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Some Facts About Face Masks

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  • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

    Y[B]ou are being assaulted by literally millions of viral particles, however. The law of averages says that a lot of them will get through. That is why proper masks are rated in micron filtration size. And as we know from fertilization studies of spermatazoa, it only takes one.



    OTH, if you are wearing one of those makeshift rag things over your face, you are actually trapping virus particles right in front of your face, where you can breathe them over and over. Even worse, once your mask has been contaminated, it becomes more of a hazard to you than help, yet everyone wears the same one over and over and over.

    And then you wear it into a big box store with all of the air everyone else is breathing in and out circulated and recirculated throughout the entire store for you to inhale again and again and again.

    Doesn't make any sense at all to do it, does it?
    Fertilization is not an infection. So, the comparison is very inappropriate.

    For infections, experts talk about "virus load" in body fluids and "infectious dose" which depends on the virus and influences the chance of being infected.

    https://www.newscientist.com/article...ovid-19-worse/

    The average number of viral particles needed to establish an infection is known as the infectious dose. We don’t know what this is for covid-19 yet, but given how rapidly the disease is spreading, it is likely to be relatively low – in the region of a few hundred or thousand particles, says Willem van Schaik at the University of Birmingham, UK



    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7090536/

    Determining the minimum dose of virus particles that can initiate infection, termed the minimum infective dose (MID), and the factors influencing this dose are important for the development of risk assessment models in the fields of food and water treatment and the implementation of appropriate infection control strategies to prevent viral transmission in healthcare settings.

    So the Minimum infective dose (which does not equate to just one particle) is part of the story. The article mentions that virus concentration is linked to the probability of being infected. So, the logic behind such medical terminologies and concerns is similar to the one in the military when one tries to calculate the effect of an explosion near a soldier. You can talk about the distance where casualty may happen, and you can talk about a distance where the probability of casualty is 50%. When you try to cover yourself from enemy fire, you still try to minimize the chances of becoming a casualty even when it is obvious that you cannot eliminate the risk.

    A similar attitude makes sense when one tries to reduce the risk of an infection.

    Since the HID50 represents the viral concentration required to infect 50% of the population, it follows that this value is always greater than the minimum dose required to cause infection

    And again, the use of mask is more about restricting what comes out of someone's mouth or nose as body fluids bloom expand unrestricted in the environment than restricting what comes in somebody's mouth or nose from the environment.
    Last edited by pamak; 17 May 20, 19:17.
    My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

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    • Face Mask Fact:

      Chinese version of the N95 mask are designated KN95.


      “Someone who doesn’t know is less stupid than someone who wrongly think he knows."

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      • Originally posted by Tuebor View Post

        The virus is many many times smaller than the weave in masks. Even the N95 masks have difficulty containing the virus. As one meme that is going around states "Wearing a mask to keep out (in) the Covid virus is like putting up a chain link fence to keep out mosquitoes." In reality I think the holes in the weave are much larger, relatively speaking, then the links in the fence.

        We have had advisories here in the U.S. that the virus is actually communicable up to 30 feet (what you call 10 meters).

        Masks are a placebo for the masses, and are about as useful as tucking posies in one's pockets in order to avoid the plague.

        When are you guys getting the point that the masks are only there to contain droplets containing the virus?

        No one is claiming they are there to contain the particulate virus itself.

        Look, it's very simple:

        (a)
        sneeze in the open, nothing in front of your mouth.

        (b)
        sneeze with a face mask in place.

        Which, do you think, is better to protect the people close to you from being hit by your sneezed droplets. (a) or (b) ?

        What would you like better: being hit by 100% expelled during uncovered sneezing, or by the (say) 20% expelled outside a face mask (and that 20% having a much lower speed) ?

        And let me repaet again: no one is claiming that face masks can stop the particulate virus.



        "For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards, for there you have been and there you will long to return"

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        • No masks does not mean a higher risk of becoming infected :I know of care homes without masks who had a lot of infections and of care homes without masks who had no infections and of care homes with masks who had a lot of infections .

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          • Originally posted by Rutger View Post

            When are you guys getting the point that the masks are only there to contain droplets containing the virus?

            No one is claiming they are there to contain the particulate virus itself.

            Look, it's very simple:

            (a)
            sneeze in the open, nothing in front of your mouth.

            (b)
            sneeze with a face mask in place.

            Which, do you think, is better to protect the people close to you from being hit by your sneezed droplets. (a) or (b) ?

            What would you like better: being hit by 100% expelled during uncovered sneezing, or by the (say) 20% expelled outside a face mask (and that 20% having a much lower speed) ?

            And let me repaet again: no one is claiming that face masks can stop the particulate virus.


            Once the droplet dries, the particles can then be inhaled. It's the most basic principle of viral filter masks.

            Doesn't matter anymore, though - our restrictions have been fully lifted.
            Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes? Who is watching the watchers?

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            • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

              Once the droplet dries, the particles can then be inhaled. It's the most basic principle of viral filter masks.

              Doesn't matter anymore, though - our restrictions have been fully lifted.
              https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/17/w...nfectious.html


              A 2005 study of the virus that causes SARS, another form of coronavirus, provides further reassurance. In that study, researchers tested increasingly large amounts of viral samples on paper and on a cotton gown. Depending on the concentration of the virus, it took five minutes, three hours or 24 hours for it to become inactive. “Even with a relatively high virus load in the droplet, rapid loss of infectivity was observed for paper and cotton material,” the researchers concluded.



              Also, again, the issue is the other person. A sneeze near another person without protection means a high viral load for the target. Floating virus particles (assuming they stay infectious and they are not inhaled back by the person who wears the mask) which are gradually released over time create a much smaller risk of infection for others
              My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

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              • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

                Once the droplet dries, the particles can then be inhaled. It's the most basic principle of viral filter masks.

                .
                Still assuming that the wearer is at the receiving end?

                How often do you need to be told that the protection is in catching droplets inside the facemask as worn by the sneezer?

                Oh, don't give me that stuff about your 30 years experience.
                My wife works in a large hospital, +30 years laboratory work and patient contact experience, past few months in direct contact with corona patients several days per week.
                Last edited by Rutger; 21 May 20, 17:28.
                "For once you have tasted flight you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards, for there you have been and there you will long to return"

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                • Here's a fact for you: My wife and I are both in the at-risk group for different reasons, yet we sailed through without a hitch...and without ever once wearing a mask.

                  2% mortality rate, or less...period. That is all that needs ever be said.
                  Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes? Who is watching the watchers?

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                  • Can the governors and mayors mandate we wear a mask whenever we go outside?


                    “Someone who doesn’t know is less stupid than someone who wrongly think he knows."

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                    • Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post
                      Here's a fact for you: My wife and I are both in the at-risk group for different reasons, yet we sailed through without a hitch...and without ever once wearing a mask.

                      2% mortality rate, or less...period. That is all that needs ever be said.
                      your in a rural community aren't. We have seen the same thing in eastern Washington. low number of cases no deaths yadda yadda. On the otherhand we did stop a lot of the tourist travelers from seattle from coming over which may of changed that dynamic.

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                      • Originally posted by Nikki View Post
                        Can the governors and mayors mandate we wear a mask whenever we go outside?

                        It depends 1st amendment has responsibility attached to them.

                        The guiding ruling would be you cant shout fire in a crowded theatre case. I could see it going either way.

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                        • Originally posted by craven View Post

                          It depends 1st amendment has responsibility attached to them.

                          The guiding ruling would be you cant shout fire in a crowded theatre case. I could see it going either way.
                          Some people are starting to claim disability reasons and refusing to wear one.

                          “Someone who doesn’t know is less stupid than someone who wrongly think he knows."

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                          • Originally posted by Nikki View Post

                            Some people are starting to claim disability reasons and refusing to wear one.
                            Doesn't it come down for respect for others? The mask offer little protection for me but for others and I have been tested more than once and still wear a mask. What's the bmfd about wearing one? huh some look better with a mask than without one
                            "Ask not what your country can do for you"

                            Left wing, Right Wing same bird that they are killing.

                            you’re entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts.

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                            • Originally posted by Half Pint John View Post

                              Doesn't it come down for respect for others? The mask offer little protection for me but for others and I have been tested more than once and still wear a mask. What's the bmfd about wearing one? huh some look better with a mask than without one
                              Do you think my wife looks better with a mask on?

                              Flag: USA / Location: West Coast

                              Prayers.

                              BoRG

                              http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/8757/snap1ws8.jpg

                              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PtsX_Z3CMU

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                              • The big picture just isn't what we do.
                                We hunt the hunters

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