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  • #16
    Originally posted by craven View Post

    ok so I reading this and going um under Obama we had lower defeicts

    the 1 trillion dollars was not wasted and actually kept the economy alive. (could it of been more wisely sure)
    Much of it was wasted. Putting in make work and stuff that would never make an ROI means the money borrowed was wasted. For example, here in Arizona, the "Stimulus" paid for decoration and art at Phoenix light rail stops, on retaining walls and overpasses on I 10 in Tucson, and the like. That stuff has ZERO future value. Putting a doorbell on every house in some town in Mississippi has ZERO ROI.
    It didn't do much, if anything for the economy. If anything, the so-called stimulus actually slowed the recovery by pulling huge amounts of money out of the economy and letting the government redirect it into idiot projects and special interests. And, of course, there was squirrelly accounting at every turn to make this disaster look better. For example, a contractor I know who does concrete got parts of three contracts for barrier walls on local interstate highways then under construction. He hired 3 new workers, but the government counted them as 9 because they were on three projects / contracts. Weirdly, the work he was to do was scheduled out further in the future in any case so all the stimulus did was move up the finish date. It didn't add anything to the economy, but it did spend money borrowed now for money that would have been available in the future. And, the 3 workers were laid off once the contracts were complete.

    Trump has blow almost 1 trillion dollars on an economy that was already running at peak performance.
    How do you figure that?

    Any chance of fixing any of the issues you site got blown away by the Tax give away trump did.
    I think come January we'll see his lowering of taxes actually increased revenues or was close to revenue neutral through economic expansion and additional taxes paid by people now employed and companies doing more stuff. Yes, higher taxes can actually lower revenues.

    You forget Obama did improve border security (dragged by the Repbulicans though)
    I think on this issue Obama overall did less. For example, Holder ended many sector's catch and hold programs where any illegal caught crossing got tossed in jail until they went to trial and were then deported. Holder made them go back to catch and release. That is, they get caught, arraigned. are released in the US to await trial, and they never bother to show up. Then there was "Fast and Furious."
    Janet "Nappy" Napolitano was particularly bad as Secretary of Homeland security. Remember her? On the whole, a complicit MSM helped sweep all of the Obama administration's lapses on security and border control under the rug.



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    • #17
      Originally posted by T. A. Gardner View Post

      Much of it was wasted. Putting in make work and stuff that would never make an ROI means the money borrowed was wasted. For example, here in Arizona, the "Stimulus" paid for decoration and art at Phoenix light rail stops, on retaining walls and overpasses on I 10 in Tucson, and the like. That stuff has ZERO future value. Putting a doorbell on every house in some town in Mississippi has ZERO ROI.
      It didn't do much, if anything for the economy. If anything, the so-called stimulus actually slowed the recovery by pulling huge amounts of money out of the economy and letting the government redirect it into idiot projects and special interests. And, of course, there was squirrelly accounting at every turn to make this disaster look better. For example, a contractor I know who does concrete got parts of three contracts for barrier walls on local interstate highways then under construction. He hired 3 new workers, but the government counted them as 9 because they were on three projects / contracts. Weirdly, the work he was to do was scheduled out further in the future in any case so all the stimulus did was move up the finish date. It didn't add anything to the economy, but it did spend money borrowed now for money that would have been available in the future. And, the 3 workers were laid off once the contracts were complete.



      How do you figure that?



      I think come January we'll see his lowering of taxes actually increased revenues or was close to revenue neutral through economic expansion and additional taxes paid by people now employed and companies doing more stuff. Yes, higher taxes can actually lower revenues.



      I think on this issue Obama overall did less. For example, Holder ended many sector's catch and hold programs where any illegal caught crossing got tossed in jail until they went to trial and were then deported. Holder made them go back to catch and release. That is, they get caught, arraigned. are released in the US to await trial, and they never bother to show up. Then there was "Fast and Furious."
      Janet "Nappy" Napolitano was particularly bad as Secretary of Homeland security. Remember her? On the whole, a complicit MSM helped sweep all of the Obama administration's lapses on security and border control under the rug.


      btw did you not notice I included a statement about spending more wisely. Btw even conservatives are starting to say we did not spend enough. But that a whole other line of research and thought.

      well last year we went from 500 ish defeict to around 700 to 800 b defeciet with the prediction for breaking 1 trillion next year.

      btw most of your post is irrelevant since did I not say something about not wanting to defend Obama

      Sure he screwed up just not as much as Trump has .

      Trump would of been better being in office in 08 than now his policies are more geared towards a down turn

      On the otherhand Obama would of been better to be president in 12 or now.

      Granted until we understand what is drivintg wage stagnation we are screwed. It takes two years below 5 percent unemployement for wages to start to move up is a wtf

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