Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Pelosi demands briefing on air strike

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by Urban hermit View Post

    Of course not, They don't have the balls to do the killing themselves
    He said either directly or by proxy...so he included the claim that Iranians have not done the killing by employing others.




    My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

    Comment


    • People forget that more people died in the Iran Iraq war than 20 years of U.S. fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan. Unless you think American lives are inherently more valuable than those of other nations body count arguments are moot.

      Saddam was going to keep killing his own people and his neighbors until he was killed. The same applies to the Iranians regardless of what the U.S. does. They will continue killing their own people by the thousands as long as a theocracy that thinks it is moral to kill Gays, adulteresses, religious dissidents, political opponents, and numerous other people that offend their religious sensibilities exist or the theocracy ends. They will also continue by proxy to kill people around the world by financing terrorism. The only rational arguments for the U.S. to pull out are not based on humanitarian concerns but rather on self interest of the U.S. and the sovereignty of Iraq.

      There are many people as confused as Obama, who's personal experience of being abandoned by his father, would come to believe in the fantasy of multiculturalism and decolonization. They feel a need to blame someone for the human condition because they cannot deal with reality.

      Europeans did not bring war to the Middle East it has always been there. Only the bigotry of low expectations could explain how people are so oblivious to the history of Islam and it's wars of expansion that they would blame the current situation on racism. The African Slave trade started with Islam centuries before the Europeans got involved. The Islamic countries did not need to be corrupted by Europeans to formulate their own evils.

      The question is why should the U.S. not spend blood and treasure to end the horrors of the Iranian theocracy in the same way the British spent their blood and treasure to end the slave trade. The answers must be of a practical nature not simplistic ethical rhetoric. Ending the theocracy is the ethical position but that does not mean by any means necessary. Trump understood that when he said that we would not kill Iranians in revenge for them shooting down a multi million dollar drone. It makes no sense to kill people to make them free or to enslave them to keep them from killing themselves.
      We hunt the hunters

      Comment


      • Originally posted by wolfhnd View Post
        People forget that more people died in the Iran Iraq war than 20 years of U.S. fighting in Iraq and Afghanistan. Unless you think American lives are inherently more valuable than those of other nations body count arguments are moot.

        Saddam was going to keep killing his own people and his neighbors until he was killed. The same applies to the Iranians regardless of what the U.S. does. They will continue killing their own people by the thousands as long as a theocracy that thinks it is moral to kill Gays, adulteresses, religious dissidents, political opponents, and numerous other people that offend their religious sensibilities exist or the theocracy ends. They will also continue by proxy to kill people around the world by financing terrorism. The only rational arguments for the U.S. to pull out are not based on humanitarian concerns but rather on self interest of the U.S. and the sovereignty of Iraq.

        There are many people as confused as Obama, who's personal experience of being abandoned by his father, would come to believe in the fantasy of multiculturalism and decolonization. They feel a need to blame someone for the human condition because they cannot deal with reality.

        Europeans did not bring war to the Middle East it has always been there. Only the bigotry of low expectations could explain how people are so oblivious to the history of Islam and it's wars of expansion that they would blame the current situation on racism. The African Slave trade started with Islam centuries before the Europeans got involved. The Islamic countries did not need to be corrupted by Europeans to formulate their own evils.

        The question is why should the U.S. not spend blood and treasure to end the horrors of the Iranian theocracy in the same way the British spent their blood and treasure to end the slave trade. The answers must be of a practical nature not simplistic ethical rhetoric. Ending the theocracy is the ethical position but that does not mean by any means necessary. Trump understood that when he said that we would not kill Iranians in revenge for them shooting down a multi million dollar drone. It makes no sense to kill people to make them free or to enslave them to keep them from killing themselves.
        The Iraq invasion was not a case of the US coming to aid the local population in an uprising against Saddam. It was not a case like Libya where the uprising had already started against the regime before any US intervention.

        As I said, the local population should be the final decision maker regarding if the status quo should be maintained or not because the local population can evaluate better than anybody else the price that is payed under the current oppressive regime and the price that is paid when the US army starts bombing their country. The Iraqi civilians were aware of the violence as a result of Saddam's regime and were also aware of the death that came as a result of the war with the US. Desert Storm was pretty fresh in their mind. And despite the illusions of many Americans, it became very clear during the Iraqi occupation that the local population would not forgive the Americans for the carnage of the war that the US brought on them and wold not welcome the US soldiers with flowers as liberator who freed them from Saddam's oppression.

        People, often choose life over ideals about freedom and democracy. Even in developed democratic societies, where democracy is supposedly cherished, people often make decisions based on pragmatic concerns (it is the economy stupid) and not based on principles. About 50% of the population in the US often prefers to skip elections and do other casual things instead. In a similar way, people in oppressive regimes will choose to obey the rules of the regime and avoid its violence instead of start chanting "give me liberty or give me death." This does not mean that there is not a breaking point where people will choose to risk their lives in order to get freedom, but this breaking point should be THEIR choice. And IF at some point choose to say "no more," THEN the US can decide to help them.
        Last edited by pamak; 06 Jan 20, 23:44.
        My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

        Comment


        • Originally posted by TactiKill J. View Post

          Iran has not staged any terror attacks on US soil. Either directly or by proxy. After this assassination it's basically a given that they now will, by proxy. So going from 0, to who knows how many, is not breaking even.
          Wrong : Iran was involved in 9/11

          Comment


          • Originally posted by TactiKill J. View Post

            Iran has not staged any terror attacks on US soil. Either directly or by proxy. After this assassination it's basically a given that they now will, by proxy. So going from 0, to who knows how many, is not breaking even.
            OK...so just where HAVE they staged terror attacks? London? Paris? Spain? Lebanon? Gaza? There's no "0". Doesn't the fact that they HAVE orchestrated, paid for, hired the mercenaries for and staged terror attacks ANYWHERE make them culpable to attack from the coalition of countries that have DECLARED WAR ON TERROR?
            ARRRR! International Talk Like A Pirate Day - September 19th
            IN MARE IN COELO

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Jose50 View Post

              OK...so just where HAVE they staged terror attacks? London? Paris? Spain? Lebanon? Gaza? There's no "0". Doesn't the fact that they HAVE orchestrated, paid for, hired the mercenaries for and staged terror attacks ANYWHERE make them culpable to attack from the coalition of countries that have DECLARED WAR ON TERROR?

              they have sponsored proxy terror through Hesbollah in Lebanon. Unfortunately, Sadamm Hussein was a cork in the bottle for twenty years after the Gulf war- and should have been left there.

              I would be surprised in Iran, who in the long run is still
              America's natural ally in the Middle East, does anything to escalate the present situation.
              they have an oil lifeline keeping their economy afloat.
              and a long coastline.
              The trout who swims against the current gets the most oxygen..

              Comment


              • Originally posted by marktwain View Post


                they have sponsored proxy terror through Hesbollah in Lebanon. Unfortunately, Sadamm Hussein was a cork in the bottle for twenty years after the Gulf war- and should have been left there.

                I would be surprised in Iran, who in the long run is still
                America's natural ally in the Middle East, does anything to escalate the present situation.
                they have an oil lifeline keeping their economy afloat.
                and a long coastline.

                Iran is run by religious zealots and I would submit that will always impact their decision making more than simple logic.
                Iran also needs an external threat to justify maintaining control over the people.

                Finally, they are every bit as capable of miscalculation as we are and their provocations have pretty much gone unanswered by us since the 1980s. Therefore, it would not be unreasonable for them to assume we would continue behaving in a passive manner.

                Just my opinion
                Avatar is General Gerard, courtesy of Zouave.

                Churchill to Chamberlain: you had a choice between war and dishonor. You chose dishonor, and you will have war.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Cambronnne View Post


                  Iran is run by religious zealots and I would submit that will always impact their decision making more than simple logic.
                  Iran also needs an external threat to justify maintaining control over the people.

                  Finally, they are every bit as capable of miscalculation as we are and their provocations have pretty much gone unanswered by us since the 1980s. Therefore, it would not be unreasonable for them to assume we would continue behaving in a passive manner.

                  Just my opinion
                  I would qualify religious zealots by adding pragmatic in there.

                  Comment


                  • The nuts and bolts of the issue is simple, Solemani was in Iraq cooridnating the atttacks onm the US Embassy, The embassy is US soil, therefore he was a legitimate target, end of story.
                    Dispite our best intentions, the system is dysfunctional that intelligence failure is guaranteed.
                    Russ Travers, CIA analyst, 2001

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by ljadw View Post

                      Wrong : Iran was involved in 9/11
                      At some point, there must be some policy in this history forum against revisionary history of that sort.
                      My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

                      Comment


                      • Two posts were removed from this thread. One by Mountain Man and a now unnecessary reply from marktwain.

                        Thank you
                        ACG Staff

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by pamak View Post

                          At some point, there must be some policy in this history forum against revisionary history of that sort.

                          Ramzi al-Shaibad,the link between AQ and the 9/11 hijackers, received in 2000 a visum from the Iranian embassy in Berlin .
                          Already in 1995 Bin Laden and Zawahiri received help from Iran in the bombing of the Egyptian embassy in Islamabad .
                          The ties between Iran and AQ/ISIS are a historical fact, whatever the supporters of Iran may say .

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by ljadw View Post


                            Ramzi al-Shaibad,the link between AQ and the 9/11 hijackers, received in 2000 a visum from the Iranian embassy in Berlin .
                            Already in 1995 Bin Laden and Zawahiri received help from Iran in the bombing of the Egyptian embassy in Islamabad .
                            The ties between Iran and AQ/ISIS are a historical fact, whatever the supporters of Iran may say .
                            Pure nonsense!

                            There are more ties of OBL with the Saudis and of the 9/11 hijackers to Germany.. And one can find even the US government letting terrorists wit visas to come to the country. One needs to be very biased to argue that there is a 9/11 collaboration based on such evidence.
                            Last edited by pamak; 11 Jan 20, 02:45.
                            My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

                            Comment

                            Latest Topics

                            Collapse

                            Working...
                            X