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As California tries to become a Third World nation, residents are taking measures

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  • #16
    Originally posted by slick_miester View Post

    I think that we had this conversation just about a week ago. . . . For a real interesting comparison, has someone thought to try it on Purchasing Power Parity? I'd suspect that California's per capita spread over Texas will shrink dramatically if we employed PPP rather than per capita GDP.
    Different subject, but in any case be sure to check the conversation about the TX Comptroller's report on housing affordability (a traditional advantage in TX and the biggest factor for determining PPP) as population density in TX increases ( now it is less less than half of that in CA).

    https://forums.armchairgeneral.com/f...55#post5140655

    My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post

      Thanks for the gratuitous ad hominem.
      Sorry, but I do not attack you personally.

      I attack your credibility as a commentator on CA affairs because in this thread you make claims unsupported by evidence, such as " It could easily take a company several years to be allowed to install a back up generator, if they're even allowed to at all,"and you expect somehow that people should take your claims seriously.

      So, yes, your record in f*** up even basic facts about CA is relevant and undermines you commentary about the more complicated issues you try to discuss here without evidence.

      If you do not want me to attack your credibility, you should actually find sources and evidence and make comments on those findings instead of pulling out of your ass claims such as the one in blue above!
      Last edited by pamak; 24 Oct 19, 15:37.
      My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

      Comment


      • #18
        When will California catch up with Greece in being a failed state? Pensions are their Achilles heel but the comparison has deeper implications.
        We hunt the hunters

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by pamak View Post

          Another irrational claim which defies common logic since the construction of power lines in those areas was somehow permitted. The fact that the companies are held accountable and that there are billions in liabilities shows that it is impossible for these companies to manufacture excuses and blame the state for what happened.
          It has been a long battle between environmental groups and the power companies. Clearance takes environmental studies and permits.

          US Fish and Wildlife began to relax it's rules in 2017, but the utility companies still have to fight Sierra Club and other groups.

          SACRAMENTO, Calif. – The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service (Service) has issued Pacific Gas and Electric Company (PG&E) an Endangered Species Act Section 10(a)(1)(B) incidental take permit for the company’s Bay Area Habitat Conservation Plan Operations and Maintenance (HCP). The HCP includes strategies to avoid, minimize, and offset potential direct, indirect, and cumulative effects of PG&E’s operations, maintenance, and minor new construction activities on 32 species federally listed as threatened or endangered. The proposed activities will be located within an approximately 402,440 acre plan area in portions of California’s Alameda, Contra Costa, Marin, Napa, San Francisco, San Mateo, Santa Clara, Solano, and Sonoma Counties.

          Most residents will not be directly affected by the proposed habitat conservation plan because covered activities are part of existing and ongoing programs. The habitat conservation plan and incidental take permit issued by the Service will enable PG&E to implement and complete projects more quickly under a landscape‐scale habitat conservation plan as opposed to the previous project‐by‐project consultation PG&E and U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service once operated under. A secondary benefit to residents is the increase in some passive recreation opportunities in the Bay Area. As mitigation lands are protected for the covered species, some of these lands will incorporate passive recreation (e.g., hiking and bird watching) where they are compatible with species protection.

          Habitat conservation plans ensure there is adequate minimizing and mitigating of the effects non-federal activities have on threatened and endangered species, as required under Section 10 of the Endangered Species Act. The Service regularly engages conservation partners, the public, landowners, government agencies, and other stakeholders in our ongoing effort to identify innovative strategies for conserving and recovering species at risk. Habitat conservation plans provide a roadmap for species recovery that is essential to protecting ecosystems that benefit society as a whole.

          The final HCP, environmental assessment, the Service’s responses to the comments submitted during the open comment period, and related documents are available on the Sacramento Fish and Wildlife Office website.

          For more information about the species proposed for coverage by the HCP visit www.fws.gov/sacramento.

          Here are some local issues and battles against PG&Et:

          https://www.eastbaytimes.com/2019/02...-removal-plan/

          http://goodtimes.sc/santa-cruz-news/...eet-extension/
          Flag: USA / Location: West Coast

          Prayers.

          BoRG

          http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/8757/snap1ws8.jpg

          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PtsX_Z3CMU

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by wolfhnd View Post
            When will California catch up with Greece in being a failed state? Pensions are their Achilles heel but the comparison has deeper implications.
            Not related to this thread. In another discussion we can see how any southern states are actually bigger failure than even Greece.

            My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by pamak View Post

              Sorry, but I do not attack you personally.

              I attack your credibility because you make claims unsupported by evidence, such as " It could easily take a company several years to be allowed to install a back up generator, if they're even allowed to at all,"and you expect somehow that people should take your claims seriously.
              So, yes, your record in f*** up even basic facts about CA is relevant.
              I
              Then you don't know what an ad hominem is, or completely misunderstand what it is. You made one using what is essentially a argument from authority where you use an tu quoque fallacy amounting to a personal insult.
              That is, you cherry pick a single case where I made a now acknowledged error and apply it as the general case. It amounts to this:

              You were wrong one time in the past, therefore you must be wrong now. How can anyone take your claims seriously? We should just ignore you because you're obviously wrong you incompetent moron.

              That is essentially what you've said and implied. Thus, it's an ad hominem. Making it worse you parrot Jutland who uses the same insult repeatedly only reinforcing that it is intended as an insult.

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Salinator View Post

                It has been a long battle between environmental groups and the power companies. Clearance takes environmental studies and permits.

                US Fish and Wildlife began to relax it's rules in 2017, but the utility companies still have to fight Sierra Club and other groups.

                SACRAMENTO, Calif. – The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service (Service) has issued Pacific Gas and Electric Company (PG&E) an Endangered Species Act Section 10(a)(1)(B) incidental take permit for the company’s Bay Area Habitat Conservation Plan Operations and Maintenance (HCP). The HCP includes strategies to avoid, minimize, and offset potential direct, indirect, and cumulative effects of PG&E’s operations, maintenance, and minor new construction activities on 32 species federally listed as threatened or endangered. The proposed activities will be located within an approximately 402,440 acre plan area in portions of California’s Alameda, Contra Costa, Marin, Napa, San Francisco, San Mateo, Santa Clara, Solano, and Sonoma Counties.

                Most residents will not be directly affected by the proposed habitat conservation plan because covered activities are part of existing and ongoing programs. The habitat conservation plan and incidental take permit issued by the Service will enable PG&E to implement and complete projects more quickly under a landscape‐scale habitat conservation plan as opposed to the previous project‐by‐project consultation PG&E and U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service once operated under. A secondary benefit to residents is the increase in some passive recreation opportunities in the Bay Area. As mitigation lands are protected for the covered species, some of these lands will incorporate passive recreation (e.g., hiking and bird watching) where they are compatible with species protection.

                Habitat conservation plans ensure there is adequate minimizing and mitigating of the effects non-federal activities have on threatened and endangered species, as required under Section 10 of the Endangered Species Act. The Service regularly engages conservation partners, the public, landowners, government agencies, and other stakeholders in our ongoing effort to identify innovative strategies for conserving and recovering species at risk. Habitat conservation plans provide a roadmap for species recovery that is essential to protecting ecosystems that benefit society as a whole.

                The final HCP, environmental assessment, the Service’s responses to the comments submitted during the open comment period, and related documents are available on the Sacramento Fish and Wildlife Office website.

                For more information about the species proposed for coverage by the HCP visit www.fws.gov/sacramento.

                Here is an article about a local fight:

                https://www.eastbaytimes.com/2019/02...-removal-plan/
                Such fights does not imply prohibition of clearing branches near power lines. The very fact of having the companies held accountable for the wildlife damages should be a clear indicator that the excuse of state regulations that supposedly prevented the companies from doing the right thing does not fly.
                My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

                Comment


                • #23
                  Considering a Residential Generator? Start Here.

                  MAY 20, 2015 BY OWEN8 COMMENTS
                  california-home-generator2Having a permanent stationery generator installed at your home used to be a simple matter some ten years ago, but now California cities have adopted the full requirements of the National Fire Protection Association, standard 110 and the rules, regulations, and costs are quite extensive. People who have large parcels of land will have an easier time complying with the rules and regulations, because setback rules and noise ordinances can be a problem if your neighbor is close by.

                  If a residential generator is one of your priorities, here are some of the requirements you should consider before calling out a generator company, like CD & Power. Determine the Size You Need

                  The first step is to determine the size generator you need to run the critical functions of your home. This is a process of deciding which of the items in your home you would like the new generator to run during a utility outage. Some people want everything to be up and running, and others want just critical items like HVAC and the refrigerator. Check the owner’s manual for the items you want to power and add up the power level that each one requires. That will give you an idea of the size of the generator you need. Use this Generator-Sizing-Chart as a reference. Placement & Noise

                  Next, you should consider where the generator will be placed. Some cities require the generator to be out of sight, or in an enclosed space. Most of the time, it will require a setback of at least 5 feet from the property line, and a concrete pad with electrical wiring and hook-ups for the generator and transfer switch. Noise ordinances allow for a maximum sound level of 45dB at your neighbor’s property line. With large generators in residential subdivisions, noise is a limiting factor. Air Quality

                  If the generator you need is 50 horsepower or greater, you will need to apply for a permit from your local Air Quality District. There are 35 AQDs in California. Find yours here: Map of California Air Quality Boards Natural Gas or Propane?

                  You should also consider the fuel source for your generator. If it will be natural gas, you’ll need plumbing; and if it is propane, you should think about where the tank will be located. Engineering Drawings

                  Next you will need several engineering drawings to submit to the city planning and building departments. The engineering drawings will show property lines, the location of the generator in relation to your home and adjacent buildings, clearance around the unit and from windows and combustibles, installation plans, fueling exhaust systems, and electrical single line diagrams for the generator and transfer switch along with the electrical connections to the main circuit breaker in your home. The city will also need information about the location of your home. Is it near a school, hospital, or operation where exhaust and/or noise will affect children or a large population? Permits

                  Once your engineering drawings are complete, you are ready to apply for permits. You will need a Building Permit, a Fire Permit, and an Electrical Permit. Each of these has associated fees, and may be denied, granted, or granted with conditions. Time to Buy the Generator!

                  When you have approved permits, it’s time to buy your generator and transfer switch; and then hire an electrician and concrete company to install the pad. Generator installation comes next followed by a final inspection by the city and the fire department before you can start it up. The last step is to fuel the generator. CD & Power Will Manage the Process

                  The process will take between two and three months to complete. CD & Power can help you manage the process – from helping you determine the right size generator to suit your needs, to finding a certified engineer to make the drawings. We manage the city permit process and work with electrical, plumbing and concrete contractors, inspectors, procure the generator and switch, and manage the installation. Costs

                  Usually, the minimum cost for a residential stationery generator starts between $10,000 and $20,000 and includes the generator, transfer switch, concrete pad, electrical work and installation. Permits and fees vary city by city. Some cities, like Berkeley, Tiburon, and Mill Valley have more stringent guidelines and have special requirements that may add to the cost.

                  Although she’s not in California, Martha Stewart installed a generator for her estate in New York. It’s kind of fun to watch the process.

                  CD & Power has installed generators for commercial and residential customers since 1985. We also offer generator maintenance and repair service, fueling, and compliance services throughout Northern California. We are a family-owned and operated, certified woman-owned business headquartered in Martinez. For additional information, please give us a call at 866-468-7697.
                  https://www.gotpower.com/considering...or-start-here/
                  Flag: USA / Location: West Coast

                  Prayers.

                  BoRG

                  http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/8757/snap1ws8.jpg

                  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PtsX_Z3CMU

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post

                    Then you don't know what an ad hominem is, or completely misunderstand what it is. You made one using what is essentially a argument from authority where you use an tu quoque fallacy amounting to a personal insult.
                    That is, you cherry pick a single case where I made a now acknowledged error and apply it as the general case. It amounts to this:

                    You were wrong one time in the past, therefore you must be wrong now. How can anyone take your claims seriously? We should just ignore you because you're obviously wrong you incompetent moron.

                    That is essentially what you've said and implied. Thus, it's an ad hominem. Making it worse you parrot Jutland who uses the same insult repeatedly only reinforcing that it is intended as an insult.
                    Do not give me a lecture about fallacies that you do not understand.

                    What I did was to attack your sense of expertise when you make ridiculous statements WITHOUT EVIDENCE TO BACK THEM UP!

                    It is not that you actually provided sources and I chose to attack your credibility instead of focusing on attacking your arguments based on the sources you brought. In such scenario, you could voice a legitimate complaint.

                    What I essentially say is that your history of commentary about even basic facts regarding CA shows that you cannot be trusted. Therefore any statement of yours that is not backed up by evidence is veryyyyyy weak!
                    My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by pamak View Post

                      Do not give me a lecture about fallacies that you do not understand.

                      What I did was to attack tour sense of expertise when you make ridiculous statements WITHOUT EVIDENCE TO BACK THEM UP!

                      It is not that you actually provided sources and I chose to attack your credibility instead of focusing on attacking your arguments based on the sources you brought.

                      What I essentially say is that your history of commentary about even basic facts regarding CA shows that you cannot be trusted. Therefore any statement of yours that is not backed up by evidence should be taken with a huge grain of salt!
                      Where was YOUR source when you claimed that utility companies can do any clearing they want without approval simply because lines were permitted?

                      Stop the personal commentaries NOW.

                      ACG Staff
                      Flag: USA / Location: West Coast

                      Prayers.

                      BoRG

                      http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/8757/snap1ws8.jpg

                      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PtsX_Z3CMU

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by SRV Ron View Post
                        One poster complained that the power companies were neglectant in clearing the brush and trees away from their power lines. He did not bother to check that in most cases, they were not allowed to do so because of some endangered species that might be living in the areas to be cleared. So, another round of blackouts are going to occur for the sake of preventing power line sparked fires.

                        Oh, those generators had better meet the stringent state requirements on emissions or they will be banned from being used. IE, they cannot be purchased from out of the state.
                        So, since you were the first to respond on this thread and since we are into the subject of using sources, where is YOUR source for your claim?
                        Last edited by pamak; 24 Oct 19, 16:43.
                        My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by pamak View Post

                          Such fights does not imply prohibition of clearing branches near power lines. The very fact of having the companies held accountable for the wildlife damages should be a clear indicator that the excuse of state regulations that supposedly prevented the companies from doing the right thing does not fly.
                          Do you not understand nesting in trees and brushes, and the fact that there are both State and Federal regulations that create a paperwork and oversight nightmare? Power and gas lines also traverse through private lands where the Utilities also need to permission and coordination from the owners. Why did Governors Brown and Newsom (liberals) sign a bunch of new laws to expedite the Utilities' clearance work and allow them to pass on the costs to consumers, and to protect the Utilities?

                          Not to mention the State's previous Green mandates that required increased investment in carbon investment which diverted money from maintenance - that is just one reason why PG&E can now pass on maintenance costs with the new laws.
                          Flag: USA / Location: West Coast

                          Prayers.

                          BoRG

                          http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/8757/snap1ws8.jpg

                          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PtsX_Z3CMU

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Salinator View Post

                            Do you not understand nesting in trees and brushes, and the fact that there are both State and Federal regulations that create a paperwork and oversight nightmare? Power and gas lines also traverse through private lands where the Utilities also need to permission and coordination from the owners. Why did Governors Brown and Newsom (liberals) sign a bunch of new laws to expedite the Utilities' clearance work and allow them to pass on the costs to consumers, and to protect the Utilities?

                            Not to mention the State's previous Green mandates that required increased investment in carbon investment which diverted money from maintenance - that is just one reason why PG&E can now pass on maintenance costs with the new laws.
                            Filing paperwork is not the same with the claim that the power companies could not clear branches near power lines. Also, It is not unique to California to have lines traversing private lands. Which part of the old laws prohibited utility companies from clearing branches near power lines in certain areas because of environmental concerns?
                            My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by pamak View Post

                              Filing paperwork is not the same with the claim that they could not clear branches near power lines. Also, It is not unique to California to have lines traversing private lands.
                              Oh, Good Lord. What happens when the clearing crew shows up with their equipment and find a home of some who knows what specie that was not there last year? The crew go back to headquarters and report the situation. Things come to abrupt halt until US Fish & Wildife, CA Fish & Game, and assorted specialists shows up AFTER more paperwork is filed.

                              Power passing through private land is not unique, but not everywhere is blessed with California luscious flora growth and cursed with DROUGHT.
                              Flag: USA / Location: West Coast

                              Prayers.

                              BoRG

                              http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/8757/snap1ws8.jpg

                              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PtsX_Z3CMU

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Salinator View Post

                                Oh, Good Lord. What happens when the clearing crew shows up with their equipment and find a home of some who knows what specie that was not there last year? The crew go back to headquarters and report the situation. Things come to abrupt halt until US Fish & Wildife, CA Fish & Game, and assorted specialists shows up AFTER more paperwork is filed.

                                Power passing through private land is not unique, but not everywhere is blessed with California luscious flora growth and cursed with DROUGHT.
                                The crew showing up to clear branches are not biologists and they will find no new species.. And even if somebody finds a new species there, you have not provided the code that prohibits the maintenance of lines in such areas. And even in such scenario, the crew can keep themselves busy by clearing other portions of the grid until the required paperwork for the specific area of concern is completed. Also, neither you nor the poster who initially made the claim provided evidence that the wildfires were a result of such scenario.

                                Yes, climate is one of the main reasons for CA's wildfire problems. But this is not the main argument of the people in this thread who blame CA for the fires.
                                Last edited by pamak; 24 Oct 19, 17:39.
                                My most dangerous mission: I landed in the middle of an enemy tank battalion and I immediately, started spraying bullets killing everybody around me having fun up until my computer froze...

                                Comment

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