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  • [QUOTE=Massena;

    Your constant jibber jabber about party politics and continual denigration of US intelligence services and other institutions is getting old and is rubbish.[/QUOTE]
    You mean like Peter Strzok and his Girlfriend the FBI Lawyer?

    Trying hard to be the Man, that my Dog believes I am!

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Trung Si View Post
      You mean like Peter Strzok and his Girlfriend the FBI Lawyer?
      Amazing that he complained about me bringing up party politics,.
      I have no illusions about the need for intelligence agencies, it's the corruption and politicization of any intelligence agency that I oppose.
      Every bearucracy has the potential for political abuse,. The FBI, IRS and the CIA have been used by politicians for nefarious ends.
      Dispite our best intentions, the system is dysfunctional that intelligence failure is guaranteed.
      Russ Travers, CIA analyst, 2001

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Urban hermit View Post

        Amazing that he complained about me bringing up party politics,.
        I have no illusions about the need for intelligence agencies, it's the corruption and politicization of any intelligence agency that I oppose.
        Every bearucracy has the potential for political abuse,. The FBI, IRS and the CIA have been used by politicians for nefarious ends.
        The Democrats are largely to blame for it. Though McCain shares some of the guilt.

        (Washington, DC) – Judicial Watch today released newly obtained internal IRS documents, including material revealing that Sen. John McCain’s former staff director and chief counsel on the Senate Homeland Security Permanent Subcommittee, Henry Kerner, urged top IRS officials, including then-director of exempt organizations Lois Lerner, to “audit so many that it becomes financially ruinous.” Kerner was appointed by President Trump as Special Counsel for the United States Office of Special Counsel.

        The explosive exchange was contained in notes taken by IRS employees at an April 30, 2013, meeting between Kerner, Lerner, and other high-ranking IRS officials. Just ten days following the meeting, former IRS director of exempt organizations Lois Lerner admitted that the IRS had a policy of improperly and deliberately delaying applications for tax-exempt status from conservative non-profit groups.

        Lerner and other IRS officials met with select top staffers from the Senate Governmental Affairs Committee in a “marathon” meeting to discuss concerns raised by both Sen. Carl Levin (D-MI) and Sen. John McCain (R-AZ) that the IRS was not reining in political advocacy groups in response to the Supreme Court’s Citizens United decision. Senator McCain had been the chief sponsor of the McCain-Feingold Act and called the Citizens United decision, which overturned portions of the Act, one of the “worst decisions I have ever seen.”

        In the full notes of an April 30 meeting, McCain’s high-ranking staffer Kerner recommends harassing non-profit groups until they are unable to continue operating. Kerner tells Lerner, Steve Miller, then chief of staff to IRS commissioner, Nikole Flax, and other IRS officials, “Maybe the solution is to audit so many that it is financially ruinous.” In response, Lerner responded that “it is her job to oversee it all:”

        Henry Kerner asked how to get to the abuse of organizations claiming section 501 (c)(4) but designed to be primarily political. Lois Lerner said the system works, but not in real time. Henry Kerner noted that these organizations don’t disclose donors. Lois Lerner said that if they don’t meet the requirements, we can come in and revoke, but it doesn’t happen timely. Nan Marks said if the concern is that organizations engaging in this activity don’t disclose donors, then the system doesn’t work. Henry Kerner said that maybe the solution is to audit so many that it is financially ruinous. Nikole noted that we have budget constraints. Elise Bean suggested using the list of organizations that made independent expenditures. Lois Lerner said that it is her job to oversee it all, not just political campaign activity.

        Judicial Watch previously reported on the 2013 meeting. Senator McCain then issued a statement decrying “false reports claiming that his office was somehow involved in IRS targeting of conservative groups.” The IRS previously blacked out the notes of the meeting but Judicial Watch found the notes among subsequent documents released by the agency.

        Judicial Watch separately uncovered that Lerner was under significant pressure from both Democrats in Congress and the Obama DOJ and FBI to prosecute and jail the groups the IRS was already improperly targeting. In discussing pressure from Senator Sheldon Whitehouse (Democrat-Rhode Island) to prosecute these “political groups,” Lerner admitted, “it is ALL about 501(c)(4) orgs and political activity.”

        The April 30, 2013 meeting came just under two weeks prior to Lerner’s admission during an ABA meeting that the IRS had “inappropriately” targeted conservative groups. In her May 2013 answer to a planted question, in which she admitted to the “absolutely incorrect, insensitive, and inappropriate” targeting of Tea Party and conservative groups, Lerner suggested the IRS targeting occurred due to an “uptick” in 501 (c)(4) applications to the IRS but in actuality, there had been a decrease in such applications in 2010.

        On May 14, 2013, a report by Treasury Inspector General for Tax Administration revealed: “Early in Calendar Year 2010, the IRS began using inappropriate criteria to identify organizations applying for tax-exempt status” (e.g., lists of past and future donors). The illegal IRS reviews continued “for more than 18 months” and “delayed processing of targeted groups’ applications” in advance of the 2012 presidential election.

        All these documents were forced out of the IRS as a result of an October 2013 Judicial Watch Freedom of Information (FOIA) lawsuit filed against the IRS after it failed to respond adequately to four FOIA requests sent in May 2013 (Judicial Watch, Inc. v. Internal Revenue Service (No. 1:13-cv-01559)). Judicial Watch is seeking:
        • All records related to the number of applications received or related to communications between the IRS and members of the U.S. House of Representatives or the U.S. Senate regarding the review process for organizations applying for tax exempt status under 501(c)(4);
        • All records concerning communications between the IRS and the Executive Branch or any other government agency regarding the review process for organizations applying for tax exempt status under 501(c)(4);
        • Copies of any questionnaires and all records related to the preparation of questionnaires sent to organizations applying for 501(c)(4) tax exempt status.
        • All records related to Lois Lerner’s communication with other IRS employees, as well as government or private entity outside the IRS regarding the review and approval process for 501 (c)(4) applicant organizations.

        More here. https://www.judicialwatch.org/press-...ous-targeting/

        But there's one person who claims it's all false and La, la, la.
        Credo quia absurdum.


        Quantum mechanics describes nature as absurd from the point of view of common sense. And yet it fully agrees with experiment. So I hope you can accept nature as She is - absurd! - Richard Feynman

        Comment


        • With all the lies being thrown around in a thread that seems made for them from the start, I would like certain people to see something on that subject... and maybe think about this?


          "Why is the Rum gone?"

          -Captain Jack

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Massena View Post

            What?

            The issue is taking information from a foreign state for use in an election against your opponent. Did you not read the OP?
            Wouldn't you listen if your were running for some office in Government and someone started telling you about the skeletons in your opponent's closet?

            Did you not hear the end where Trump would report it if certain things were not right?

            What about the Hillary campaign where such information was actively sought after from the Russians?

            Just listening, or actively seeking then acting upon such information, is like comparing apples to oranges.

            As usual, the TDS media, along with a TDS Pelosi and all of her TDS radical friends have tried to blow the story way out of proportions and failed.
            “Breaking News,”

            “Something irrelevant in your life just happened and now we are going to blow it all out of proportion for days to keep you distracted from what's really going on.”

            Comment


            • Originally posted by SRV Ron View Post

              Wouldn't you listen if your were running for some office in Government and someone started telling you about the skeletons in your opponent's closet?
              No I would not.

              Not if it was from a foreign government or foreign agency, especially a foreign intelligence agency. That is against the law. I would immediately report it to the FBI.

              When I was in the service, and especially overseas or stationed in Washington DC, we were told to report any foreign contacts, period. That's just what you do. 'If you see something, say something.'
              Last edited by Massena; 16 Jun 19, 07:05.
              We are not now that strength which in old days
              Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
              Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
              To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

              Comment


              • Revolving Door: Ellen L. Weintraub,

                https://www.opensecrets.org/revolvin...y.php?id=76126
                Dispite our best intentions, the system is dysfunctional that intelligence failure is guaranteed.
                Russ Travers, CIA analyst, 2001

                Comment


                • Weintraub was first hired by the law firm of Cahill, Gordon, and Reindel,
                  Here is a summary of that law agencies political lobbying, where did they invest in politicians? Look for yourself

                  https://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/top...227&cycle=2018
                  Dispite our best intentions, the system is dysfunctional that intelligence failure is guaranteed.
                  Russ Travers, CIA analyst, 2001

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Massena

                    Civil servants work for the US government no matter which political party is in power. If you have proof or evidence that they do not, then post it.

                    Your constant jibber jabber about party politics and continual denigration of US intelligence services and other institutions is getting old and is rubbish.
                    Actually, they work for the US Citizens, whom the government exists to serve.
                    Like you, too many of them "forget" that and think things are the opposite; the people exist to serve the guv'mint, and it's hired hands.

                    Comment


                    • A SERIES OF POSTS FROM A VARIETY OF POSTERS WHERE REMOVED AS THEY ADDED NOTHING TO THE THREAD, CONSISTING MOSTLY OF DIGS AT OTHER FORUM MEMBERS. FURTHER POSTS OF THIS TYPE WILL ALSO BE REMOVED AND FURTHER SANCTIONS SUCH AS THREAD LOCK OR CURTAILMENT OF POSTING PRIVILEGES WILL OCCUR.
                      THANK YOU
                      ACG STAFF

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by G David Bock View Post

                        Actually, they work for the US Citizens, whom the government exists to serve.
                        Like you, too many of them "forget" that and think things are the opposite; the people exist to serve the guv'mint, and it's hired hands.
                        They serve the nation and take their oath of service to the US Constitution. Since that is the oath of service I took, I haven't forgotten anything. The libertarian propaganda that you post is interesting, but it is just that-propaganda.
                        We are not now that strength which in old days
                        Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
                        Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
                        To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

                        Comment


                        • Trump has the right to use any information we deems necessary. Freedom of speech.
                          There are no Nazis in Ukraine. © Idiots

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Massena View Post

                            They serve the nation and take their oath of service to the US Constitution. Since that is the oath of service I took, I haven't forgotten anything. The libertarian propaganda that you post is interesting, but it is just that-propaganda.
                            And counter-point to your socialist propaganda.

                            I know they take an oath, but that doesn't ensure objectivity or political neutrality when doing their job. Where subjective bias can be applied it often is and reflective of their political leanings. I've noticed this over the decades in my dealings and encounters with such guv'mint workers and my oldest son, whom works for Immigration has noticed that also, where a majority of his co-workers lean Left of center in their politics. Also, most seem there more for the pay-n-benefits, and securing their retirement, than serving the good of the nation and it's citizens.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Massena View Post
                              President Donald Trump says he would listen if a foreign government approached him with damaging information about a political rival -- and wouldn't necessarily report the contact to the FBI.'
                              I see where Trump says he would listen to it but I don't see where he said he would use it as the title of this thread says.

                              My opinion; there is a difference between listening to and using the information.

                              I guess the best way to show the difference would be uaing the last election.

                              The DNC paid for the Steele Dossier, had they listened to the findings and not used it as part of the FISA process.......no problem. But the administration didn't, the used that dossier plus some Intel from a foreign country to spy on an American citizen.

                              Again, if he said he would use the info that is one thing but listening to it? .......no big deal.
                              "I don't discuss sitting presidents," Mattis tells NPR in an interview. "I believe that you owe a period of quiet."

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Emtos View Post
                                Trump has the right to use any information we deems necessary. Freedom of speech.
                                Not if it is obtained from foreign governments or intelligence services. That is against US law. It has nothing to do with freedom of speech.
                                We are not now that strength which in old days
                                Moved earth and heaven; that which we are we are; One equal temper of heroic hearts
                                Made weak by time and fate but strong in will
                                To strive to seek to find and not to yield.

                                Comment

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