to fight for a common cause, much like the situation with the USSR in WW2. I just wish there was a little more forethought, into what kind of ramifications there are to arming loonies like Saddam, and bin laden.

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    • #3
      Yeah but sometimes we dont realize how crazy these people really are and that they will turn against us. And in Bin-Ladens case kill over 3000 innocent civilians that did nothing except be American.
      Navy Seals- The only easy day was yesterday

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      • #4
        Excellent point in your thread which is rarely discussed in the news. The US has gotten itself in much trouble worldwide with an out of date foreign policy based on a imaginary international community conspiracy centered in Moscow. US saw a chance to inflict a Vietnam defeat upon the Soviets in Afganishstan so they and their Saudi ally poured billons into the civil war. The jihadist were initially a minor factor in Islamic world but after the CIA propagandist and Saudi intelligent service enflamed the entire moslem world to declar a jihad upon the soviet puppet secular govt. the jihadist inculding Osama Bin Labin were now made to have enormous influence. An thus is born the international jihadist fanatical movement. In the strict machiavellian theory, the soviet state was in hindsight would have proven a plus today in the suppression of jihadist movement and an example to the molsem world and should not have been overthrown. Therefore no Osama network being born there if soviet state survived. What is really is disturbing is that we have once again overturned a secular anti-jihadist govt that of Saddam of Iraq. He killed more jihadist that anyone in recent history. It remains to be seen if these developments discussed will prove someday to be the dumdest foreign policy ever as seen in future hindsight especially if more massive murders of americans continues by those said jihadist.

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        • #5
          Re: Bin-Laden, the old ally

          Originally posted by NavySeals112
          I find it very interesting that Bin-Laden was once an ally of the USA. During the Afghans war with the Soviets, America gave arms and supplies to the Afghans, which helped them fight off the Russians.They personally knew Bin-Laden and liked him for the time being. This has happened countless times before to America, where we have supported a country, and a few years later, they turn against us.

          I'd research your claims a bit more
          Molon Labe

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Bo Archer
            In the strict machiavellian theory, the soviet state was in hindsight would have proven a plus today in the suppression of jihadist movement and an example to the molsem world and should not have been overthrown. Therefore no Osama network being born there if soviet state survived.
            It's pretty interesting that you donít take that theory one step further... you omit the fact that the whole mess couldíve been avoided had the Soviets not decided to roll into Afghanistan in the first place.
            Rumors of my demise have been greatly exaggerated... again...

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            • #7
              Re: Bin-Laden, the old ally

              Originally posted by NavySeals112
              I find it very interesting that Bin-Laden was once an ally of the USA. During the Afghans war with the Soviets, America gave arms and supplies to the Afghans, which helped them fight off the Russians.They personally knew Bin-Laden and liked him for the time being. This has happened countless times before to America, where we have supported a country, and a few years later, they turn against us.
              You need to look at this a bit more.

              Cousin Usama was running his own operation seperate from aid the US was giving to the Muj. He didn't want help from US sources.

              There was little contact between Cousin Usama and US representatives.

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              • #8
                Start by reading "Charlie Wilson' War"

                5-10 pages double spaced due in two weeks
                Molon Labe

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                • #9
                  It is correct to say Usama was an ally in the Afghan war against the soviet puppet govt as we were all on the rebels side figthing a common enemy. However, it is also correct that he refused to accept money and advice for US agents because it is his nature as an islamic jihadist plus he has millions of his own money. One is wrong to say the soviet invasion of Afganistan created the whole mess/usama. Usama adventure in Afghanistan was only a side show and a place of growth but very fertile ground. It could have been instead the fertile groung of jihadist Iran or Sudan or Somalia etc. Usama original and likely still primary quest was the overthrow of his native country of Arabia and it's Saudi family. It was not the defeat of the Soviets but that was a plus. He made us his enemy when we station military bases upon his holy nation for our war against Saddam plus it was just as enflaming to him that he see us as the strong pillar of support for the hated Saudi family royalist. He has been attacking us to force us to withdraw from his country and shere of influence.

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                  • #10
                    Re: Bin-Laden, the old ally

                    Originally posted by NavySeals112
                    I find it very interesting that Bin-Laden was once an ally of the USA. During the Afghans war with the Soviets, America gave arms and supplies to the Afghans, which helped them fight off the Russians.They personally knew Bin-Laden and liked him for the time being. This has happened countless times before to America, where we have supported a country, and a few years later, they turn against us.
                    It wasn't so much that they liked him, but rather that he (like Saddam Hussein), was percieved to be the lesser of the evils at the time. It was judged to be in our best interests to aid those who were the enemies of the USSR, in the case of the Mujahedin; or the Iranians, in the case of Hussein.

                    One can see the same dynamic today, in places like Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Bahrain, Oman, the UAE, etc. We have no great desire to be friendly with any of these, or others around the world, but they serve our purposes at this time. Once could even say the same, but to a lesser extent, about Israel. War IS NOT "diplomacy by other means", but it does tend to follow on from diplomacy and or policy. War is the admission that diplomacy and policy have failed.
                    Mens Est Clavis Victoriae
                    (The Mind Is The Key To Victory)

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                    • #11
                      Yeah, we have a habit of supporting 'our S-O-B' when it suits us, even if he stands for stuff we would never accept in an 'enemy'.
                      If voting could really change things, it would be illegal.

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