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  • Democrats do something on illegal immigrants

    The Democrats have passed a bill in the house giving permanent legal status to the roughly 2 million DACA eligible illegals in the US. Cost estimates are $30 billion. No wall. No help on the border. Nothing on getting those illegally here out. Just a bill to let a big block of them jump the immigration line and stay. Open borders anyone?

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...cid=spartanntp

  • #2
    It won't pass.
    "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
    - Benjamin Franklin

    The new right wing: hate Muslims, preaches tolerance for Nazis.

    Comment


    • #3
      A typical Democrat tactic to shame the Republicans and try to make them look heartless and evil. They know full well it will go nowhere in the Senate. Now we wait and see if the Republicans fall into the trap laid for them.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Nikki View Post
        Republicans and try to make them look heartless and evil.
        But they do that on their own.
        "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
        - Benjamin Franklin

        The new right wing: hate Muslims, preaches tolerance for Nazis.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by TactiKill J. View Post

          But they do that on their own.
          Sure the Democrats do, shameful.
          My worst jump story:
          My 13th jump was on the 13th day of the month, aircraft number 013.
          As recorded on my DA Form 1307 Individual Jump Log.
          No lie.

          ~
          "Everything looks all right. Have a good jump, eh."
          -2 Commando Jumpmaster

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by TactiKill J. View Post
            It won't pass.
            I agree, but that's not the point. It's what the Democrats are focused on:

            Open borders
            Doing nothing to stop the flood of unvetted migrants, criminals, immigrants, etc.
            Wanting to give all these illegal, criminal entrants citizenship.

            What the Democrats seemingly want more, and more, is to flood the US with people from loser nations (aka $h!+holes) made that way by decades of heavy handed Socialism, dictators, economic incompetence, corruption, and greed and have them vote to bring the same $h!+ here.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by TactiKill J. View Post

              But they do that on their own.
              How do they "do that on their own"?
              "I don't discuss sitting presidents," Mattis tells NPR in an interview. "I believe that you owe a period of quiet."

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
                The Democrats have passed a bill in the house giving permanent legal status to the roughly 2 million DACA eligible illegals in the US. Cost estimates are $30 billion. No wall. No help on the border. Nothing on getting those illegally here out. Just a bill to let a big block of them jump the immigration line and stay. Open borders anyone?

                https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...cid=spartanntp

                The most Anti American thing some(not all) Trump supporters have done wrt this conversation, is when some Trumpers say that Mexicans, Jews, Muslims or blacks are more dangerous compared to white Christians. Truth is crime is a worldwide issue. The whole basis of the anti immigrant argument is based on intolerance, that the immigrant is violent and uneducated and will somehow make the USA more dangerous. Btw, Im presenting a common sense immigration policy that most conservatives, the likes of Reagan would agree with.

                We are not Communist North Korea, Israel or Saudi Arabia. We are the USA and many Americans feel the duty to help others even if they are not the majority religion.

                Cost estimates for illegal immigrants are overcome by the massive amounts of money that the illegal immigrants will bring the USA through work and paying for goods. All the more reason to make illegal immigrants into citizens.

                As for Help on the border? Well it can be a tricky issue. Cops everywhere could use help... Crime occurs everyday in the USA. We got 4000 violent burglaries a day in the USA. And some of the Trumpers want to mega concentrate on one or two Mexican or South American criminals that have attacked white American women. We all know how some Trumpers play the race card game.



                Thousands of women get beat, thousands robbed, people get killed everyday in the USA by non illegals. The Cops can get help, but that does not mean we have to turn away people that have already made a heroic and perilous journey to get themselves and there children to a better place such as the USA.

                It makes sense to bring more people to the USA especially if they are good Christians from South America, these are family oriented people and with every group of course you have a few criminals. It makes no difference having an extra 2 million illegals in the USA, we might as well make it so 4 million people can become US citizens over night. You would probably need something like 500 million more illegals to actually see some kind of negative difference in the USA. Our country can take on many people. We are still far behind China and India in terms of our population. No open borders though, thats a different discussion.
                Long live the Lionheart! Please watch this video
                https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=jRDwlR4zbEM
                https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3DBaY0RsxU
                Accept the challenges so that you can feel the exhilaration of victory.

                George S Patton

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Stonewall_Jack View Post


                  The most Anti American thing some(not all) Trump supporters have done wrt this conversation, is when some Trumpers say that Mexicans, Jews, Muslims or blacks are more dangerous compared to white Christians. Truth is crime is a worldwide issue. The whole basis of the anti immigrant argument is based on intolerance, that the immigrant is violent and uneducated and will somehow make the USA more dangerous. Btw, Im presenting a common sense immigration policy that most conservatives, the likes of Reagan would agree with.

                  We are not Communist North Korea, Israel or Saudi Arabia. We are the USA and many Americans feel the duty to help others even if they are not the majority religion.

                  Cost estimates for illegal immigrants are overcome by the massive amounts of money that the illegal immigrants will bring the USA through work and paying for goods. All the more reason to make illegal immigrants into citizens.

                  As for Help on the border? Well it can be a tricky issue. Cops everywhere could use help... Crime occurs everyday in the USA. We got 4000 violent burglaries a day in the USA. And some of the Trumpers want to mega concentrate on one or two Mexican or South American criminals that have attacked white American women. We all know how some Trumpers play the race card game.



                  Thousands of women get beat, thousands robbed, people get killed everyday in the USA by non illegals. The Cops can get help, but that does not mean we have to turn away people that have already made a heroic and perilous journey to get themselves and there children to a better place such as the USA.

                  It makes sense to bring more people to the USA especially if they are good Christians from South America, these are family oriented people and with every group of course you have a few criminals. It makes no difference having an extra 2 million illegals in the USA, we might as well make it so 4 million people can become US citizens over night. You would probably need something like 500 million more illegals to actually see some kind of negative difference in the USA. Our country can take on many people. We are still far behind China and India in terms of our population. No open borders though, thats a different discussion.
                  Other than this being mostly a red herring argument presented in part as a strawman--
                  Digression: I brought up nothing about where any illegals are from, their race or religion. I simply pointed out they broke the law to get into the US and remain here, often breaking a whole raft of additional laws to get jobs, etc., and that the Democrats are clearly fine with that and want them to become full citizens ahead of those who tried to get here legally--

                  Anyway, it isn't "a few criminals." Over the years on this board alone there have been posted plenty of studies and findings that the majority-- yes a majority-- of illegal immigrants have one or more criminal charge be it a misdemeanor or felony against them. The average found in one government study of over 100,000 found the average is seven (7) criminal charges. Illegal reentry for example (eg., being deported and illegally reentering) is common and a felony.

                  Top that off that the two thirds (roughly) of illegals have less than an 8th grade education, and about half of those less than a 6th grade education, makes them largely worthless to the US as highly productive workers. We don't need millions of additional basic laborers.

                  The population of China and India, or anywhere else is no counter argument either. That's just presenting a logical fallacy (appeal to popularity or commonality).

                  Even the costs of illegals is arguably not worth it. In federal prisons about a third of their population is illegals there entirely for felonies. Illegals commit more crime. The often trotted out "Immigrants commit less crime" conflates legal and illegal immigration diluting the illegal crime rate. In states, like Arizona, that bother to track illegals in their criminal system, the rate of crime is about double that of legal immigrants or citizens and those illegals are 70% more likely to have committed a violent crime.

                  We are not Communist North Korea, Israel or Saudi Arabia. We are the USA and many Americans feel the duty to help others even if they are not the majority religion.
                  This is just a moralistic fallacy. The US has no "duty" to take anybody from anywhere and I'd think we'd be even less inclined to want to take in a person who committed a crime to get here, then committed more to try and stay.

                  Basically, there is little or no reason for the US to tolerate or accept illegal, criminal, immigration. If we need laborers, we should restart a program to vet and then allow such on temporary visas to work here then go home.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Why is it a bad thing to secure your border? I don't see how anyone can have a problem with stopping people just arriving in your country.
                    The real issue is what border you are trying to secure. Most illegals in the USA arrive by air and arrive legally. They just overstay their visa.
                    I'd also like to know why white Europeans who are there illegally are called "undocumented" whereas people with dark skin are "illegal immigrants".
                    The accusation levelled at Trump is that he is playing to a populist and racist agenda. The fact that he is ignoring the majority of illegals and concentrating on those crossing the land border with Mexico does suggest that there is some merit in that accusation.
                    Given the polarised nature of the American Media it is hard to unpick the multiple issues here, with the camps being divided into the "Keep out the wetbacks/ you're a racist" group and the "Open borders, let them all in/ you're a liberal commie snowflake traitor" group.

                    Is there a voice of rationality below the ideological noise?
                    "The thing about quotes on the internet is that you cannot confirm their
                    validity." - Abraham Lincoln.
                    "Nothing's going to change while one side it lying about the cause and the other is lying about the solution" - Me

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by E.D. Morel View Post
                      Why is it a bad thing to secure your border? I don't see how anyone can have a problem with stopping people just arriving in your country.
                      The real issue is what border you are trying to secure. Most illegals in the USA arrive by air and arrive legally. They just overstay their visa.
                      That's about a third. The other two-thirds cross into the US from Mexico mostly.

                      I'd also like to know why white Europeans who are there illegally are called "undocumented" whereas people with dark skin are "illegal immigrants".
                      I don't differentiate. They're all illegals in my view. Somebody I know in Sierra Vista called a "Green and White Taxi" (aka the Border Patrol) for an Italian that had crossed the border onto his property. Had trouble understanding him at first Italian not being Spanish but kind of similar...


                      The accusation levelled at Trump is that he is playing to a populist and racist agenda. The fact that he is ignoring the majority of illegals and concentrating on those crossing the land border with Mexico does suggest that there is some merit in that accusation.
                      Given that most are crossing from Mexico-- including a group of over 1000 caught near El Paso two days ago-- the largest single group in history-- I'd say getting the Southern border under control is a big issue and that will eliminate the largest chunk coming over in mass.




                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by E.D. Morel View Post
                        Why is it a bad thing to secure your border? I don't see how anyone can have a problem with stopping people just arriving in your country.
                        The real issue is what border you are trying to secure. Most illegals in the USA arrive by air and arrive legally. They just overstay their visa.
                        I'd also like to know why white Europeans who are there illegally are called "undocumented" whereas people with dark skin are "illegal immigrants".
                        Sh*tload of Micks in Woodlawn, Bronx, and Woodside, Queens, here illegally. The lasses work as au pairs, and the bhoys drink and beat each other brainless on the hurling pitch every weekend at van Cortland Park. Good fun all around . . . .

                        Originally posted by E.D. Morel View Post
                        The accusation levelled at Trump is that he is playing to a populist and racist agenda. The fact that he is ignoring the majority of illegals and concentrating on those crossing the land border with Mexico does suggest that there is some merit in that accusation.
                        You damn with faint praise, sir.

                        Originally posted by E.D. Morel View Post
                        Given the polarised nature of the American Media it is hard to unpick the multiple issues here, with the camps being divided into the "Keep out the wetbacks/ you're a racist" group and the "Open borders, let them all in/ you're a liberal commie snowflake traitor" group.

                        Is there a voice of rationality below the ideological noise?
                        Ah . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . no. To try to maintain a reasonable middle ground -- "order on the border is imperative, but that does not cast all Latinos as potential hardened criminals" -- gets one castigated from both camps. Both sides are playing this all or nothing game, and frankly it's turning my stomach. The only way to fit in with either extreme is to talk real loud, and real stupid, and ad nauseam.
                        I was married for two ******* years! Hell would be like Club Med! - Sam Kinison

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by slick_miester View Post

                          Sh*tload of Micks in Woodlawn, Bronx, and Woodside, Queens, here illegally. The lasses work as au pairs, and the bhoys drink and beat each other brainless on the hurling pitch every weekend at van Cortland Park. Good fun all around . . . .
                          Yes, we've been sending the dregs there for year now, sorry about that.


                          Originally posted by slick_miester View Post
                          Ah . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . no. To try to maintain a reasonable middle ground -- "order on the border is imperative, but that does not cast all Latinos as potential hardened criminals" -- gets one castigated from both camps. Both sides are playing this all or nothing game, and frankly it's turning my stomach. The only way to fit in with either extreme is to talk real loud, and real stupid, and ad nauseam.
                          LOL

                          "The thing about quotes on the internet is that you cannot confirm their
                          validity." - Abraham Lincoln.
                          "Nothing's going to change while one side it lying about the cause and the other is lying about the solution" - Me

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by E.D. Morel View Post
                            Yes, we've been sending the dregs there for year now, sorry about that.
                            Yeah, my silly Armagh ancestors wanted something more on the menu besides small white potatoes, boiled cabbage, curdled milk, and room temperature beer.

                            I don't think that you realize how ridiculous the immigration and border security debate has become. It's distilled into nothing but pure mindless invective, 'round the clock. When d*ckheads like this:



                            get a seat at the table shaping immigration and security policy, then you know we're in trouble.
                            I was married for two ******* years! Hell would be like Club Med! - Sam Kinison

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post

                              That's about a third. The other two-thirds cross into the US from Mexico mostly.
                              Not according the the US Department of Homeland Security
                              "The thing about quotes on the internet is that you cannot confirm their
                              validity." - Abraham Lincoln.
                              "Nothing's going to change while one side it lying about the cause and the other is lying about the solution" - Me

                              Comment

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