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  • MarkV
    replied
    With berks like this around burn burn burn

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-...ng-us-wildfire

    Leave a comment:


  • Massena
    replied

    Leave a comment:


  • Duncan
    replied
    They just need more rakes.

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  • Half Pint John
    replied
    Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post

    Not where the CCC operates:

    California land under federal control:



    The California Coastal Commission boundaries:



    Location of Malibu:



    Malibu lies within the jurisdiction of the CCC and nowhere near any federal land.
    No were near...are you a 2nd LT? NPS shown in Green controls the land from Malibu east into Los Angles Country and looks like a small parcel of DoD land as well.

    Leave a comment:


  • Half Pint John
    replied
    Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post

    Not where the CCC operates:

    California land under federal control:



    The California Coastal Commission boundaries:



    Location of Malibu:



    Malibu lies within the jurisdiction of the CCC and nowhere near any federal land.
    An Paradise?

    Leave a comment:


  • JustAGuy
    replied
    Originally posted by G David Bock View Post

    I grew up in a logging community in Cascade foothills. I know loggers and forest fire fighters. I know more about what I'm talking about than you or the other yahoos posting here.
    Good. Then you will know how to split a second growth Doug Fir for firewood using only two axes. The old logger I worked for showed me how. Never could run the skidder properly. Not enough practice I guess.

    Leave a comment:


  • JustAGuy
    replied
    Originally posted by G David Bock View Post

    There are numerous forms of logging and "band logging" is same as "strip logging";
    ....
    U.S. Forest Service usage. A clearcutting system variation in which the logging operation removes all merchantable timber from areas that run through a stand and are usually of a width equal to one or two times the general stand height. ...
    https://agclass.nal.usda.gov/mtwdk.e...92&n=1&s=5&t=2
    ...
    • Strip clearcut – removal of all the stems in a row (strip), usually placed perpendicular to the prevailing winds in order to minimize the possibility of windthrow.[10]
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clearcutting
    ....
    Image result for strip logging


    Which one? I worked part time for an independent logger one summer logging in the W. Cascades along the upper Skagit and "Stilly." Maybe we stumbled across each other at some point? Terrible what happened at Oso. I knew people who lived there. Good lord the falls at the base of White Horse Mtn. were gorgeous. I still miss going there.

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  • T. A. Gardner
    replied
    Originally posted by Half Pint John View Post
    As has been pointed out a lot of that forest land is under Fed control. The same fed that has cut back on funding for just such things.
    Not where the CCC operates:

    California land under federal control:



    The California Coastal Commission boundaries:



    Location of Malibu:



    Malibu lies within the jurisdiction of the CCC and nowhere near any federal land.

    Leave a comment:


  • The Exorcist
    replied
    Originally posted by G David Bock View Post

    I grew up in a logging community in Cascade foothills. I know loggers and forest fire fighters. I know more about what I'm talking about than you or the other yahoos posting here.
    Howdy neighbor, and I will back you up on all of that. The truth is, strangling the logging industry and the 'let it burn' policy of the clipboard-dragging fools that think they know better than everyone else has resulted in one disaster after another. Neither they nor their supporters are capable of admitting they were mistaken about anything, ever. In fact, as was the case with the aristocrats of old, it appears that they only thing that could change their moribund minds about anything is a bullet through the brain.
    Every August, the smoke is so think here that sports teams have to go 200 miles away to have a game, property values have plummeted as health risks go through the roof. PIcs from here make downtown Beijing look GOOD.
    But no, how can there be any problem? Must be Global Warming! Logging can only be baaaaaad, (unless its in Canada) so shut up!!!!

    Maybe they are just trying to smoke out everyone that would dare to live in a rural area, its all just Rednecks after all....


    https://psmag.com/environment/only-a...t-forest-fires




    But I want to ask you to look at Google Maps, for another issue that bothers me. Look at the Skyway, the main road in and out of Paradise Ca.
    Its a 4-lane road, except where it is passing through the town. There it is bottle-necked down to 2 lanes, with those bump-outs and all sorts of crap to slow things down. Concrete pots weighing a couple of tons help enforce this "traffic calming" madness, with a sprinkling of flowers thrown in to make it seem less like an obstacle.
    But an obstacle is what it turned out to be, when an emergency came crashing down on them.
    I wonder how many of the dozens of people killed by the fire are dead because of that garbage and nonsense....
    Guess who it is that forced that policy on the rest of us?

    And kudos for using sources, unlike EVERYONE that is talking non-stop smack on this thread.

    Leave a comment:


  • Half Pint John
    replied
    th?id=OIP.eJkPvCe85zXZD2E3ly0yRwHaE6&w=300&h=199&c=7&o=5&pid=1.7.jpgIs that supposed to be a fire break between the trees?

    Leave a comment:


  • Half Pint John
    replied
    As has been pointed out a lot of that forest land is under Fed control. The same fed that has cut back on funding for just such things.

    Leave a comment:


  • T. A. Gardner
    replied
    Originally posted by Half Pint John View Post

    GOD, Malibu did not burn to the ground, bigly false hyperbole
    It's called an exaggeration. But, my point stands. The CCC is a major roadblock to getting the problem of excess brush solved. They make it nearly impossible for an average homeowner to do anything to protect their home from brush fires.

    Now, it is true in the case of say the Camp fire, that the CCC doesn't play a role, but it is this sort of thing throughout California that prevents reasonable management of forests and other land.

    Leave a comment:


  • Half Pint John
    replied
    Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post
    Here's what PG&E had to go through with the California Coastal Commission to clear some brush:

    https://documents.coastal.ca.gov/rep...017-report.pdf








    This is 30 pages of requirements and restrictions on what PG&E can, cannot, or must do to clear some brush along their power transmission lines.

    It took them over a month to get a hearing as well. This is why Malibu burned to the ground.
    GOD, Malibu did not burn to the ground, bigly false hyperbole

    Leave a comment:


  • Half Pint John
    replied
    Originally posted by G David Bock View Post

    I grew up in a logging community in Cascade foothills. I know loggers and forest fire fighters. I know more about what I'm talking about than you or the other yahoos posting here.
    Well many of the things you suggest looks like beans and bacon. I grew up in a steel town, but can't make steel.

    Leave a comment:


  • T. A. Gardner
    replied
    Here's what PG&E had to go through with the California Coastal Commission to clear some brush:

    https://documents.coastal.ca.gov/rep...017-report.pdf

    PRIOR TO THE COMMENCEMENT OF PROJECT ACTIVITIES, the Permittee shall appoint one or more Biologists to implement mitigation measures of the approved project. The Biologist(s) are to be approved by the Executive Director and must meet the following minimum qualifications: (1) At least a bachelor’s degree in biological sciences, zoology, botany, ecology, or a closely related field; (2) At least three years of experience in field biology or current certification through a nationally recognized biological society, such as the Ecological Society of America or The Wildlife Society; and, (3) At least one year of field experience with biological resources found in or near the project area. The Biologist(s) shall be responsible for conducting pre-project surveys and on-site monitoring and overseeing the implementation of all mitigation measures as described in Special Conditions 3, 4, 5 and 6.
    All project activities shall occur outside of the bird breeding season (February 15 through August 31)
    A. Restoration Requirements: The Mitigation Plan shall provide for the following: (1) Restoration of at least 3.45 acres of riparian woodland or scrub habitat, including a minimum of 249 native riparian trees, to compensate for the clearing of the clearing of 1.15 acres of these habitats and removal of 83 trees under the proposed project; (2) Restoration of 0.22 acres of freshwater or estuarine wetland habitat to compensate for the clearing of 0.055 acres of these habitats; (3) Planting of at least 385 native conifer trees to compensate for the removal of large trees under the proposed project.
    The following AMMs shall be implemented for projects that are adjacent to or intersect a waterway:
    • Climber crews shall cut vegetation into manageable pieces and swing/lower wood safely to the ground without disturbing the bed, bank, or channel.
    • Cut vegetation shall not be dragged through the bed, bank, or channel of a waterway.
    • Any woody debris left on-site shall not be placed within the bank of a wetland, stream, or other waterway.
    • Material shall not be chipped within the bed, bank or channel of a wetland, stream, or other waterway.
    • No work shall occur within the wetted portion of the waterway, and no material shall enter the waterway.
    • Trees shall be directionally felled away from any watercourse only if located at the top of bank. • No chainsaws or other equipment shall be refueled within 100 feet of a wetland, stream, or other waterway.
    • When broadcasting chipped material, it may not enter the bed, bank or channel and shall be directed away from streams, wetland, or riparian habitats.
    • Operations and equipment-use within any wetland, stream, or other waterway shall be limited to the following within the project area:
    o Work shall be performed with hand crews only.
    o Access to the work areas shall be by foot only.
    o No heavy equipment (e.g., access vehicle, truck-towed chipper) shall occur or operate within 25 feet.
    o No mastication within the bed, bank, or channel shall occur.
    o No stump grinding shall occur.
    • No herbicide (including aquatic-approved) shall be used within a wetland, stream, or other waterway
    This is 30 pages of requirements and restrictions on what PG&E can, cannot, or must do to clear some brush along their power transmission lines.

    It took them over a month to get a hearing as well. This is why Malibu burned to the ground.

    Leave a comment:

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