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  • 'Beware the Anger of the Legions'

    https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/15/polit...ger/index.html

    A wide range of American military personnel and defense officials are expressing a deep sense of frustration and anger at the Trump administration's refusal to support Syrian Kurds facing a Turkish military assault, over half a dozen US military and defense officials have told CNN.

    Several US military and defense officials, including personnel deployed to Syria, expressed dismay at how the Trump administration has handled the situation.

    One US official said it is well known that some senior US military officials are livid at how the Kurds have been treated given their role in helping the US fight ISIS.

    The quote at the OP is taken from a supposed quote from Marcus Flavinius,
    Centurion in the 2nd Cohort of the Augusta Legion,
    which is used in Jean Larteguy's excellent book The Centurions:
    'If We Should Have to Leave Our Bleached Bones on These Desert Sands in Vain, Then Beware the Anger of the Legions.'

    A comment by General Pershing after War I is more accurate and is also timely. He believed that because the German Army was not forced to surrender after the Armistice, it would have to be done all over again-hence War II.
    We are not now that strength which in old days
    Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
    Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
    To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

  • #2
    Originally posted by Massena View Post
    The quote at the OP is taken from a supposed quote from Marcus Flavinius,
    Centurion in the 2nd Cohort of the Augusta Legion, which is used in Jean Larteguy's excellent book The Centurions:
    'If We Should Have to Leave Our Bleached Bones on These Desert Sands in Vain, Then Beware the Anger of the Legions.'
    Interesting.

    It has long been suggested here you can't keep a 600+ billion $ army and bring them all "home", they'll eat you alive.

    You'll have to station them somewhere, or disband some (or a considerable part) of them into civilians.
    Last edited by Snowygerry; 15 Oct 19, 08:08.
    High Admiral Snowy, Commander In Chief of the Naval Forces of The Phoenix Confederation.

    Comment


    • #3
      Another anti Trump rant using unnamed sources by CNN......
      "I don't discuss sitting presidents," Mattis tells NPR in an interview. "I believe that you owe a period of quiet."

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Nichols View Post
        Another anti Trump rant using unnamed sources by CNN......
        I took it to be an interesting thread about the domestic cost/risk of the Roman legions and the parallels with the current US army ?

        Who is this Trump you speak of ?
        Last edited by Snowygerry; 15 Oct 19, 09:08.
        High Admiral Snowy, Commander In Chief of the Naval Forces of The Phoenix Confederation.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Snowygerry View Post

          I took it to be an interesting thread about the domestic cost/risk of the Roman legions and the parallels with the current US army ?
          There is no parallel between the Roman Legion and the current US Army. This is just another anti Trump rant

          "I don't discuss sitting presidents," Mattis tells NPR in an interview. "I believe that you owe a period of quiet."

          Comment


          • #6
            No, there isn't an actual 'parallel' between the ancient Roman army and the US Army. There are parallels, however, between soldiers who have heard the owl and seen the elephant. But the point is Trump has thrown away the apparent victory over ISIS for whatever reason, and he isn't bringing the soldiers home as he said he would.

            But there is a parallel with Pershing's comment after War I:

            'They [the Germans] never knew they were beaten in Berlin. It will all have to be done all over again.'-The Doughboys, by Laurence Stallings, 374.

            You're not a student of military history now are you? You have that in common with Trump and that's not a compliment.
            Last edited by Massena; 15 Oct 19, 09:24.
            We are not now that strength which in old days
            Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
            Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
            To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Nichols View Post
              There is no parallel between the Roman Legion and the current US Army.
              Are you sure ?

              Let's see.

              I present for your consideration, the following, by Jeffrey T. Fowler, Ph.D.

              Faculty Member, School of Security and Global Studies, American Military University

              https://inhomelandsecurity.com/immig...-ancient-rome/

              The United States government framework has its foundations in ancient Rome’s government. Rome began with its founding by the Etruscans in 753 B.C. and ended with the demise of the Western Roman Empire in 476 A.D. The Eastern Roman Empire continued until its fall in 1453 A.D.

              By contrast, the United States has existed as a nation only since 1776. However, while the U.S. is commonly called a democracy, it is actually a representative republic founded on the Roman model.
              What We Can Learn from Comparing US-Roman Military Service and Immigration Policies

              There are similarities and differences between Roman and U.S. approaches to military service and immigration. Rome and the U.S. both expanded their territory through conquest and both found it necessary to hire contract personnel to supplement their armed forces.
              Don't you agree ?
              High Admiral Snowy, Commander In Chief of the Naval Forces of The Phoenix Confederation.

              Comment


              • #8
                That is what the OP does, he finds something, anything that he can twist against Trump and does so. The only thing he is good at is displaying his irrational hatred for Trump.
                Just try to ignore him.
                Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it whether it exists or not, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedy. -- Ernest Benn

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Massena View Post
                  No, there isn't an actual 'parallel' between the ancient Roman army and the US Army.
                  You guys really are no fun at all

                  Carry on as you were then ….

                  High Admiral Snowy, Commander In Chief of the Naval Forces of The Phoenix Confederation.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Hey Mass, you are aware that the legions regularly extorted, deposed, and raised up emperors, aren't you? Surely you're not suggesting that US military personnel put their hands on the political scales, so to speak? That would be extremely unAmerican.

                    Heard it with Bill Clinton, Geo W Bush, and Barack Obama: snide insinuations that those commanders-in-chief were not worthy of the fine militaries which they'd inherited and commanded, and that it would not be beyond the pale if perhaps military personnel were willfully insubordinate, or even mutinous. Really now, this sh*t has got to stop. Before some dumb a$$ takes this crap seriously, please knock it off.
                    I was married for two ******* years! Hell would be like Club Med! - Sam Kinison

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                    • #11
                      That's not what I'm suggesting. Apparently nuance is not a common virtue on the forum.

                      The US armed forces don't engage in coups or any other form of 'change in government' and that is not what I'm suggesting or advocating, so get over yourself.

                      By the way, when some of the members here advocate or support or predict civil war in the US, have you commented on that? Put up or shut up.
                      We are not now that strength which in old days
                      Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
                      Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
                      To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        CNN is part of the circus that distracts the masses while people like the Bidens and Clintons get rich through political connections.
                        We hunt the hunters

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Massena View Post
                          You're not a student of military history now are you? You have that in common with Trump and that's not a compliment.
                          I am obviously a student of military history, any Marine worth his salt is a student of military history.

                          Obviously you can't control your TDS, get a grip.

                          You have more in common with Trump than anyone else on this forum. He tweets numerous nonsensical rants, you post numerous nonsensical threads......you are the same.
                          "I don't discuss sitting presidents," Mattis tells NPR in an interview. "I believe that you owe a period of quiet."

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Massena View Post
                            That's not what I'm suggesting. Apparently nuance is not a common virtue on the forum.

                            The US armed forces don't engage in coups or any other form of 'change in government' and that is not what I'm suggesting or advocating, so get over yourself.

                            By the way, when some of the members here advocate or support or predict civil war in the US, have you commented on that? Put up or shut up.
                            I have, in much the same manner. From those morons who deliberately missed movements because they felt that Barack Obama was a not a "natural US citizen," aka that birther crap, to Daily Kos who praised AL Guardsmen for refusing orders to transport fuel to bases in Iraq, the notion that any act of insubordination can be endowed with political gravitas -- whether by the serviceman himself or by third party political observers -- is reprehensible, and at its core unAmeican.

                            And that's what the phrase "beware the wrath of the legions" means: that the legions can make or break emperors, so emperors would do well to keep their legionaries happy. Your very choice of words insinuates that Pres Trump has something to fear from US military personnel. I'm sorry, but a veiled threat like that can't be ignored.
                            I was married for two ******* years! Hell would be like Club Med! - Sam Kinison

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Snowygerry View Post

                              I took it to be an interesting thread about the domestic cost/risk of the Roman legions and the parallels with the current US army ?

                              Who is this Trump you speak of ?
                              \
                              the family formerly known as 'dumpth'
                              \the ban on \Turkish steel is rather cosmetic. \turkey's capacity will be used up producing pipe for the new links to the Iraq\Syrian oil fields - not to mention bridges and construction rebar.
                              New Marshall riding in.....methinbks.... or the Ol' Ottoman being refurbished...
                              The trout who swims against the current gets the most oxygen..

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