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Election 2020 the devil we know versus the devil who doesn't know himself

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  • Election 2020 the devil we know versus the devil who doesn't know himself

    In the 2016 U.S. presidential election it was a choice between the lesser of two evils, choose your poison former Secretary Hilary Clinton or Donald J. Trump.

    2020 it is shaping up as a choice between the devil who we know President Trump or former Vice President Biden the devil who doesn't know himself.

    President Trump has multiple personal failings. And each and every one of them is trumpeted on ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN, MSNBC and most every newspaper in the U.S. His administration has been chaotic. Policy wise he has been fairly consistent. He is pro growth, pro law enforcement, anti regulation, pro lots of red hats.

    Former Vice President Biden is interesting. He has been in politics for 50 years. Most of it on the national level. He has mostly been a moderate democrat. If he can convince enough middle of the road Americans that he is not a crazy hard left loony I think he has it in the bag. He has been flirting with the far left of his party:

    Recently Senator Sanders said they have formed "working groups on policy issues" with Mr. Biden.
    https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/bern...ry?id=70123451

    He has appointed Representative Cortez to Co-chair of his climate change panel. Representative Cortez is probably the most recognizable face of the Democratic party's far left.
    https://www.cnn.com/2020/05/12/polit...nge/index.html

    Former Vice President Biden must thread the needle when dealing with the Black Lives Matter (BLM) movement. Who controls BLM is not clear. Most Americans agree that Black Lives, All Lives matter. We can agree that there should be zero tolerance of abuses by the police of citizens. But again the devil is in the details. BLM as an organization has some pretty left wing demands that go well beyond this.

    I won't get into the former vice president's cognitive abilities or lack there of. But he never to me has seemed to have had any strong beliefs except pro union positions.

    The Trump re-election campaign has already started ads trying to link Biden with the far left. If they succeed President Trump will be re-elected. If Biden can distance him self from the far left in the minds of middle America while still getting the majority of the far left to vote for him he will win.

    Maybe Kanye Cardassian West will save us all! It has a ring to it, President Kanye Cardassian West.
    "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" Beatrice Evelyn Hall
    Updated for the 21st century... except if you are criticizing islam, that scares the $hii+e out of me!

  • #2
    I guess one of my questions would be: Why do some voters consider "anti-regulation" to be a good thing?

    And is there such a thing as a politician who isn't "pro-growth"? That's kind of the price of admission to the presidential race.

    Comment


    • #3
      Well Biden he said he will not support defunding the police..he knows he needs the police unions.

      It Will be interesting to see who Biden chooses as his Vice President..Warren or maybe Bottoms?
      Long live the Lionheart! Please watch this video
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=jRDwlR4zbEM
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3DBaY0RsxU
      Accept the challenges so that you can feel the exhilaration of victory.

      George S Patton

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      • #4
        Originally posted by DingBat View Post
        I guess one of my questions would be: Why do some voters consider "anti-regulation" to be a good thing?
        Some one who is anti-regulation would say they are against bad regulations.

        One source says there are 70,000 pages of federal regulations. So it wouldn't be hard to find something you oppose.
        "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" Beatrice Evelyn Hall
        Updated for the 21st century... except if you are criticizing islam, that scares the $hii+e out of me!

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Stonewall_Jack View Post
          ....

          It Will be interesting to see who Biden chooses as his Vice President..Warren or maybe Bottoms?
          Pundits say in most cases the Vice Presidential running mate doesn't make that much of a difference. In the Case of former Vice President Biden I think it will be a big deal. It will signal if he is tilting hard left if he picks some one such as Senator Warren.
          "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" Beatrice Evelyn Hall
          Updated for the 21st century... except if you are criticizing islam, that scares the $hii+e out of me!

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by 17thfabn View Post

            Some one who is anti-regulation would say they are against bad regulations.

            One source says there are 70,000 pages of federal regulations. So it wouldn't be hard to find something you oppose.
            I would submit that most Americans are woefully ill-informed when it comes to regulations. That's not really their fault as the industries under regulation have worked hard to keep it that way, and to drive the narrative that they are over-regulated.

            For example, when the EPA was created, the OSHA was given permission to "adopt" the existing industry-set regulations and product exposure limits that existed at that time. And being chronically underfunded, the OSHA hasn't had much success in setting stricter limits.

            So, how many products would you speculate there are in the world that would likely require some form of regulation for an exposure limit? 10,000? More? How many pages is that per product?

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            • #7
              Originally posted by DingBat View Post
              I guess one of my questions would be: Why do some voters consider "anti-regulation" to be a good thing?

              And is there such a thing as a politician who isn't "pro-growth"? That's kind of the price of admission to the presidential race.
              The government over-regulates a lot of things, especially small businesses, farmers, ranchers and others. Meanwhile, the official agencies like the EPA do a rotten job.

              And California demonstrates the complete lunacy of over-regulating in favor of the environment to the point where power plants that are badly needed are forbidden because some obscure creature like a snail darter might be affected.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by DingBat View Post

                So, how many products would you speculate there are in the world that would likely require some form of regulation for an exposure limit? 10,000? More? How many pages is that per product?
                I don't know off hand. 10,000 seems rather high. The emergency guide book doesn't have near that many.
                "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it" Beatrice Evelyn Hall
                Updated for the 21st century... except if you are criticizing islam, that scares the $hii+e out of me!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by DingBat View Post
                  I guess one of my questions would be: Why do some voters consider "anti-regulation" to be a good thing?

                  And is there such a thing as a politician who isn't "pro-growth"? That's kind of the price of admission to the presidential race.
                  Because some regulation go to absurd extremes. There are many now where industries are expected to reach levels of compliance below normal, natural background levels.

                  Place where I last worked, we'd get dinged for bird fecal matter in the water runoff in to the storm drains. We were within a mile of the bay, had lots of seagulls hanging about our property. Can't shoot them and they are difficult to impossible to discourage or drive-off. Yet their poop, and that of other birds about, was something we were cited for as "pollution" being our fault.

                  As for "pro-growth" depends how one defines "growth".
                  TANSTAAFL = There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch
                  “War is merely the continuation of politics by other means” - von Clausewitz
                  Present Current Events are the Future's History

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by G David Bock View Post

                    Because some regulation go to absurd extremes. There are many now where industries are expected to reach levels of compliance below normal, natural background levels.

                    Place where I last worked, we'd get dinged for bird fecal matter in the water runoff in to the storm drains. We were within a mile of the bay, had lots of seagulls hanging about our property. Can't shoot them and they are difficult to impossible to discourage or drive-off. Yet their poop, and that of other birds about, was something we were cited for as "pollution" being our fault.

                    As for "pro-growth" depends how one defines "growth".
                    Did you expect that there wouldn't be some cases like that?

                    The question is: Is that the norm? What does "some" mean? A small minority? Most?

                    But let's assume there's overreach on some regulations, where some equals 50%. I don't for even one millisecond think it's anywhere close to 50%, but let's play anyway. As a citizen, why do you care? Wouldn't erring on the side of caution be a good thing?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by 17thfabn View Post

                      I don't know off hand. 10,000 seems rather high. The emergency guide book doesn't have near that many.
                      I suspect that Dupont alone produces close to 10,000 different chemicals. The vast majority of those chemicals will likely have had little or no independent testing and their product exposure limits will have been set by Dupont itself.

                      Part of that is that many of the chemical companies are in the habit of making slight variations of their chemicals in order to "restart" the testing and regulation process.

                      And that's just Dupont. And just the chemical industry. Can you imaging the pharmaceutical industry? The petroleum industry? The mining industry? And then we can start talking about waste products.
                      Last edited by DingBat; 14 Jul 20, 22:39.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by DingBat View Post

                        Did you expect that there wouldn't be some cases like that?

                        The question is: Is that the norm? What does "some" mean? A small minority? Most?

                        But let's assume there's overreach on some regulations, where some equals 50%. I don't for even one millisecond think it's anywhere close to 50%, but let's play anyway. As a citizen, why do you care? Wouldn't erring on the side of caution be a good thing?
                        I would expect some reasonable and realistic application, not extremes(over-reach) generated to perpetuate an agency and it's jobs.

                        Not sure where you get that "some", but my experience in real world of wealth production is "Most".

                        Erring on side of caution means cutting off ones testicles to avoid testicular cancer or cutting off ones' breasts to avoid breast cancer. You personally willing to do such; which you expect/demand from others ???
                        TANSTAAFL = There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch
                        “War is merely the continuation of politics by other means” - von Clausewitz
                        Present Current Events are the Future's History

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by G David Bock View Post

                          I would expect some reasonable and realistic application, not extremes(over-reach) generated to perpetuate an agency and it's jobs.

                          Not sure where you get that "some", but my experience in real world of wealth production is "Most".

                          Erring on side of caution means cutting off ones testicles to avoid testicular cancer or cutting off ones' breasts to avoid breast cancer. You personally willing to do such; which you expect/demand from others ???
                          Your analogy is interesting, but not particularly accurate or relevant. What's the "testicle" in your mind? Growth?

                          But you don't seem to be saying "no regulations at all". So, "anti-regulation" really means "reasonable and realistic application"?

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by DingBat View Post

                            Your analogy is interesting, but not particularly accurate or relevant. What's the "testicle" in your mind? Growth?

                            But you don't seem to be saying "no regulations at all". So, "anti-regulation" really means "reasonable and realistic application"?
                            Could be, in which case ill conceived and excessive and un-necessary regulation which castrates businesses and economic growth would make the example relevant.

                            Don't recall saying "anti-regulation" at any time. But do think there are excessive and un-needed regulations. So anti stupid regulations
                            TANSTAAFL = There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch
                            “War is merely the continuation of politics by other means” - von Clausewitz
                            Present Current Events are the Future's History

                            Comment

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