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  • Does an American stockholder make more money...

    ...if the company he holds stock in has its manufacturing part located in China rather than the United States?
    {}

    "Any story sounds true until someone tells the other side and sets the record straight." -Proverbs 18:17

  • #2
    Originally posted by BorderRuffian View Post
    ...if the company he holds stock in has its manufacturing part located in China rather than the United States?
    Since return is based on the profits being made, and China offers cheaper goods and labor, I would guess that he does.
    Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes? Who is watching the watchers?

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Mountain Man View Post

      Since return is based on the profits being made, and China offers cheaper goods and labor, I would guess that he does.
      Check.

      No wonder the elites love those trade deals we've had with China the last several decades.

      And are the first to shout "global warming!" while leaving China exempt.
      {}

      "Any story sounds true until someone tells the other side and sets the record straight." -Proverbs 18:17

      Comment


      • #4
        For basic manufacturing, China is cheaper but the trade off is the potential for an aw$h!+ if the Chinese factory cuts corners to save on costs.
        For example, about 10 years ago, give or take, US Gypsum got slammed over their Chinese drywall factory products. Seems the factory was certified to make drywall to US standards for import. But, almost immediately after certification, the factory management started substituting cheaper ingredients and making short cuts to increase production while lowering costs.
        Most of this drywall ended up in homes in the US South to the tune of like 100,000 units. The result was these homes started having "sick house syndrome." That created a massive lawsuit against the company that only recently settled.

        https://www.washingtonpost.com/busin...?noredirect=on

        https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclope...cts-32402.html

        https://www.cpsc.gov/safety-educatio...oblem-drywall/

        Needless to say, this subsidiary of USG cost the parent company dearly in court costs, loss of confidence in their product, and eventually in paying to fix the problems created.

        Comment


        • #5
          Of course shareholders are going to benefit with increase in profits due to cheap labor/parts.

          Companies don't leave the US because of high taxes, they leave for lower wages and lower costs.

          Capitalism 101, profit first. Why else do you think Big Agriculture and republicans want more migrants to come into the US?

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by inevtiab1e View Post
            Of course shareholders are going to benefit with increase in profits due to cheap labor/parts.

            Companies don't leave the US because of high taxes, they leave for lower wages and lower costs.

            Capitalism 101, profit first. Why else do you think Big Agriculture and republicans want more migrants to come into the US?
            Actually, they leave for both reasons. Many large US corporations have massive amounts of cash stashed overseas to avoid high corporate taxes in the US.

            https://www.pbs.org/newshour/show/co...void-u-s-taxes

            https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...?noredirect=on

            Low end corporations, that is ones that need cheap labor at low wages to be competitive leave for that reason. But, if the product requires higher skill levels and commensurate pay, that isn't a driving reason.

            Another reason corporations leave for overseas is government regulation, particularly safety and environmental regulation. When I was stationed in Bahrain, I learned that US ships in the region often made port calls there to get painted. Why? Because for ships homeported on the US West coast (eg., California) the cost of doing this in the US was prohibitive due to California and federal environmental laws. So, they did it overseas.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
              For basic manufacturing, China is cheaper but the trade off is the potential for an aw$h!+ if the Chinese factory cuts corners to save on costs.
              For example, about 10 years ago, give or take, US Gypsum got slammed over their Chinese drywall factory products. Seems the factory was certified to make drywall to US standards for import. But, almost immediately after certification, the factory management started substituting cheaper ingredients and making short cuts to increase production while lowering costs.
              Most of this drywall ended up in homes in the US South to the tune of like 100,000 units. The result was these homes started having "sick house syndrome." That created a massive lawsuit against the company that only recently settled.

              https://www.washingtonpost.com/busin...?noredirect=on

              https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclope...cts-32402.html

              https://www.cpsc.gov/safety-educatio...oblem-drywall/

              Needless to say, this subsidiary of USG cost the parent company dearly in court costs, loss of confidence in their product, and eventually in paying to fix the problems created.
              Welcome to under controlled capitalism
              "Ask not what your country can do for you"

              Left wing, Right Wing same bird that they are killing.

              you’re entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
                For basic manufacturing, China is cheaper but the trade off is the potential for an aw$h!+ if the Chinese factory cuts corners to save on costs.
                For example, about 10 years ago, give or take, US Gypsum got slammed over their Chinese drywall factory products. Seems the factory was certified to make drywall to US standards for import. But, almost immediately after certification, the factory management started substituting cheaper ingredients and making short cuts to increase production while lowering costs.
                Most of this drywall ended up in homes in the US South to the tune of like 100,000 units. The result was these homes started having "sick house syndrome." That created a massive lawsuit against the company that only recently settled.

                https://www.washingtonpost.com/busin...?noredirect=on

                https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclope...cts-32402.html

                https://www.cpsc.gov/safety-educatio...oblem-drywall/

                Needless to say, this subsidiary of USG cost the parent company dearly in court costs, loss of confidence in their product, and eventually in paying to fix the problems created.
                Good point. I remember that case. Of course, the insurers had an excellent case against the Chinese company for not meeting specified standards, but those cases literally take forever, so the apparent answer seems to be maybe, depending on who one invests in.

                And of course now, with the trade tariffs, profits are not so good.

                Probably better to actually work for a living than gamble in the investment market.
                Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes? Who is watching the watchers?

                Comment


                • #9
                  The average Western consumer also bears much of the blame. $1.00 tube socks at Walmart have a hidden cost. We in the West have gotten used to cheap, disposable commodities on every day products. That requires low, low manufacturing costs . So that's were China et al come in. That's the consumerist trade-off: cheap goods means foreign manufacturing. A lot of people don't seem to make the connection between their desire to purchase household products at the lowest possible price and the disappearance of manufacturing jobs ....

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by BorderRuffian View Post
                    ...if the company he holds stock in has its manufacturing part located in China rather than the United States?
                    The US used to lead the world in steel production. I suppose back in those days the government and American industrialists were more pro American. Very interesting because generally the rich were richer in the American past and so was the middle class. We need to learn from the past
                    Long live the Lionheart! Please watch this video
                    https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=jRDwlR4zbEM
                    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3DBaY0RsxU
                    Accept the challenges so that you can feel the exhilaration of victory.

                    George S Patton

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by CarpeDiem View Post
                      The average Western consumer also bears much of the blame. $1.00 tube socks at Walmart have a hidden cost. We in the West have gotten used to cheap, disposable commodities on every day products. That requires low, low manufacturing costs . So that's were China et al come in. That's the consumerist trade-off: cheap goods means foreign manufacturing. A lot of people don't seem to make the connection between their desire to purchase household products at the lowest possible price and the disappearance of manufacturing jobs ....
                      Try this one on for size: "honey, I'd have gotten you that fat diamond ring for your birthday, but the money we're spending on 'Made in the USA' socks took too big a bite out of my checkbook. Hope this rinky-dink gift makes up for my economic patriotism" I'm no clairvoyant, but one thing is absolutely predictable: you ain't getting laid tonight.

                      Hey, if it wasn't for all those Chinamen working for mere pennies a day, how ever would we be able to enjoy this fine forum -- from an internet cafe?

                      To paraphrase a famous cliche, be careful what you b*tch about -- you might just lose it.
                      I was married for two ******* years! Hell would be like Club Med! - Sam Kinison

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by slick_miester View Post

                        Try this one on for size: "honey, I'd have gotten you that fat diamond ring for your birthday, but the money we're spending on 'Made in the USA' socks took too big a bite out of my checkbook. Hope this rinky-dink gift makes up for my economic patriotism" I'm no clairvoyant, but one thing is absolutely predictable: you ain't getting laid tonight.

                        Hey, if it wasn't for all those Chinamen working for mere pennies a day, how ever would we be able to enjoy this fine forum -- from an internet cafe?

                        To paraphrase a famous cliche, be careful what you b*tch about -- you might just lose it.
                        Exactly.....unfortunately many of the people shouting the loudest haven't made the connection. And trying to undo 30+ years of offshore manufacturing that has become the foundation of the modern Western consumer culture overnight....well good luck with that I say.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Stonewall_Jack View Post

                          The US used to lead the world in steel production. I suppose back in those days the government and American industrialists were more pro American. Very interesting because generally the rich were richer in the American past and so was the middle class. We need to learn from the past
                          Your hung up on steel , coal and auto productions. Come on buddy those days are really history and it's time you accept that.
                          Last edited by Half Pint John; 27 Aug 19, 11:03.
                          "Ask not what your country can do for you"

                          Left wing, Right Wing same bird that they are killing.

                          you’re entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by CarpeDiem View Post
                            The average Western consumer also bears much of the blame. $1.00 tube socks at Walmart have a hidden cost. We in the West have gotten used to cheap, disposable commodities on every day products. That requires low, low manufacturing costs . So that's were China et al come in. That's the consumerist trade-off: cheap goods means foreign manufacturing. A lot of people don't seem to make the connection between their desire to purchase household products at the lowest possible price and the disappearance of manufacturing jobs ....
                            Reducing the amount ordinary citizens pay for goods is the same as giving everyone a pay rise.
                            This in turn will enable them to spend on higher end goods produced in perhaps the US.

                            That is the logic. Low cost basic goods end up being made in low cost basic countries whereas high end products requiring skilled workers to produce are manufactured in advanced countries.
                            "To be free is better than to be unfree - always."

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Surrey View Post
                              Reducing the amount ordinary citizens pay for goods is the same as giving everyone a pay rise.
                              This in turn will enable them to spend on higher end goods produced in perhaps the US.
                              And you know going in that the last thing that socialists want is for Regular Joe's to enjoy a rising quality of life: it will cool their ardor for their inevitable revolution.

                              Originally posted by Surrey View Post
                              That is the logic. Low cost basic goods end up being made in low cost basic countries whereas high end products requiring skilled workers to produce are manufactured in advanced countries.
                              Except in England: they went from manufacturing Vincent Black Shadows and Norton Commandos and Sheffield Steel and Electric Jet Lightenings to living on the dole and rioting at Anfield and Stamford Bridge.

                              Rimshot
                              I was married for two ******* years! Hell would be like Club Med! - Sam Kinison

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