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Devin Nunes Met with Ex-Ukrainian Official to get dirt on Biden

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  • Originally posted by ljadw View Post

    Why should Trump fight corruption in Ukraine ? Afaics,he is not the president of Ukraine .
    Biden also was not fighting corruption in Ukraine.
    Are you aware that this was Trump's claim?

    The argument is because US tax dollars were at stake.

    And you are wrong that Biden was not fighting corruption in Ukraine. In fact, Biden was executing an objective to remove a prosecutor who was considered as an obstacle in fighting corruption by everybody at the time, including the Europeans and the IMF. Yovanovitch was also fighting corruption according to the testimonies of the diplomats. That is why she pissed off scams like Parnas ad other oligarchs who collaborated with Giuliani to take her down through a smear campaign.
    My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

    Comment


    • Originally posted by ljadw View Post

      There is no proof that Trump wanted Zelensky to dig up dirt for Biden .
      Read the transcripts.
      Ad sorry, it is the DOJ which is involved in investigating illegal activities. When a personal layer is involved in such investigations without collaborating with the DOJ, this is a clear piece of evidence that this was all about finding political dirt.
      My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

      Comment


      • Originally posted by pamak View Post

        Sorry, but if one is serious in passing a messsage of combating corruption, he needs to have the whole team consistent wth that message and not having half of them saying one thing to Ukrainians while others pursuing in secrecy different objectives which contradicted the understanding of the official channels!

        So, yes, updates were necessary. And updates WERE used in the past even when unoffiicial envoys were engaged in diplomacy as I SHOWED you with the links that I posted. And sorry but it is preposterous to claim that a personal lawyer who has NOT even taken an oath in assuming official duties and has not even passed from a vetting process should have a higher "need to know" regarding diplomatic affairs that the official channels!

        The claim that Trump did not trust ANY official channel is contradicted by Trump's DECISION to APPOINT people like Volker and Sondland to handle the case through official channels. Trump did not JUST use Giuliani to handle the whole range of contacts with the Ukrainians regarding the supposedly investigation of Ukrainian corruption.


        The leak by the way came when TRUMP TALKED to Zelensky which was heard by various people who eventually got in contact with the whistleblower. The leak did not come from Sondland or Volker who were not present during the phone-call since they were already in Ukraine WORKING FOR TRUMP.

        So, the question is why did Trump trust Sondland and Volker to press Ukraine for investigating Burisma and Ukrainian corruption but did NOT trust them enough to handle the case without Giuliani? The only answer is that Trump wanted Giuliani for something else other than pressing the Ukrainians to investigate Burisma and corruption . He wanted to get dirt for Biden and for THIS he could NOT trust the official channels Trump himself established!
        It was very legal for Trump, GOP presidential candidate, to look if there was no dirt for Biden, possible Democratic presidential candidate .
        All candidates are looking for dirt .In 1824 the opponents of Jackson were looking for dirt against Jackson .
        In 1892 the Democrats used dirt against Blaine and the GOP against Cleveland .
        In 2016 the Democrats invented dirt against Trump, used the FBI/CIA/MI6 against Trump, something which was totally illegal .
        Sondland and Volker were /are unreliable people ,belonging to Deep State .Volker said first that there was nothing illegal, and later corrected his statement .
        The conversation between Trump and Zelensky was illegally overheard by Democratic spies who informed an other Democratic infiltrant who informed the Democrats on Capitol Hill .
        That Trump used Volker and Sondland does not mean that he trusted them : he had to use them because there was need for an official channel .
        Last edited by ljadw; 04 Dec 19, 03:38.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by ljadw View Post

          That the unofficial channel was going after Biden was totally legal . Unless your opinion is that crimes of Biden should remain hidden .
          No it was not because it used offie powers to "convince" foreign leaders. Offering a WH meeting and linking it to such investigation is not legal! And the DOJ is the one which investigates US citizens IF and only IF there is a basis for such investigation. Using rumors from mafia guys to ope such investigation does not cut it.
          My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

          Comment


          • Originally posted by ljadw View Post

            It was very legal for Trump, GOP presidential candidate, to look if there was no dirt for Biden, possible Democratic presidential candidate .
            All candidates are looking for dirt .
            ONLY if Trump did not link his office powers to such investigation. The moment there was a link between such officer powers (WH meeting and military aid) to the quest to find Biden's dirt, this is illegal!
            My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

            Comment


            • In 1992 Old Bush asked Major to ask MI5 to investigate the claim that Bill Clinton tried to dodge military service during the Vietnam War, by asking to become British citizen when he was in Oxford .
              Deep State and the Democrats did not try to impeach Old Bush, because Old Bush was a globalist, one of them .
              In 2016,Hillary sollicited and accepted openly the support of the foreign political class.
              On March 13 2016 Hillary said the following : I am have foreign leaders ask if they can endorse me to stop Trump .
              She gave the name of someone who endorsed her publicly ( the PM of Italy ) , but refused to name those who endorsed her privately .
              One of those who endorsed Hillary,was Porochenko, the friend of Biden and of Yovanovich .
              I do not remember Schiff saying that this was illegal .

              Comment


              • Originally posted by pamak View Post

                Read the transcripts.
                Ad sorry, it is the DOJ which is involved in investigating illegal activities. When a personal layer is involved in such investigations without collaborating with the DOJ, this is a clear piece of evidence that this was all about finding political dirt.
                The head of the DOJ is NOT the AG but the potus .

                Comment


                • Originally posted by ljadw View Post
                  In 1992 Old Bush asked Major to ask MI5 to investigate the claim that Bill Clinton tried to dodge military service during the Vietnam War, by asking to become British citizen when he was in Oxford .
                  Deep State and the Democrats did not try to impeach Old Bush, because Old Bush was a globalist, one of them .
                  In 2016,Hillary sollicited and accepted openly the support of the foreign political class.
                  On March 13 2016 Hillary said the following : I am have foreign leaders ask if they can endorse me to stop Trump .
                  She gave the name of someone who endorsed her publicly ( the PM of Italy ) , but refused to name those who endorsed her privately .
                  One of those who endorsed Hillary,was Porochenko, the friend of Biden and of Yovanovich .
                  I do not remember Schiff saying that this was illegal .
                  I do not care about your unsupported claims. You are obviously BS us with nonsense. And by the way, Hillary was not in a position to abuse any office power since she did not have any government position in 2016. But hey, if you have any evidence (and I mean transcripts and not some nonsense from Solomon or other conspiracist theorists or from the Bill Clinton campaign at the time and its friendly press) that any of the people you mentioned asked foreign leaders to investigate their political opponent and used their power of office to get some election advantage, feel free to present it.
                  Last edited by pamak; 04 Dec 19, 06:07.
                  My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by ljadw View Post

                    The head of the DOJ is NOT the AG but the potus .
                    Sorry, but a POTUS cannot act as the head of the DOJ and take the law in his hands by whining that he does not trust the DOJ. Some things under certain conditions can justify impeachment even if the POTUS is the head of the DOJ. Corrupt intend is one of such cases.
                    Otherwise, a POTUS could remove for any reason (including with corrupt intend) AGs or FBI Directors who investigate a crime that the president wants to conceal.
                    My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Massena View Post
                      https://www.cnn.com/2019/11/22/polit...den/index.html

                      A lawyer for an indicted associate of Rudy Giuliani tells CNN that his client is willing to tell Congress about meetings the top Republican on the House Intelligence Committee had in Vienna last year with a former Ukrainian prosecutor to discuss digging up dirt on Joe Biden.


                      The attorney, Joseph A. Bondy, represents Lev Parnas, the recently indicted Soviet-born American who worked with Giuliani to push claims of Democratic corruption in Ukraine. Bondy said that Parnas was told directly by the former Ukrainian official that he met last year in Vienna with Rep. Devin Nunes.

                      "Mr. Parnas learned from former Ukrainian Prosecutor General Victor Shokin that Nunes had met with Shokin in Vienna last December," said Bondy.

                      Shokin was ousted from his position in 2016 after pressure from Western leaders, including then-vice president Biden, over concerns that Shokin was not pursuing corruption cases.
                      CNN is again reporting fake news in their effort to undo the 2016 election results.

                      Rep. Devin Nunes filed a defamation lawsuit Tuesday against CNN for its Nov. 22 “demonstrably false hit piece” that said the California Republican traveled to Vienna in 2018 to dig up dirt on former Vice President Joseph R Biden

                      "Devin Nunes did not go to Vienna or anywhere else in Austria in 2018,” declares the lawsuit seeking $435 million in damages. He said he visited two countries:Lybia and Maltaon a congressional delegation, or “codel.”

                      The CNN story said Mr. Nunes supposedly met with former Ukrainian chief prosecutor Viktor Shokin.
                      https://www.washingtontimes.com/news...amation-lawsu/

                      “Breaking News,”

                      “Something irrelevant in your life just happened and now we are going to blow it all out of proportion for days to keep you distracted from what's really going on.”

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by pamak View Post

                        Are you aware that this was Trump's claim?

                        The argument is because US tax dollars were at stake.

                        And you are wrong that Biden was not fighting corruption in Ukraine. In fact, Biden was executing an objective to remove a prosecutor who was considered as an obstacle in fighting corruption by everybody at the time, including the Europeans and the IMF. Yovanovitch was also fighting corruption according to the testimonies of the diplomats. That is why she pissed off scams like Parnas ad other oligarchs who collaborated with Giuliani to take her down through a smear campaign.
                        Biden was a friend of Poroshenko who endorsed Hillary . Today Poroshenko is investigated for corruption and his minister of defense has been arrested a few hours before he would leave the country ,accused of graft of $ dozens of millions .Collaborating with Poroshenko was as collaborating with Al Capone or the Democratic governor of Illinois who tried to sell the senate seat of Obama in 2009 .
                        You do not fight corruption by an alliance with a corrupt president ,Biden and Yovanovich endorsed Porochenko,knowing that he was corrupt .
                        Bloomberg : ''It has become increasingly clear that Obama-era US politicians backed the wrong people in Ukraine .''
                        ONE of these wrong people was Porochenko .

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by pamak View Post

                          Sorry, but a POTUS cannot act as the head of the DOJ and take the law in his hands by whining that he does not trust the DOJ. Some things under certain conditions can justify impeachment even if the POTUS is the head of the DOJ. Corrupt intend is one of such cases.
                          Otherwise, a POTUS could remove for any reason (including with corrupt intend) AGs or FBI Directors who investigate a crime that the president wants to conceal.
                          The Potus can fire ANYONE belonging to the Executive Branch without giving any reason ,because they serve at his pleasure and because he is the head of the Executive Branch .

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by ljadw View Post

                            Biden was a friend of Poroshenko who endorsed Hillary . Today Poroshenko is investigated for corruption and his minister of defense has been arrested a few hours before he would leave the country ,accused of graft of $ dozens of millions .Collaborating with Poroshenko was as collaborating with Al Capone or the Democratic governor of Illinois who tried to sell the senate seat of Obama in 2009 .
                            You do not fight corruption by an alliance with a corrupt president ,Biden and Yovanovich endorsed Porochenko,knowing that he was corrupt .
                            Bloomberg : ''It has become increasingly clear that Obama-era US politicians backed the wrong people in Ukraine .''
                            ONE of these wrong people was Porochenko .
                            Repeating the original claims you made about Biden without addressing my counterpoints do not win the argument for your side. There is nothing to suggest that Biden was a friend of Poroshenko. Biden was carrying Obama's policy. And do not lecture me about Poroshenko's corruption when you used Poroshecnko's chief prosecutor's claims to say that Biden's son was under investigation. So, stop insulting out intelligent when you talk about the fight against corruption.

                            And by the way, you missed my post with Volker, who was TRUMP's special envoy in the official channel who tried to convince Zelensky not to prosecute Poroshenko!

                            from the transcripts of the testimonies of which you appear to know nothing!

                            Kurt Volker: (01:17:22

                            I’m very familiar with other examples of countries in the region that have gone for prosecutions of the former government, and these have created deep divisions in society. And so I cited President Zelensky’s inauguration speech ... I’m sorry ... his National Day speech from August 24th that was all about unifying the country.
                            And I cautioned Mr. Yermak to say that pursuing of President Poroshenko risks deepening the divisions in the country, exactly the opposite of what President Zelensky has said he wants to do.

                            Mike Quigley:
                            So it’s fair to describe it as you discouraged him from such actions.


                            Kurt Volker:
                            Yeah, I discouraged him. I raised concerns about what the potential impact would be.


                            Mike Quigley:
                            And what was Mr. Yermak’s response?

                            Kurt Volker:
                            I believe, and I’m refreshed in this by seeing the testimony of others.

                            Mike Quigley:
                            Mr. Taylor.


                            Kurt Volker:
                            Mr. Taylor’s testimony.

                            Mike Quigley: Ambassador Taylor and Mr. Kent.

                            Kurt Volker:
                            Right, and I believe, based on that testimony, that Mr. Yermak said, “Well, what, you mean like asking us to investigate Clinton and Biden?”


                            Do me a favor. Do your homework before engaging in a farther conversation
                            Last edited by pamak; 04 Dec 19, 06:03.
                            My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by ljadw View Post

                              The Potus can fire ANYONE belonging to the Executive Branch without giving any reason ,because they serve at his pleasure and because he is the head of the Executive Branch .
                              Yes he can. But the fact that Trump does it with insult and ridicule only diminishes him as both a person and as president.
                              We are not now that strength which in old days
                              Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
                              Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
                              To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

                              Comment


                              • In 2010 the husband of the US Secretary of State, who ( the Secretary of State )was considered as the probable Democratic presidential candidate in 2016 , received $ 500000 from a Russian oligarch , Every one knows that a Russian oligarch dos not give $ 500000 for free ,but that this was
                                a quid pro quo .
                                The media remained silent.Adam Schiff remained silent . This does prevent the media and Adam Schiff from attacking Trump about the Ukraine ''deal .''
                                Adam Schiff and the media would not have remained silent if Melania Trump had received not $ 500000 but only $ 5000 from a Russian oligarch .

                                4 years later, The Democrats and their allies decided to give $ hundreds of millions to the corrupt president of a corrupt country (Ukraine ) ,money Ukraine did not need .At the same time, the corrupt president wanted to steal the major Ukrainian enterprise that was the possession of a corrupt Ukrainian oligarch ( the classic case of a thief stealing from an other thief ) .This corrupt country was de facto ruled by a US VP. What did the corrupt oligarch ? He gave the son of the VP ( a nitwit looking for a job ) $ 2.4 million and curiously the danger of the corrupt president vanished and for the modest sum of $ 2,4 million ,he conserved his empire ,that was worth $ a lot of billions : its revenue for 2018 was estimated at at least $ 400 million .
                                Ukrainian oligarchs are as Russian oligarchs : they do not give $ 2,4 million away for free .
                                When this quid pro quo ($ 2.4 million for the son of the VP if the VP saved Burisma ) was leaked, the media and Adam Schiff attacked ....the messenger .
                                Hypocrites .

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